Liverpool FC Forum

LFC1990 » Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:06 am wrote:If you look at games V Arsenal and Everton at home then our midfield was amazing The balance between Gerrard Hendo and Coutinho was perfect.
Then you look at games like Swansea where we lacked a bit of cover for our defence and Citeh and Chelsea away where the midfield was far too strong for ours and think it needs improvement.

I dont like saying we need players for our starting eleven as our eleven will change depending on opponents type strength but we still need that solid player in the middle of the park to hold on to leads or stop ourselves getting dominated against teams.

I would love it if we could somehow get Matuidi from PSG but i cant see that ahppening so Tiote would be a good back up

I'm not sure a new signing is required. I think we need a plan B for when we play teams that are willing to take the risk of committing midfielders beyond Henderson and Coutinho and overrun Gerrard. Swansea were a good example of that and we noticeably improved once Allen was brought on as extra midfield cover.

If Rodgers can find a formation whereby he fits in either Lucas or Allen to play alongside Gerrard in a defensive role then I think we will have an effective formation option for the sides that are willing to play an aggressive attacking midfield.

I actually think the player to give way in that sort of formation would be Sterling, as in the Swansea game.

For the most part I see us sticking with

                         Gerrard

        Henderson                  Coutinho

Sterling             Sturridge                Suarez


but in certain games, most likely away games -



              Gerrard        Lucas/Allen

                      Henderson

         Suarez                   Sturridge


This provides adequate midfield protection but would also require wide area support from the full backs. I suspect with Johnson back, having a capable attacking full back will help in this regard.

It's interesting how everyone else is saying, Gerrard is excelling in his new role and how brilliant he is, recently even pirlo was complementing him but our own fans think he hasn't adapted well to his new role...

maguskwt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:40 am wrote:It's interesting how everyone else is saying, Gerrard is excelling in his new role and how brilliant he is, recently even pirlo was complementing him but our own fans think he hasn't adapted well to his new role...

Pirlo just said he is intelligent enough to adapt, he never said he did it

kazza » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:58 am wrote:

maguskwt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:40 am wrote:It's interesting how everyone else is saying, Gerrard is excelling in his new role and how brilliant he is, recently even pirlo was complementing him but our own fans think he hasn't adapted well to his new role...

Pirlo just said he is intelligent enough to adapt, he never said he did it

I'm hoping he does... gerrard's long passing is perfect from the deep... It's an additional weapon for us especially with the likes of Suarez and sturridge who can trap the ball like magnet...sterling also benefits from this as he is quick.

Well it's essentially the holding role, used to be called anchor because it held it all down. Outside sources see us winning games and I suppose that's enough. But we dissect it more, and I suppose it's natural to think that since it's the midfield battle we lose, then it's down to Stevie. He's our best midfielder and captain, playing a vital controlling role.

As things are, we can't both control a game and counter attack. To do this, the opposition needs possession. Gerrard needs to press, yet he's also the one to make long passes to runners once possession is gained, thus triggering the counter attack. But as it is, Gerrards not good enough in the role to both close down, win possession, get his head up and play the pass. What he does instead is to win the ball, play it to a red, find space, look up, receive the ball and play the pass. It's too slow and somewhere in the mix we get closed down, or tackled, or they get men behind the ball.

On the other hand is Lucas, as Stu called him, the crab. He's better at pressing, has more energy, and is more commited to the role. But he always passes sideways, or backwards, or gives clumsy free kicks and picks up debilitating cards.

It's two different types of midfielder. It's rare you get them rolled into one, and so we need to sacrifice another player to accommodate.

kazza » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:58 am wrote:

maguskwt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:40 am wrote:It's interesting how everyone else is saying, Gerrard is excelling in his new role and how brilliant he is, recently even pirlo was complementing him but our own fans think he hasn't adapted well to his new role...

Pirlo just said he is intelligent enough to adapt, he never said he did it

It's clear it will take more than a few games but I back a player of Gerrard's quality to adapt to his new role. There has already been clear improvement, especially when you consider the way Gerrard was playing a couple months back to now.

Is he close to his best in this new role, definitely not. Will he make - i'd put money on it.

devaney » Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:18 pm wrote:Come on RBG a dodgy free kick and an even dodgier penalty and your apoplexy goes into critical overdrive. CALM DOWN! CALM DOWN!

I can assure you I am perfectly calm ,and have remained ensconced in a wave of tranquillity ( so you will be happy to know you find me in good health ) since leaving Anfield on Sunday ,but if any poster believes that display against Swansea was impressive in anything but the urgency to get ahead after conceding yet another equaliser, then they sit in a far more comfortable chair than I resided in on Sunday.

Whilst I'm sure you have many admirable qualities fella ,I must say you do possess this annoying habit for over exaggeration..... Apoplexy indeed 

RedAnt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:14 pm wrote:
On the other hand is Lucas, as Stu called him, the crab. He's better at pressing, has more energy, and is more commited to the role. But he always passes sideways, or backwards,

although i'm sure we could improve on lucas for the starting 11, i think he should remain as a valuable member of the squad. it amazes me though how often this lazy and completely incorrect stereotype is trotted out.

andy_g » Thu Feb 27, 2014 3:32 pm wrote:

RedAnt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:14 pm wrote:
On the other hand is Lucas, as Stu called him, the crab. He's better at pressing, has more energy, and is more commited to the role. But he always passes sideways, or backwards,

although i'm sure we could improve on lucas for the starting 11, i think he should remain as a valuable member of the squad. it amazes me though how often this lazy and completely incorrect stereotype is trotted out.

Lazy? I rate Lucas as a squad player. My opinion on how creative he is, how good he is at launching counter attacks can be found in more detail in the 'Lucas' thread. I'm too lazy to dig it up for you. I guess you are too.

there's nothing to dig up. the lazy cliche that lucas only passes sideways or backwards is trotted out regularly in match threads, in this thread, in the lucas thread and probably even in the fit girls thread.

andy_g » Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:32 pm wrote:

RedAnt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:14 pm wrote:
On the other hand is Lucas, as Stu called him, the crab. He's better at pressing, has more energy, and is more commited to the role. But he always passes sideways, or backwards,

although i'm sure we could improve on lucas for the starting 11, i think he should remain as a valuable member of the squad. it amazes me though how often this lazy and completely incorrect stereotype is trotted out.

A crab would be quite an upgrade in all honesty. The lad is a nothing player and its this acceptance of players of this complete lack of quality that has gotten us into the situation we currently find ourselves in (just to be clear, the situation that we haven't qualified for the champions league in a number of years). The lad is a distinctly average midfielder who contributes very very little to the side.

People bang on about his "tackles per game" ratio like its incredible, but the fact is that Coutinho and Gerrard since playing centrally and becoming more accustomed to their roles in the side are now putting in more tackles and interceptions on average per game than Lucas was "at his best".

The fact is, Lucas isn't particularly good at anything. He keeps possession well (on occasion at the expense of attacking intent), he also gives 100% and is a good professional. Apart from that, brings absolutely nothing else to the table.

He's another player in the starting eleven who you could replace with around 75% of the players in the league and be absolutely no worse off.

Lucas should stay but only as a squad player. He seems to be well liked by everyone and having him around would be good for morale. We definitely need to upgrade but I wouldn't wanna see him leave the club unless a very good offer comes in for him. As I've mentioned before, Sissoko from Newcastle would be a great addition.

I would also like to see more of Joe Allen. He's really good and the midfield looks so much better with him in it.

andy_g » Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:06 pm wrote:there's nothing to dig up. the lazy cliche that lucas only passes sideways or backwards is trotted out regularly in match threads, in this thread, in the lucas thread and probably even in the fit girls thread.

If you'd actually read what I was saying, and read what I'd said elsewhere, you'd realise the hypocrisy of the words 'lazy' and 'stereotype'.

Lucas is not a player to break up play, look up, and play killer long balls, or shrewd through balls that will unlock defences, or trigger counter attacks. Lucas plays safe (if we can call it that). Gerrard is the playmaker who can make those passes. They're different players and bring different things to the table. Lucas is ok by me. He works hard and he's loyal. His ability is limited. Why is it when someone says that, they end up with all this lazy stereotype talk? That's just lazy and stereotypical.

RedAnt » Thu Feb 27, 2014 5:17 pm wrote:

andy_g » Thu Feb 27, 2014 4:06 pm wrote:there's nothing to dig up. the lazy cliche that lucas only passes sideways or backwards is trotted out regularly in match threads, in this thread, in the lucas thread and probably even in the fit girls thread.

If you'd actually read what I was saying, and read what I'd said elsewhere, you'd realise the hypocrisy of the words 'lazy' and 'stereotype'.

Lucas is not a player to break up play, look up, and play killer long balls, or shrewd through balls that will unlock defences, or trigger counter attacks. Lucas plays safe (if we can call it that). Gerrard is the playmaker who can make those passes. They're different players and bring different things to the table. Lucas is ok by me. He works hard and he's loyal. His ability is limited. Why is it when someone says that, they end up with all this lazy stereotype talk? That's just lazy and stereotypical.

Put it this way, most championship midfielders/league one midfielders could probably give Lucas a go on their day.

Lets have it right ,Gerrard pops the ball up field  better than Lucas and he's a veritable wizard at set plays ,but If the only job Lucas does is to stop
teams running through us like a bowl of Special K then he's sorely missed.....I personally would like to have seen us slightly more methodical ,rather
than this game of chance we're currently playing...... Strikers are playing well though.

When Rodgers first joined he attested to above all else retaining to his  philosophy of keeping the ball and playing a high intensity pressing game
similar to the ways adopted by Barcelona and the Spanish National side ..... It just I always thought Pirlo was Italian.