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I disagree with rafa - Epl analysis based on flawed premise..
Posted:
Tue May 15, 2007 9:27 pmby sgs
What wins the league is your performance, away from home especially against the mid-rung teams...Dropping points to Blackburn, Bolton, Portsmouth, even Shef. Utd, will hurt your chances of winning the title, esp. with the top-4 able to cancel each other out....
A fast start IMO is overrated. Everyone will drop points, especially as strength of teams continue to narrow between the top-4 and mid-table teams.
Its a marathon not a sprint. Consistency against mid-level teams, esp. in those tough winter months will win u the title...
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Meanwhile, Benitez believes Liverpool can challenge for the Premiership next term.
While the Spaniard has inspired Liverpool to Champions League and FA Cup wins in his time at Anfield, he has yet to launch a serious assault on the league.
However, he knows that, if his team can take more points from the top teams, they could be contenders next year.
"I am happy we finished third - it was the same as last season - but obviously we want to go better than that next season," he said.
"We aim to be contenders and we know we must improve, especially in our away form.
"I feel, though, that it is maybe only one or two games that make the difference. When you play against Manchester United, Chelsea and Arsenal you must beat them.
"If we can achieve improved results against the best sides, that will make us much closer to the top of the table.
"I have said all along that we are a better squad, but other teams also spend money on new players and we must try also to improve the team.
"We must be closer and we must be contenders."
http://home.skysports.com/list.as....ld+play
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 12:21 amby mungi
In Rafa i trust
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 12:24 amby The Manhattan Project
It was the early away games. We seemed scared.
We have you believe that we are going to muller teams, regardless of where we play them.
Attack constantly against the mid-low level teams.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 12:51 amby LFC2007
I think Rafa is well aware that we need to do better away from home full stop. This man is football non-stop, it's not as if he believes our poor performance in league is solely down to doing badly against the top four, he knows that is just one area where we need to improve. It can sometimes be hard to make a judgement on what a manager or player has said without knowing what question he was asked.
Although beating the top four can be important if you want to win the league, it's not the be all and end all. It's about having the ability to go into auto winning mode against mid table sides where we have failed consistently this season. To put it in nutshell, it's been our away form where we have not been able to do a clinical job like Man U and Chelsea have done against the lesser teams. Our home form has generally been excellent but I still feel we need to be more ruthless and dispatch teams by three or four goals, on occasions it has taken us until the 60th minute before we score e.g. vs Man city. The danger is that these slender victories turn into draws. I would cite the match against Portsmouth as being one where we failed to unlock their stubborn defense, this lack of creativity when teams sit deep is something Man U and Chelsea have managed to master.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 9:58 amby DazH-
You say its a marathon, not a sprint, but ever since Abramovich went to Chelsea its been turned into a sprint the whole way through, with 90+ points usually now required to win the title.
Rafa must be careful who he signs this summer, quality players are great and all, but if they're not consistent enough they won't solve our problems, rafa must sign players that will perform week in, week out
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 10:05 amby kunilson
Yeah Chelsea certainly did up the stakes, but i think the max.points needed to win will level out again to around 85.....1st year Chelsea won they had 95 points, next time 91 points, manure won it with 89 points this season....notice anything? all this talk of the big 4 is true, they are seperate from the rest but the pack are getting more results against the big 4. Which is good for competition....and it makes every game important not just the big "gladiator/judgement day/apocalaypse" weekends when the big 4 face off..
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 10:12 amby el_stinger
World Cup didn't help our chances.
We don't have a deep enough, great talent pool of players we can rely on to give the others a break. It was a long feeeckin season with the WC in the summer break. That has to be THE factor of why we did so shiite at the start of the season.
I think another reason why our players failed to gel at the start of the season is that we waited too long to acquire players. The quicker we can get them at the club, the better and easier they will gel. You can't bring in a player right before the season starts and expect him to gel instantly with the rest of the playing group.
We got no disruptions now. This break after the CL final will see us hopefully bringing in more players of great standard, and earlier. Next season we really should make a serious dent in challenging for the title. I would expect us to be within 6 points come end of season.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 10:30 amby SouthCoastShankly
Our form changed when Rafa stopped his rotation policy. The key to next season is to start with a stable base, the same core team, then as the season progresses we start to rotate players.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 10:46 amby Forever_Red
[quote]In Rafa i trust [/QUOTE
its not as simple as just saying in rafa i trust, in future please say why you think he can do it for us
We have to improve away from home, totally agree with southcoastshankly on the issue of rotation as well, ease it into the season rather than having every player fearing for their place
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 11:18 amby Sabre
It's interesting that meanwhile most fans think that the EPL title challenging is up to winning the not big teams, Rafa comes out with just the opposite, stressing that games like the Manchester United at Anfield should be won.
It's a fact that if in that game, in which BTW Liverpool was better but wasn't effective, LFC got a victory, LFC would have 3 points more and Manchester UNited 3 less.
But not only that, and I think it's what Rafa means: that are the kind of victories that makes the weaker opposition to treat you with too much respect or fear, and that kind of victories give you the momentum to win lots of games afterwards. So Rafa might have a point. When you look at the points of Spanish Liga first teams, and you look at the EPL teams points, it seems obvious the less powerful teams do not put as much opposition as in Spain, so it might be a good idea to win those big games to earn that respect.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 11:38 amby woof woof !
We "dropped" 17 points against the other teams in the top six.
Man U - 6
Chelsea - 3
Arsenal - 3
Tottenham - 0
Everton - 5
If we had managed to win all those games we would have finished on 83 points, 2nd to Man U on goal difference with Chelsea in third on 80 pts .
I understand Rafa's take on beating your closest rivals as it not only gives you points in the bag but also prevents your rivals from getting away from or overtaking you. However , it counts for naught if having taken points off the teams closest to you ,you then give away points to the likes of 'Boro, Man City, Blackburn, Villa etc etc , as we constantly do .
OOP'S GOT MY MATHS WRONG , IF WE'D TAKEN THOSE 17 POINTS WE WOULD HAVE WON THE LEAGUE , FINISHING ON 85 PTS
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 12:56 pmby zarababe
woof woof ! wrote:We "dropped" 17 points against the other teams in the top six.
Man U - 6
Chelsea - 3
Arsenal - 3
Tottenham - 0
Everton - 5
If we had managed to win all those games we would have finished on 83 points, 2nd to Man U on goal difference with Chelsea in third on 80 pts .
I understand Rafa's take on beating your closest rivals as it not only gives you points in the bag but also prevents your rivals from getting away from or overtaking you. However , it counts for naught if having taken points off the teams closest to you ,you then give away points to the likes of 'Boro, Man City, Blackburn, Villa etc etc , as we constantly do .
OOP'S GOT MY MATHS WRONG , IF WE'D TAKEN THOSE 17 POINTS WE WOULD HAVE WON THE LEAGUE , FINISHING ON 85 PTS
Good analysis Woof -where dya get it 
Interesting how Fegie said that staying with chelsea from the beggining was the aim - not giving them the 'sprint start' already mentioned in this thread.
Vital we do the same - stay with the pack and sustain wins and results against those u mention 
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 1:19 pmby Big Niall
We really need to focus on getting off to a good start. Ferguson drummed that into his players. The days when a team can get a bad start and then come back and win the league are gone as winning teams don't drop that many points any more, -if Manu had won their last 2 games (when league already won) they'd have got 94 points (I think) from just 38 games, when the won in 1993, they got 84 points from 42 games.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 1:33 pmby Owzat
woof woof ! wrote:We "dropped" 17 points against the other teams in the top six.
Man U - 6
Chelsea - 3
Arsenal - 3
Tottenham - 0
Everton - 5
Arsenal topped the head to head between the top four with the mancs second, Chelsea third and us fourth
Arsenal P6 W3 D2 L1 PTS 11
Man Utd P6 W2 D2 L2 PTS 8
Chelsea P6 W1 D4 L1 PTS 7
Liverpool P6 W2 D0 L4 PTS 6
Our away form was four wins worse than last season and we lose all away games against the rest of the top four under Rafa so that hasn't gotten worse. The worst thing was not winning away to any of Fulham, Portsmouth, Newcastle, Middlesboro, Blackburn, Bolton, Everton, Sheffield United, Man City and Aston Villa. Maybe some decent sides in there but not to win any is pretty feeble
The telling stats are that we conceded as many goals as the mancs but they scored TWENTY SIX goals more than us. No prizes for anyone who puts two and two together and gets four.
Posted:
Wed May 16, 2007 5:57 pmby yckatbjywtbiastkamb
Big Niall wrote:We really need to focus on getting off to a good start. Ferguson drummed that into his players. The days when a team can get a bad start and then come back and win the league are gone as winning teams don't drop that many points any more, -if Manu had won their last 2 games (when league already won) they'd have got 94 points (I think) from just 38 games, when the won in 1993, they got 84 points from 42 games.
i totally agree, you have got to get off to a flier because within 3 or four games you can be 6 points behind, and just keeping pace with these teams is hard enough never mind gaining on them.
another point is by keeping pace with them you put them under pressure, and teams under pressure make mistakes.
look at united, when they had a decent cushion they were cruising but once chelsea started to catch up united definately faultered.
they lost at portsmouth, were lucky not to concede a penalty at home against sheff united who they scraped past and against everton at 2-0 down they`d basically thrown in the towel, you could see it in the body language of their players, it was only a horrendous howler by the everton keeper that ignited their self belief again.
a good start is vital imo.