Liverpool FC Forum

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:43 pm

tonyeh wrote:Far from it Beergoggles.

Benitez' insistance on a single striker will mean that Torres will ALWAYS be getting the shit kicked out of him regardless. Even if Liverpool had a decent backup.

Playing a single striker alone, against the defence...it's a joke.

One of the things that drives me mad about Benitez.

Even with another striker for support are you actually saying that Torres would not receive the same treatment, surely even you... with your relentless denigration of Rafa must see that given Torres would be the focal point of our attack he would still suffer injuries

Regardless of who was supporting him in our attack

by **tonyeh** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:44 pm

LFC2007 wrote:Yeah, so much of a joke that we utilised it in our best Premier League season ever.

It ONLY works when Gerrard'n'Torres FC are firing on all cylinders.

by **only me** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:50 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:
only me wrote:If Rafa wanted to protect Torres ,really protect him - then he should have signed a decent counterpart striker to Torres ,our manager placed all the pressure physical and mental on a sole single striker and this is the price you pay for such incompetence.

Torres is a target to any physical defence not only as he is a top class player but also because he is our single biggest threat to the team ,if Rafa would have reduced the pressure by bringing decent strikers he wouldn't have been knocked so much.

Same goes to Stevie which suffered continues injuries ,this is the price you pay for not bringing talented players to support your stars.

Heard the F*cking lot now ,its benitez's fault that Torres is injured so much

You want me to spoon feed you?

If all your attack is based on one single player be it Torres or anyother player for that matter ,a player that needs to withstand the aggressive play of EPL ,add to it the europe cups and others then YES he is bound to get injured.

NO rafa didn't kick Torres in the knee ,but he sure as hell didn't build a squad that would better balance and protect players physics and endurance.

1 PLus 1 it's not rocket science.

by **account deleted by request** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 5:51 pm

Considerably less I would imagine RBG. Instead of having two cb's kicking lumps out of him, he would only have one,while the other is occupied kicking his partner. He could pass the ball rather than having to hold it up. Defenders would be less likely to commit to the tackle as he would have someone to pass to ect ect

The truth is though, most of his injuries haven't been caused by players kicking him (maybe his knee?), but because he is a player like you say that uses his pace, and suffers the niggles and hamstring injuries that most "flyers" suffer.

In the short term he is big and brave enough to cope with the bumps and bruises, its in the longer term that I worry.

by **tonyeh** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 6:14 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:
tonyeh wrote:Far from it Beergoggles.

Benitez' insistance on a single striker will mean that Torres will ALWAYS be getting the shit kicked out of him regardless. Even if Liverpool had a decent backup.

Playing a single striker alone, against the defence...it's a joke.

One of the things that drives me mad about Benitez.

Even with another striker for support are you actually saying that Torres would not receive the same treatment, surely even you... with your relentless denigration of Rafa must see that given Torres would be the focal point of our attack he would still suffer injuries Regardless of who was supporting him in our attack

Not if a second striker was emplyed, or even if teh midfield follwed through on the ball, getting bodies in to the box.

Sure, probably the main focus would still be on Torres, but using a second striker would force the defence to split their attention.

Having Torres (or any striker) alone guaruntees that lumps will be kicked out of him, especially when they have to pick up EVERY attack, because the midfield don't follow through on the ball. Which has been one of the problems with Liverpool.

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 6:37 pm

s@int wrote:Considerably less I would imagine RBG. Instead of having two cb's kicking lumps out of him, he would only have one,while the other is occupied kicking his partner. He could pass the ball rather than having to hold it up. Defenders would be less likely to commit to the tackle as he would have someone to pass to ect ect

The truth is though, most of his injuries haven't been caused by players kicking him (maybe his knee?), but because he is a player like you say that uses his pace, and suffers the niggles and hamstring injuries that most "flyers" suffer.

In the short term he is big and brave enough to cope with the bumps and bruises, its in the longer term that I worry.

In theory Saint but in reality it has to be said Torres would be singled out as the main threat and dealt with as such no matter who halved his burden ,but like you I worry about his eventual burn out if he has to grind along with this strategy of playing a solo striker ,lets hope next season the inclusion of a player who may take some of the pressure of this talented young players shoulders pays dividends in regards to his overall well being ..

by **LFC2007** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 6:40 pm

s@int wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:Yeah, so much of a joke that we utilised it in our best Premier League season ever.

I can't argue that it didn't work mate, the only thing I question is will it affect or shorten Torres career ?

That depends on how much ground he's covering because it seems that most of his injuries have been muscle strains through fatigue and what have you. I just think that being an explosive striker will always make him more susceptible to those sorts of injuries whether he plays with a partner or not.

I would actually prefer to see a 4-4-2, not because it would reduce Torres' chances of getting injured (if it would) but because I think the team would be better for it.

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 6:51 pm

only me wrote:You want me to spoon feed you?

Let me think......... if I am to be fed a consistent diet of the literal bile you regularly feed people ,then if that is the case ,then no I think I will decline your offer :laugh:

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:06 pm

tonyeh wrote:Not if a second striker was emplyed, or even if teh midfield follwed through on the ball, getting bodies in to the box.

Sure, probably the main focus would still be on Torres, but using a second striker would force the defence to split their attention.

Having Torres (or any striker) alone guaruntees that lumps will be kicked out of him, especially when they have to pick up EVERY attack, because the midfield don't follow through on the ball. Which has been one of the problems with Liverpool.

Liverpool have had many problems this season , no one is disputing the fact but to firmly and categorically blame Benitez for all of the above even the injuries ,is ridiculous..... to find a competent striker to play alongside Torres is no easy task ,(Take Keane for eg )but to further be told you have little or no funds to bring in the quality needed then it becomes a thankless task

by **ironman** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:17 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:
tonyeh wrote:Not if a second striker was emplyed, or even if teh midfield follwed through on the ball, getting bodies in to the box.

Sure, probably the main focus would still be on Torres, but using a second striker would force the defence to split their attention.

Having Torres (or any striker) alone guaruntees that lumps will be kicked out of him, especially when they have to pick up EVERY attack, because the midfield don't follow through on the ball. Which has been one of the problems with Liverpool.

Liverpool have had many problems this season , no one is disputing the fact but to firmly and categorically blame Benitez for all of the above even the injuries ,is ridiculous..... to find a competent striker to play alongside Torres is no easy task ,(Take Keane for eg )but to further be told you have little or no funds to bring in the quality needed then it becomes a thankless task

would you blame keane on his failure or rafa for not giving him proper gametime to getting the best out of a talented player for sure?? are players like sniejder and samual eto out of our ball park?? 15 mill sniejder to inter and eto was 20 mill as part of the deal with the big swedish guy who plays for barca... not trying to spell his name..lol.. if rafa was more than happy to go with lucas, which has been the case all season and will be next season again... why buy aquaman for 20 mill?

?

by **redhayesy** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 9:16 pm

game aside, i was really impressed an moved by the minuites silence before the game & the banners on the kop! the next few days are the worst for me as a survivor an will as always pray for the families,loved ones & friends of our 96 brothers & sisters. they are always in my thoughts.

the Fulham fans were respectfull aswell in the minuites silence, credit to them for that.

by **tonyeh** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 9:53 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:but to firmly and categorically blame Benitez for all of the above even the injuries

I'm not doing that. I don't think anyone is "blaming" Benitez for injuries.

However he can be criticised for his extreme short sightedness and inflexiblity.

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 10:10 pm

redhayesy wrote:game aside, i was really impressed an moved by the minuites silence before the game & the banners on the kop! the next few days are the worst for me as a survivor an will as always pray for the families,loved ones & friends of our 96 brothers & sisters. they are always in my thoughts.

the Fulham fans were respectfull aswell in the minuites silence, credit to them for that.

My heart goes out to you Red, a few of the Lads attended and witnessed the tragic events unfold and they came back different people and the 15th of April is always a day of remembrance and prayers offered up to the families that lost loved ones .

Everything changed that day, peoples perspective on the importance of football drastically altered ,it is on such solemn occasions such as these on the 15th that fans can remember our lost brothers and sisters

R.I.P The 96

by **algymoon** » Wed Apr 14, 2010 5:30 pm

Owzat wrote:
s@int wrote:
NANNY RED wrote:FOR THE ATTENTION OF ANYONE WHO THINKS RAFA RESTED TORRES,

from rafa:

"Fernando Torres has gone to see a specialist and we are waiting to see what the results are."

For anyone who doesn't believe we will get fourth place......

From Rafa :

"I guarantee we will get fourth place"

touche

I think a lot of people doubt the Torres injury because Rafa is so FOS. Apparently he needs to be taken off after 60 minutes against brum but then plays near enough 90 in midweek before not playing yesterday. He might have an injury, all the doubt is because Rafa alienates fans

Terrible result, drawing at home to midtable mediocrity which is where we're heading. What do you do when your topscorer is injured, leave out your second topscorer and indeed start with none of the three scorers and key influences from the game against Benfica.

I haven't compared this season with others for a while, that is the first time we haven't won game 34 in the Premiership under Rafa by the way, but it is rather ominously like his first season in charge.

38 game Premiership seasons - points after 34 games (and final position)

47 (98/99) : P34 W13 D8 L13 F60 A44 PTS 47 (finished 7th)
50 (03/04) : P34 W13 D11 L10 F48 A36 PTS 50 (finished 4th)
54 (04/05) : P34 W16 D6 L12 F48 A35 PTS 54 (finished 5th)
56 (09/10) : P34 W16 D8 L10 F54 A33 PTS 56
58 (02/03) : P34 W16 D10 L8 F51 A36 PTS 58 (finished 5th)
59 (00/01) : P34 W17 D8 L9 F60 A37 PTS 59 (finished 3rd)
59 (97/98) : P34 W16 D11 L7 F58 A37 PTS 59 (finished 3rd)

Just for information, we lost away to a relegated side in the last four games of 04/05 and couldn't beat boro at home. Comparisons I've made with 02/03 remain strong, we had kept 14 clean sheets by the 34th game as we have this season

Rafa's is the most wired LFC manger that I ever seen or heard of,!! Rafa's guarantee for securing 4th spot, it has now expired before its maturity, he has been promising all season that his negative team style of play will improve, win this and that, but the bad performances, and bad results do not lies, where in fact it had been indicating the extend of the damage that this lousy idiot of a manger that he really brought to this great club. He has lost the plot totally not only this season, the previous four seasons too, the players are not responding to his wired and negative tactics, and there are quite numbers of his former players were actually criticising his wired and negative style of club management. His latest joke is !!!! He wants form the his idiots employers to give him another £60M to go and spend it new players, the likes of Aquilani, Lucas, Degen, Dosenna, Skrtel, Riera, Aurelio, Leto, etc, whereas, he had already wasted £200M on unknown below average players through out his time as LFC manager !! THIS IDIOT WILL NOT WIN THE LEAGUE FOR ANOTHER 10 YEARS IF HE REMAIN IN CHARGE OF LFC, despite spending £600M, and LFC will eventually end in league one to their first example of Leeds United, that is where our club is really heading if this idiot will continue to speak of a lot of :censored:

.
I just wish that some decent new owner come in and safe this great club from the present disaster and first official action the new owner ought to take to sack this idiot at once. I am quite certain that the previous owner David Moors must be everyday regrets the day he had decided to appoint this idiot as LFC manager, he had caused so much damage to LFC, it is beyond believe, and his beloved fans will not find out about this fact, until the LFC is in two divisions below, and that is not far from reality to happen.

by **Owzat** » Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:19 pm

tonyeh wrote:
RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:but to firmly and categorically blame Benitez for all of the above even the injuries

I'm not doing that. I don't think anyone is "blaming" Benitez for injuries.

However he can be criticised for his extreme short sightedness and inflexiblity.

I'm fed up with the selectivity of his facts and associated actions. Torres needs a rest, but only when it fits nicely into Rafa's plans. Rafa doesn't make a substitution until the 64th minute onwards yet when it suited Rafa's defence of a substitution then it was necessary, but when next game he plays the full 90 minutes it must be different.

re one up front, it is bound to have an adverse effect. Torres becomes the sole target for the defenders, negate him by foul means or foul or even foul or even more fouling than they should get away with, and you blunt our attack. You also have a hard time persuading quality strikers to come with the prospect of Torres being #1 in a one slot show, those that might come won't stay long if they are on the bench all the time. What hacked me off most is not even using Kuyt in Torres' absence, he might not be perfect or everyone's favourite but he scores more goals than most. He's risen to the occaision enough times when called upon, better than many on here will admit.

So no it isn't Rafa's direct fault that Torres is injured, but he puts him in the situation where he will suffer injuries. Now there's no Crouch about, Keane's come and gone and Kuyt is out wide where is the support? Second choice striker is between RM and N'Gog, Nemeth out on loan and noone else trusted

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