Liverpool FC Forum

by **Thommo's perm** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:17 am

Benny The Noon wrote:Either way it goes they were both our most successful managers since Kenny and miles ahead if the previous two managers - they both had their faults , they both made incorrect signings and hey both messed up and in the end neither could deliver the Holy Grail - Rafa delivered the next best thing .

And both got sacked for losing the plot
Correct

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:26 am

Actually previous manager didn't get sacked :;):

by **Thommo's perm** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:32 am

Benny The Noon wrote:Actually previous manager didn't get sacked

Sorry
Left by mutual agreement
(that he had lost the plot)
:laugh:

by **In and Out** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:36 am

Benny The Noon wrote:Either way it goes they were both our most successful managers since Kenny and miles ahead if the previous two managers - they both had their faults , they both made incorrect signings and hey both messed up and in the end neither could deliver the Holy Grail - Rafa delivered the next best thing .

Agreed.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:40 am

Lost the plot or was given no assurances on a transfer budget - ie there wasn't one without selling players - IMO if we had a transfer budget and Rafa was given money then he would still be manager . Can't see where he lost the plot - he must of been doing something right to get given one of the best club jobs in Club Football .

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:41 am

In and Out wrote:
Benny The Noon wrote:Either way it goes they were both our most successful managers since Kenny and miles ahead if the previous two managers - they both had their faults , they both made incorrect signings and hey both messed up and in the end neither could deliver the Holy Grail - Rafa delivered the next best thing .

Agreed.

Is that a first

by **Thommo's perm** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:50 am

Benny The Noon wrote:Lost the plot or was given no assurances on a transfer budget - ie there wasn't one without selling players - IMO if we had a transfer budget and Rafa was given money then he would still be manager . Can't see where he lost the plot - he must of been doing something right to get given one of the best club jobs in Club Football .

Of course he did something right. He won the CL and the fa cup. And err...thats it
From then on he went backwards as you have already pointed out.
If he was still manager he could have done even worse damage. I personally wouldnt have given him any more money to spend as he didnt even acknowledge he had fu'cked up big time on transfers. Please dont tell me about Reina and Torres. I am talking about his numerous flops.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:00 am

Oh well have to agree to disagree to save going over the same old ground and going round in circles

by **Penguins** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:02 am

We will just have to see if Rafa lost to plot last season or if maybe the main reason was he wasn't backed in any way by looking at Roy this season.

If we qualify for the CL this season under Roy I'll hold up my hands and admit I was wrong and say Rafa lost the plot.

BUT!

If we end up 6-8th in the league I'll say Rafa had an impossible mission from the start and was severly undermined to take the club further.

Just amazing how clueless some fans are when it comes to the simple connection MONEY=TROPHIES;NO MONEY= NO
TROPHIES

When will that get through some people's heads?

The manager has lost the plot cause he isn't winning any trophies....no matter if all off a sudden all backing to the manager is gone and our rivals strengthen. Better to live in dreamland and have unrealistic demands... :no

by **bigmick** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:18 am

Rafa and Roy are operating under different circumstances though surely? I'm not making excuses in advance here, because I'm extremely confident our new manager will improve upon the 7th place team he has inherited, but it is a fact nontheless.

Lets look at it:

Rafa had a team full of players which after six seasons you could could hope were both his players, and knew exactly what was required of them. Not only that, but he would have been familiar with every professional at the club, had a chance to establish a rapport with them and know what made them tick. He will have been privvie to all the reports off the various coaching staff members. Roy is having to deal with a bunch of players who weren't his first choices. Those players in most cases have never met Roy before, and have no idea of his philosophy and character.

Rafa was able to tempt players with the lure of Champions League football. This applies to both players we already have, and players we are looking to sign. Roy is only able to tempt players with Europa League Cup football. Even this is only because Portsmouth had about five dodgy owners last season. We didn't actually qualify for any competition in Europe, as we finished 7th in the league and bombed out of all the cups.

Rafa over his tenure had much more money to spend than Roy has as of now. I'm not going to get into explaining it, some numpty will dispute the numbers anyway if you bother putting them up, but it's a fact and we all know it.

Rafa had Steven Gerrard at his absolute lung busting peak, Jamie Carragher too. Both players would probably admit themselves that these days they aren,t quite up to that level.

Rafa didn't have to compete with moneybags Man City and a decent manager. Nor did he have to compete for long with Spurs and a decent manager. Come to that, the Man Utd team this season is better than the one last season too IMHO.

Roy has lost Masherano through no fault of his own, the player already wanted away. This has meant he has made a profit in transfers. When you add in the fact that he has also seen another 20 million pound midfielder (not my valuation obviously) disappear without any money coming in, then you realise what he is up against.

Roy has a harder job than Rafa ever had. He inherited a dispirited squad, many of whom wanted away. He inherited a club with no money. Fortunately for us, he has handled himself brilliantly and fought fires left right and centre. The very people who slagged him off before he came can't or won't see it yet, but he has done a fantastic job so far :buttrock

.

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:28 am

I'm guessing this thread is no longer about Houllier then . As for current manager - he has a long way to go yet and he will be judged on performances on the pitch mainly in the prem and at the moment it's not good enough but hopefully it will change .

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:31 am

Ps don't forget that the previous manager also took over a dispirited squad 35 points behind he winners and lost it's best striker and prob spent less in that first summer or around the same and was able to win the CL and get to the final of another cup

by **jacdaniel** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:56 am

I hate when people talk about not winning trophies for 4 years.
Would anyone really substitute the CL final or semi for a Carling cup?

by **Bermenstein** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:11 am

Houllier and Big nose re-united if Villa job is confirmed- Click for Article

by **Bad Bob** » Tue Sep 07, 2010 11:13 am

They're both gone, folks. Let it go.

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