Winger or creative second striker

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby account deleted by request » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:26 pm

Now it seems we have our new striker almost sorted, who should we go for next? We could sign a winger Malouda, Mancini or Simao, or we could go for a creative second striker (unless Rafa sees Torres playing that role? )

I would prefer the creative second striker myself, even though we appear to have an abundance of strikers at the moment, and seem light on the wings. Tevez is the one out there at the moment that we could perhaps get, he has reasonable pace, great movement and can finish. I haven't seen much vision from him but thats not to say he doesn't have it. Players of this quality only rarely become available, while good wingers seem to become available as soon as you mention money.(big money   :D  )

I would prefer signing Tevez this season even if it meant no new wingers, (we can get them next year) and I am not thrilled anyway by the wingers we are rumoured to be interested in, hopefully by next season we may have a better choice at more reasonable prices to choose from.


              Reina

Finnan   Carra   Agger     Aurelio

Pennant Gerrard Mascherano Kewell

                Tavez
                     Torres

Obviously Gerrard could again cover for Pennant, with Riise/Leto covering for Kewell.

While that lineup may be a little too aggressive for Rafa, it would get plenty of goals and by shuffling Gerrard out to the right (I know), and bringing Alonso in to the centre we have solidity(keep Rafa happy), but also retain our goal threat.

It also eases the problem of introducing too many players into the team at once, as we would only have 2 new players, with Leto and Lucas coming in for LC games etc.
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Postby Graeme Noble » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:29 pm

If we get a top quality winger, then sign a winger. But none of this mediocre stuff. Because if we cannot get our hands on quality in the wing plays then we should sign a quality second striker instead.
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Postby Leonmc0708 » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:39 pm

Who the funk is Tavez ?
JUSTICE FOR THE 96

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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:45 pm

Leonmc0708 wrote:Who the funk is Tavez ?

We couldn't afford Tevez, but Tavez is much cheaper    :D
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Postby stmichael » Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:56 pm

Realistically, Benayoun will arrive now as he can play in either position. Infact, I think it's pretty much nailed on to happen.
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Postby Bad Bob » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:00 pm

Well, mate, if David Prentice at the Echo is right, Benitez (or is that Big Mick? :D ) wants Torres to be the creative second striker, with Kuyt as the primary goal scorer:

_

Benitez and Torres can answer one another’s prayers

Jun 30 2007

by David Prentice, Liverpool Echo


MAY 23, 2007, was a black day in the history of Liverpool Football Club. But it was worse for Fernando Torres.

While the Reds’ dreams of a sixth European Cup success died by the narrowest of margins in Athens, Torres was recovering from “the worst moment, without doubt” of his Atletico Madrid career.

Barcelona had just effectively wrecked Atletico Madrid’s UEFA Cup hopes with a humiliating 6-0 win in the Vicente Calderón Stadium – and Torres was approaching a turning point in his career.

“Never have I experienced something like that,” he declared. “It is a match to forget, one that has absolutely no positives at all. It has been a very long weekend.

“It’s been difficult to sleep, to go out into the street. I’m sure time will heal, but to me, three days later, it does not go out of my head.”


Story continues Continue story
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Two-and-a-half thousand miles across Europe, Rafa Benitez was also enduring a sleepless night.

And his words in the wake of that Champions League final defeat perhaps hinted at what was on his mind.

"Some players even playing isolated up front can change the game,” he said. “They can receive the ball, dribble, pass, and they can change the game.

“I hope I will get the backing. When you see the players working as hard as they did today maybe it's not enough. When you want to get close to (Manchester) United and Chelsea and have another chance in the Champions League you need to go maybe two steps at a time."

It was almost as if Benitez had a mental image of Torres while he was talking – a player, who plays up front on his own for Atletico. A talented individual who can receive the ball, dribble like an old-fashioned winger and pass with vision.

And their experiences meant the two seemed destined to unite.

Liverpool have craved an out-and-out goalscorer since Michael Owen left for Spain in 2004. Torres is not that man – even though his goals return is a respectable 62 in 143 La Liga appearances over four seasons, plus 14 in 42 internationals.

But Dirk Kuyt is, and while he has diligently and uncomplainingly played much of his football outside the penalty area at Anfield to make room for Crouch and Fowler, Torres’ impending arrival could see a return to the role he filled for Feyenoord.


Liverpool officials said yesterday they were “very confident” Torres would be at Anfield next season.

The Reds have had to tip toe delicately through negotiations, as Torres’ relationship in Madrid is at almost Messianic proportions.

Atletico still hope to persuade the player to remain in Spain and kick off their Intertoto Cup campaign on July 21.

But it seems that home humbling by Barcelona convinced Torres his future lay elsewhere.

His departure will cause widespread grief in one half of Madrid.

Torres made his debut for Atletico in 2000 and was immediately earmarked as something special.

He won the Best Young European Player award after top scoring at the Nike Cup Europe in 1999, in 2000/01 he was top scorer and player of the tournament at the European Under-16 Championships and 12 months later top scored again at the European Under-19 Championships, won by Spain.

Drawing comparisons with Wayne Rooney, he became the youngest player to play for Atletico, the youngest goalscorer, and the youngest to play for the Spanish national side.

In 2003 he was made captain of the club at the ridiculously tender age of 19, although he later said: “19 is too young to captain the team and shows the lack of patience at Atletico.”

Chelsea tried to sign him at the end of the 2005-06 La Liga season, but he opted to stay put.

At his first ever appearance in a World Cup finals in Germany, Torres scored the final goal in Spain’s 4-0 victory over Ukraine.

In the second group match, Torres scored twice against Tunisia, was dropped from the team for a friendly against Romania in November 2006, but returned to the national side for the friendly against England in February.

Ironically, Torres suffered an ankle injury in training with the national team before their summer fixtures in Riga and Vaduz.

To replace him, Spanish coach Luis Aragonés called up an RCD Espanyol forward named Luis Garcia to replace him.

Now, it seems, another Luis Garcia could be replacing Torres at club level at the Vicente Calderon.

Personal terms and a medical still have to be arranged, but sources inside Anfield are “confident” the move will go through.

And Reds fans should be confident they are recruiting one of the brightest talents in European football.
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:07 pm

Bad Bob wrote:Well, mate, if David Prentice at the Echo is right, Benitez (or is that Big Mick? :D ) wants Torres to be the creative second striker, with Kuyt as the primary goal scorer:

_

Benitez and Torres can answer one another’s prayers

Jun 30 2007

by David Prentice, Liverpool Echo


MAY 23, 2007, was a black day in the history of Liverpool Football Club. But it was worse for Fernando Torres.

While the Reds’ dreams of a sixth European Cup success died by the narrowest of margins in Athens, Torres was recovering from “the worst moment, without doubt” of his Atletico Madrid career.

Barcelona had just effectively wrecked Atletico Madrid’s UEFA Cup hopes with a humiliating 6-0 win in the Vicente Calderón Stadium – and Torres was approaching a turning point in his career.

“Never have I experienced something like that,” he declared. “It is a match to forget, one that has absolutely no positives at all. It has been a very long weekend.

“It’s been difficult to sleep, to go out into the street. I’m sure time will heal, but to me, three days later, it does not go out of my head.”


Story continues Continue story
ADVERTISEMENT

Two-and-a-half thousand miles across Europe, Rafa Benitez was also enduring a sleepless night.

And his words in the wake of that Champions League final defeat perhaps hinted at what was on his mind.

"Some players even playing isolated up front can change the game,” he said. “They can receive the ball, dribble, pass, and they can change the game.

“I hope I will get the backing. When you see the players working as hard as they did today maybe it's not enough. When you want to get close to (Manchester) United and Chelsea and have another chance in the Champions League you need to go maybe two steps at a time."

It was almost as if Benitez had a mental image of Torres while he was talking – a player, who plays up front on his own for Atletico. A talented individual who can receive the ball, dribble like an old-fashioned winger and pass with vision.

And their experiences meant the two seemed destined to unite.

Liverpool have craved an out-and-out goalscorer since Michael Owen left for Spain in 2004. Torres is not that man – even though his goals return is a respectable 62 in 143 La Liga appearances over four seasons, plus 14 in 42 internationals.

But Dirk Kuyt is, and while he has diligently and uncomplainingly played much of his football outside the penalty area at Anfield to make room for Crouch and Fowler, Torres’ impending arrival could see a return to the role he filled for Feyenoord.


Liverpool officials said yesterday they were “very confident” Torres would be at Anfield next season.

The Reds have had to tip toe delicately through negotiations, as Torres’ relationship in Madrid is at almost Messianic proportions.

Atletico still hope to persuade the player to remain in Spain and kick off their Intertoto Cup campaign on July 21.

But it seems that home humbling by Barcelona convinced Torres his future lay elsewhere.

His departure will cause widespread grief in one half of Madrid.

Torres made his debut for Atletico in 2000 and was immediately earmarked as something special.

He won the Best Young European Player award after top scoring at the Nike Cup Europe in 1999, in 2000/01 he was top scorer and player of the tournament at the European Under-16 Championships and 12 months later top scored again at the European Under-19 Championships, won by Spain.

Drawing comparisons with Wayne Rooney, he became the youngest player to play for Atletico, the youngest goalscorer, and the youngest to play for the Spanish national side.

In 2003 he was made captain of the club at the ridiculously tender age of 19, although he later said: “19 is too young to captain the team and shows the lack of patience at Atletico.”

Chelsea tried to sign him at the end of the 2005-06 La Liga season, but he opted to stay put.

At his first ever appearance in a World Cup finals in Germany, Torres scored the final goal in Spain’s 4-0 victory over Ukraine.

In the second group match, Torres scored twice against Tunisia, was dropped from the team for a friendly against Romania in November 2006, but returned to the national side for the friendly against England in February.

Ironically, Torres suffered an ankle injury in training with the national team before their summer fixtures in Riga and Vaduz.

To replace him, Spanish coach Luis Aragonés called up an RCD Espanyol forward named Luis Garcia to replace him.

Now, it seems, another Luis Garcia could be replacing Torres at club level at the Vicente Calderon.

Personal terms and a medical still have to be arranged, but sources inside Anfield are “confident” the move will go through.

And Reds fans should be confident they are recruiting one of the brightest talents in European football.

I would be happy to settle for that Bob, I wasn't sure if Rafa had taken up my suggestion to play Torres as second striker, it appears he may have   :D

Can't say I am thrilled at Benayoun signing for us StMike, but he can carry the ball forward well, but rarely scores, and seems another lightweight.
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Postby stmichael » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:13 pm

s@int wrote:Can't say I am thrilled at Benayoun signing for us StMike, but he can carry the ball forward well, but rarely scores, and seems another lightweight.

To be honest, he had a very good first season with West Ham if I remember correctly. Ok last season wasnt as good, but that was for a few circumstances (like playing around a bunch of prima donnas who thought they just needed to turn up on the pitch).

I remember the FA Cup final. He was top class, and we genuinely couldnt handle him. He would be a good squad player, and a good asset for us in some games (just like Garcia).
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Postby Bad Bob » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:16 pm

stmichael wrote:
s@int wrote:Can't say I am thrilled at Benayoun signing for us StMike, but he can carry the ball forward well, but rarely scores, and seems another lightweight.

To be honest, he had a very good first season with West Ham if I remember correctly. Ok last season wasnt as good, but that was for a few circumstances (like playing around a bunch of prima donnas who thought they just needed to turn up on the pitch).

I remember the FA Cup final. He was top class, and we genuinely couldnt handle him. He would be a good squad player, and a good asset for us in some games (just like Garcia).

Agreed.  I think he'd be a useful lad to have on the bench.  If nothing else he, Torres and a fit Kewell would give us three very good ball carriers, which has been a deficiency we've had in the squad for some time.
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Postby Bad Bob » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:24 pm

s@int wrote:
Bad Bob wrote:Well, mate, if David Prentice at the Echo is right, Benitez (or is that Big Mick? :D ) wants Torres to be the creative second striker, with Kuyt as the primary goal scorer:

_

Benitez and Torres can answer one another’s prayers

Jun 30 2007

by David Prentice, Liverpool Echo


MAY 23, 2007, was a black day in the history of Liverpool Football Club. But it was worse for Fernando Torres.

While the Reds’ dreams of a sixth European Cup success died by the narrowest of margins in Athens, Torres was recovering from “the worst moment, without doubt” of his Atletico Madrid career.

Barcelona had just effectively wrecked Atletico Madrid’s UEFA Cup hopes with a humiliating 6-0 win in the Vicente Calderón Stadium – and Torres was approaching a turning point in his career.

“Never have I experienced something like that,” he declared. “It is a match to forget, one that has absolutely no positives at all. It has been a very long weekend.

“It’s been difficult to sleep, to go out into the street. I’m sure time will heal, but to me, three days later, it does not go out of my head.”


Story continues Continue story
ADVERTISEMENT

Two-and-a-half thousand miles across Europe, Rafa Benitez was also enduring a sleepless night.

And his words in the wake of that Champions League final defeat perhaps hinted at what was on his mind.

"Some players even playing isolated up front can change the game,” he said. “They can receive the ball, dribble, pass, and they can change the game.

“I hope I will get the backing. When you see the players working as hard as they did today maybe it's not enough. When you want to get close to (Manchester) United and Chelsea and have another chance in the Champions League you need to go maybe two steps at a time."

It was almost as if Benitez had a mental image of Torres while he was talking – a player, who plays up front on his own for Atletico. A talented individual who can receive the ball, dribble like an old-fashioned winger and pass with vision.

And their experiences meant the two seemed destined to unite.

Liverpool have craved an out-and-out goalscorer since Michael Owen left for Spain in 2004. Torres is not that man – even though his goals return is a respectable 62 in 143 La Liga appearances over four seasons, plus 14 in 42 internationals.

But Dirk Kuyt is, and while he has diligently and uncomplainingly played much of his football outside the penalty area at Anfield to make room for Crouch and Fowler, Torres’ impending arrival could see a return to the role he filled for Feyenoord.


Liverpool officials said yesterday they were “very confident” Torres would be at Anfield next season.

The Reds have had to tip toe delicately through negotiations, as Torres’ relationship in Madrid is at almost Messianic proportions.

Atletico still hope to persuade the player to remain in Spain and kick off their Intertoto Cup campaign on July 21.

But it seems that home humbling by Barcelona convinced Torres his future lay elsewhere.

His departure will cause widespread grief in one half of Madrid.

Torres made his debut for Atletico in 2000 and was immediately earmarked as something special.

He won the Best Young European Player award after top scoring at the Nike Cup Europe in 1999, in 2000/01 he was top scorer and player of the tournament at the European Under-16 Championships and 12 months later top scored again at the European Under-19 Championships, won by Spain.

Drawing comparisons with Wayne Rooney, he became the youngest player to play for Atletico, the youngest goalscorer, and the youngest to play for the Spanish national side.

In 2003 he was made captain of the club at the ridiculously tender age of 19, although he later said: “19 is too young to captain the team and shows the lack of patience at Atletico.”

Chelsea tried to sign him at the end of the 2005-06 La Liga season, but he opted to stay put.

At his first ever appearance in a World Cup finals in Germany, Torres scored the final goal in Spain’s 4-0 victory over Ukraine.

In the second group match, Torres scored twice against Tunisia, was dropped from the team for a friendly against Romania in November 2006, but returned to the national side for the friendly against England in February.

Ironically, Torres suffered an ankle injury in training with the national team before their summer fixtures in Riga and Vaduz.

To replace him, Spanish coach Luis Aragonés called up an RCD Espanyol forward named Luis Garcia to replace him.

Now, it seems, another Luis Garcia could be replacing Torres at club level at the Vicente Calderon.

Personal terms and a medical still have to be arranged, but sources inside Anfield are “confident” the move will go through.

And Reds fans should be confident they are recruiting one of the brightest talents in European football.

I would be happy to settle for that Bob, I wasn't sure if Rafa had taken up my suggestion to play Torres as second striker, it appears he may have   :D

:D

It does make sense, doesn't it?  Sabre said in the other thread that Torres seemed to play a lot deeper last season, with Kezmen and Aguero playing more in the box.  He'll be an asset for us in the deeper role, with his pace and dribbling.  I've not seen much of his passing game but hopefully he's got an eye for the deft pass as well.  If this is true, though, the onus shifts to Kuyt to show us he can bang them in up top.

So, maybe Tevez or even Tavez won't be on their way after all.  Michael Owen anyone?  (he says ducking and running for the exit :D )
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Postby whylongball? » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:26 pm

top winger is a must imho. There were times against the lesser teams we couldnt stretch them and deliver good crosses which i believe Crouch and Kuyt would capitalize
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Postby The Ace1983 » Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:31 pm

Really we need a player who can do both. If all goes to plan this week then we should be starting the season with Torres, Kuyt and Crouch. Even if Gerrard or Kewell play in supporting roles on occassion, this perhaps isn't enough. Then, if Gerrard or Kewell do this sort of role, our wings become very limited. Unfortunately, the sort of players who can work the wings, the attacking centre and up top usually come with very high price tags. Players like Ronaldinho, Schweinsteiger, Esposito would all fetch a bit and we probably won't have that kind of scratch. Youth might be the answer, and our scouts are at the Copa America no doubt particularly interested in this sort of player.

The answer may lie in some very shrewd deals and freebies. A Fowler-esque, older striker who might make the difference coming off of the bench would be ideal. Can't think of anyone off hand other than Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink and he doesn't have the right levels or attitude for my liking. But Rafa and the scouts know the market better than i do. Players who perform well in the league for lesser clubs can go cheaply at the right time so another answer might lie in that.

I'd also like to see our youth huys pick up the challenge. The Owens and Gerrards and Carraghers of this world didn't get where they are today by keeping the dugout tidy.

So, in short, I want Ronaldinho. It won't happen, but that doesn't stop me wanting him at Liverpool. Failing this, a player than can do more than one offensive job would be my choice.

Edit: Barca want rid of Giully and Gudjonson apparently. If their wage demands aren't too high, they might be worth a look.
Last edited by The Ace1983 on Mon Jul 02, 2007 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby red37 » Mon Jul 02, 2007 8:00 pm

Prentice = C**t
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Postby Bad Bob » Mon Jul 02, 2007 8:03 pm

red37 wrote:Prentice = C**t

How's that, mate?
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Postby LFC2007 » Mon Jul 02, 2007 8:08 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
red37 wrote:Prentice = C**t

How's that, mate?

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