Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:47 ampeewee wrote:well its not the first time you have blamed me for everything so no sleep will be lost on that front
I don't blame you for the rain....that's nature
I don't blame you for the rain....that's nature
Liverpool FC Forum
Liverpool Football Club Discussion
https://www.liverpoolfc-newkit.co.uk/
Who or what is to blame
https://www.liverpoolfc-newkit.co.uk/liverpool-fc-forum/who-or-what-is-to-blame-t26464-15.html
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Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:47 amI don't blame you for the rain....that's nature
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:47 amI understand that for someone who has been a red for more than 30 years, winning is a must. I became a red in 1989 and I haven't known those glory years. In the uni years Liverpool wasn't placed where I'd like.
The blame of those poor results were probably that the club as a business didn't grow as Manchester did, and probably some poor managers too.
For me Rafa Benitez has the blame of recovering part of the glory Liverpool used to have. When I joined this forum the media talked about the top 3, leaving Liverpool aside of it. That wound me up big time.
Why haven't Liverpool recovered ALL the glory we'd like to see, i.e, winning the league again? Because unfortunately the Manchester team wasn't asleep in the nineties, and they grew economically a lot. We were some way off them and it's difficult to compete with such power. For instance it's reported that they want a keeper from Villareal, worse than Reina, and they're ready to pay 30M for them. Which is something we couldn't pay for someone unless he was our absolute primary target.
So the blame of not winning the league, which is what I think you ask in the thread, are :
* Less income than other clubs
* Liverpool came from a position which was very distant from winning the league. We were nowhere near winning it in year 2001.
The blame of recovering part of it's glory
* Rafa Benitez and World Class players that surround the local world class player Gerrard
* Best support of Europe.
The blame of those poor results were probably that the club as a business didn't grow as Manchester did, and probably some poor managers too.
For me Rafa Benitez has the blame of recovering part of the glory Liverpool used to have. When I joined this forum the media talked about the top 3, leaving Liverpool aside of it. That wound me up big time.
Why haven't Liverpool recovered ALL the glory we'd like to see, i.e, winning the league again? Because unfortunately the Manchester team wasn't asleep in the nineties, and they grew economically a lot. We were some way off them and it's difficult to compete with such power. For instance it's reported that they want a keeper from Villareal, worse than Reina, and they're ready to pay 30M for them. Which is something we couldn't pay for someone unless he was our absolute primary target.
So the blame of not winning the league, which is what I think you ask in the thread, are :
* Less income than other clubs
* Liverpool came from a position which was very distant from winning the league. We were nowhere near winning it in year 2001.
The blame of recovering part of it's glory
* Rafa Benitez and World Class players that surround the local world class player Gerrard
* Best support of Europe.
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:48 ampeewee wrote:Ok, quite simple this one and it will no doubt start a few squabbles.
I am not going to give an opinion, although no doubt some will see my lack of comment as blaming it on rafa or kuyt, but to make it clear, I am offering no opinion on this whatsoever, I am more interested in seeing where the posters think the blame lies, or maybe they say there is no blame, just Utd are too good, no doubt the money spent argument will come up, buts let see if we can reach some consensus.
so the question, who or what is to blame for us not winning any trophies for the past three seasons.
Fire away.........................................
You of course lash
.To be honest mate i think were going over old ground abit here ,but i can see your after some debate so i'll give my two penneth .
It's obviously a number of factors ,not one single person or thing .
So rafa's partly to blame ,because he's the manager and makes the decisions .
The playing squad over the course of the season's has not been strong enough to compete on all fronts (somewhat rectified last season ) . Whilst we've gone pretty well in the champions league ,we havent be strong enough in the league until last season .
The owners and there running of the club have had (it's only the way i see it pee lad ) a terrible effect on the general moral of the club as a whole . Playing staff and baxkroom staff , from top to bottom .
Funds are not as easily available to compete for the top players as they are with other members of the top 4 imo .
Tacticts . Rafa has made some strange decisions in the past , but i think finally he has come to terms with the premier league . Still got to love him though ,right .
That'll do for now lash.
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:48 ampeewee wrote:actually the two threads are very different, even an idiot would see that from reading it
Only because this thread has taken a different route and developed into a whole new sphere of conversation....
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:49 amIgor Zidane wrote:peewee wrote:Ok, quite simple this one and it will no doubt start a few squabbles.
I am not going to give an opinion, although no doubt some will see my lack of comment as blaming it on rafa or kuyt, but to make it clear, I am offering no opinion on this whatsoever, I am more interested in seeing where the posters think the blame lies, or maybe they say there is no blame, just Utd are too good, no doubt the money spent argument will come up, buts let see if we can reach some consensus.
so the question, who or what is to blame for us not winning any trophies for the past three seasons.
Fire away.........................................
You of course lash
To be honest mate i think were going over old ground abit here ,but i can see your after some debate so i'll give my two penneth .
It's obviously a number of factors ,not one single person or thing .
So rafa's partly to blame ,because he's the manager and makes the decisions .
The playing squad over the course of the season's has not been strong enough to compete on all fronts (somewhat rectified last season ) . Whilst we've gone pretty well in the champions league ,we havent be strong enough in the league until last season .
The owners and there running of the club have had (it's only the way i see it pee lad ) a terrible effect on the general moral of the club as a whole . Playing staff and baxkroom staff , from top to bottom .
Funds are not as easily available to compete for the top players as they are with other members of the top 4 imo .
Tacticts . Rafa has made some strange decisions in the past , but i think finally he has come to terms with the premier league . Still got to love him though ,right .
That'll do for now lash.
at last a sensible post
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:51 amsupersub wrote:peewee wrote:actually the two threads are very different, even an idiot would see that from reading it
Only because this thread has taken a different route and developed into a whole new shere of conversation....
well the two questions are very different.
1. who will we blame when our potential signings are going elsewhere?
2. who or what is to blame for us winning nothing the past 3 seasons?
Now correct me if I am wrong but they are two completely different questions
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:52 amI blame Rafa for not taking us as far as we could have have / should have....
I blame the owners for causing unrest in our dressing room and off the pitch...
I blame Parry ... for very diffferent reasons to everyone elses mind you ... more to do with our finances but wont go into that now
I blame the owners for causing unrest in our dressing room and off the pitch...
I blame Parry ... for very diffferent reasons to everyone elses mind you ... more to do with our finances but wont go into that now
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:57 amOne of the less controversial reasons (hopefully)........ We have concentrated on progressing in the Cl to the detriment of our domestic competitions.
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:58 ampeewee wrote:supersub wrote:peewee wrote:actually the two threads are very different, even an idiot would see that from reading it
Only because this thread has taken a different route and developed into a whole new shere of conversation....
well the two questions are very different.
1. who will we blame when our potential signings are going elsewhere?
2. who or what is to blame for us winning nothing the past 3 seasons?
Now correct me if I am wrong but they are two completely different questions
It's your same old rant you have used over and over again,worded slightly different..but it is still the same bleating peewee
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:59 ampeewee wrote:actually the two threads are very different, even an idiot would see that from reading it
I think Dr Freud may have had something to say about individuals of a certain type that feel an over-reaching need to apportion blame and responsibility...
As for the reasons? Bad luck in part, poor decisions at times, individual errors that have cost us dearly, strong competition etc
Its disappointing, but not that unusual for big clubs to go 2,3 years without winning (even a cursory glance at the big4 will tell you that
.
Its best not to get too neurotic about it, and get behind the team in the upcoming season eh?
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:00 amI just want to know when Liverpool Fans started looking to blame anyone they can for not winning something instead of just saying "the club as a whole just werent up to the tak and must improve" . When did it become norm to have something or someone to blame ?!?
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:01 amsupersub wrote:peewee wrote:supersub wrote:peewee wrote:actually the two threads are very different, even an idiot would see that from reading it
Only because this thread has taken a different route and developed into a whole new shere of conversation....
well the two questions are very different.
1. who will we blame when our potential signings are going elsewhere?
2. who or what is to blame for us winning nothing the past 3 seasons?
Now correct me if I am wrong but they are two completely different questions
It's your same old rant you have used over and over again,worded slightly different..but it is still the same bleating peewee
I would rather you explain why these two questions are the same rather than gloss over your misconception.
the fact is they are two very different questions, in fact one is past and one is future based on very different criteria.
Ho hum, no doubt if one of the forum blue eyed boys posted it you would deem it worthy of debate. like i said no skin off my my nose, at least a few sensible posters can see it for what it it
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:02 amI blame him .... He's the mother of all problem ...
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:02 amDrPepe wrote:peewee wrote:actually the two threads are very different, even an idiot would see that from reading it
I think Dr Freud may have had something to say about individuals of a certain type that feel an over-reaching need to apportion blame and responsibility...
As for the reasons? Bad luck in part, poor decisions at times, individual errors that have cost us dearly, strong competition etc
Its disappointing, but not that unusual for big clubs to go 2,3 years without winning (even a cursory glance at the big4 will tell you that
.
Its best not to get too neurotic about it, and get behind the team in the upcoming season eh?
so rafa blaming the backroom staff and firing 16 people was not due to blame for failures. Do you think he just accepts the past three seasons failures or apportions blame?
Posted: Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:03 amGYBS wrote:I just want to know when Liverpool Fans started looking to blame anyone they can for not winning something instead of just saying "the club as a whole just werent up to the tak and must improve" . When did it become norm to have something or someone to blame ?!?
Probably when they got their leagues.
Glory has a price. When you win things you inevitably attract bandwagon supporters, and you inevitably have the pressure of winning more and more. That's unavoidable.