Liverpool FC Forum

by **account deleted by request** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:51 pm

bavlondon wrote:
Fauxy wrote:I wish Torres could take free kicks... it would make him the best player in the world imo.

Dammit Torres your such a let down.

He doesn't even like taking penalties does he? Makes his scoring record all the more amazing.

Judging by the way he took his only penalty for us, I don't think he would have added too many goals mate

Strange really how players who are deadly with the ball in open play can't knock it in from 12 yards. Owen was another who missed as many as he scored from the spot.

by **dawson99** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 8:57 pm

Maybe its heart over head but Torres is nowhere near Fowler and Rush for me... maybe if he stopped the diving and the getting injured he would be, but gimme Fowler in his prime anyday (sorry)

by **LFC2007** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:11 pm

s@int wrote:Judging by the way he took his only penalty for us, I don't think he would have added too many goals mate

Strange really how players who are deadly with the ball in open play can't knock it in from 12 yards. Owen was another who missed as many as he scored from the spot.

I could never work that one out either. Same goes for corners and freekicks to a certain extent.

by **tubby** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:15 pm

dawson99 wrote:Maybe its heart over head but Torres is nowhere near Fowler and Rush for me... maybe if he stopped the diving and the getting injured he would be, but gimme Fowler in his prime anyday (sorry)

Maybe not yet but if he continues to score at the rate he is doing now it won't be long before some consider them on par. In terms of ability though I think he is up there with Fowler.

by **dawson99** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:18 pm

oh yeah if he continues for sure hes at least on apar, but its too soon for me to be saying hes near the legends we have had

by **tubby** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 9:24 pm

One thing is for sure though, in terms of the current game he is the best out and out striker there is. Messi plays all over the place so I don't him but in his position there is no one better around imo.

by **metalhead** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:01 pm

I disagree with saint and) regarding's torres' weakness as a passer, one prime example is his assist last season to keane against PSV in the CL, or his accurate cross that Gerrard dived in to score the 2nd goal against bolton back in 2009. He actually has a bit part of everything for me, pace, finishing, tackling. Marking (yes a good one in defending set pieces), heading (brilliant), power, and first touch. He reached 50 league goals more than any Liverpool player and that explains a lot. He is physically world class that's why he can't be bullied alot.

I think he is in another category to be honest and potentially can be one of the best strikers Liverpool had

by **metalhead** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:05 pm

dawson99 wrote:Maybe its heart over head but Torres is nowhere near Fowler and Rush for me... maybe if he stopped the diving and the getting injured he would be, but gimme Fowler in his prime anyday (sorry)

Right and fowler never dived? Comon mate everyone dives its part of the game now and we can't do anything about it

by **tubby** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:06 pm

metalhead wrote:I disagree with saint and) regarding's torres' weakness as a passer, one prime example is his assist last season to keane against PSV in the CL, or his accurate cross that Gerrard dived in to score the 2nd goal against bolton back in 2009. He actually has a bit part of everything for me, pace, finishing, tackling. Marking (yes a good one in defending set pieces), heading (brilliant), power, and first touch. He reached 50 league goals more than any Liverpool player and that explains a lot. He is physically world class that's why he can't be bullied alot.

I think he is in another category to be honest and potentially can be one of the best strikers Liverpool had

And his pass to Stevie at West Ham last season, or his cheeky backheel to Stevie in the derby FA Cup game last season.

by **account deleted by request** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:29 pm

metalhead wrote:I disagree with saint and) regarding's torres' weakness as a passer, one prime example is his assist last season to keane against PSV in the CL, or his accurate cross that Gerrard dived in to score the 2nd goal against bolton back in 2009. He actually has a bit part of everything for me, pace, finishing, tackling. Marking (yes a good one in defending set pieces), heading (brilliant), power, and first touch. He reached 50 league goals more than any Liverpool player and that explains a lot. He is physically world class that's why he can't be bullied alot.

I think he is in another category to be honest and potentially can be one of the best strikers Liverpool had

I will make allowances for your youth Metalhead

Rush started his career at Chester as a midfield player and later on was a very decent second striker for both Fowler and Collymore, inbetween times he was also the best striker we have ever had . Whether Torres will change that one day is still well into the future in my opinion mate.

by **account deleted by request** » Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:42 pm

I saw these on RAWK and thought they were exceptional

by **maguskwt** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:59 am

I was an Owen fan and used to think he received a bit of unfair criticism because of his enthusiasm to play for England and because of his transfer to Madrid (no longer think so after he joined the mancs). I have never seen a simple and cool finish that Owen possesses in one-on-one situations nor the blistering pace to outrun defenders, nor his positioning and timing of his runs to beat the off-side traps. He was a modern incarnation of Insaghi with speed. The team was actually carried by him for most of his stay with us because admit it, our team under Houllier was terrible. The FA cup final against Arsenal was single-handedly won by him. When Torres first arrived in his first season start bagging in goals alot on here say that he was better than Owen. I wasn't convinced because Torres still had alot to prove. But now I can confidently say that he is a better striker than Owen simply because he has qualities of Owen and also qualities that Owen doesn't have. Like some said on here he is actually a mixture of Fowler (instinctive and natural) and Owen (speed, calculative and cool finishing). IMO he has already surpassed both of them. Whether he is as good as Rushie or Kenny, let's not compare, the decades are too far off. I would say though that he has the qualities to match them.

by **Kerry07** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:56 am

maguskwt wrote:I was an Owen fan and used to think he received a bit of unfair criticism because of his enthusiasm to play for England and because of his transfer to Madrid (no longer think so after he joined the mancs). I have never seen a simple and cool finish that Owen possesses in one-on-one situations nor the blistering pace to outrun defenders, nor his positioning and timing of his runs to beat the off-side traps. He was a modern incarnation of Insaghi with speed. The team was actually carried by him for most of his stay with us because admit it, our team under Houllier was terrible. The FA cup final against Arsenal was single-handedly won by him. When Torres first arrived in his first season start bagging in goals alot on here say that he was better than Owen. I wasn't convinced because Torres still had alot to prove. But now I can confidently say that he is a better striker than Owen simply because he has qualities of Owen and also qualities that Owen doesn't have. Like some said on here he is actually a mixture of Fowler (instinctive and natural) and Owen (speed, calculative and cool finishing). IMO he has already surpassed both of them. Whether he is as good as Rushie or Kenny, let's not compare, the decades are too far off. I would say though that he has the qualities to match them.

Good summary.

I love Fowler, great finisher, never thrashed at the ball, but he was limited technically, average at build up play, not the most mobile, factors as why he never did anything at national level. Hes loved more than Owen because hes a local lad, a scouser, one of us, a great personality... who loves the club.

Owen had more attributes, a better goalscoring record, the highest PL conversion rate of 32% in 2001/02, could drift out wide and skin people, and between 1997-1999 was ridiculously good... in a god awful side. Problem was he was an outsider, an altar boy, personality of a wooden leg, and he always had one eye on England.

The explosive speed Owen had (allied with his low centre of gravtity) meant there was no-one quicker over short bursts, and his finishing was deadly. After becoming a star of World Cup '98, at St.James Park in August 1998, where he ran from midfield and blitzed past 3 defenders to secure his hat trick, we had the most valuable player in world football. Everytime he got the ball he ran at people, and destroyed them 9 times out of 10. I have tapes from this period and he does it routinely. IF IF IF Houllier hadn't overplayed him while his body was still growing (and took a leaf out of whiskey nose book with his careful protection of Giggs in his teens) then Owen would have gone on to be one of the all time greats. He ripped his hamstring at Elland road in April 1999 after umpteen games carrying us.. major surgery, out until September, and a succession of injuries followed continually weakening his ligaments/hamstring... explosiveness gone, and then he started to pass it to people rather than take it on himself. Its the reason why he was physically shot at 25, barely kicked a ball since.

He may have won the Euro player of the year in 01, and skinned the ancient Adams/Dixon in Cardiff who could barely walk... but the Owen in 97-99 was at his physical peak, and injury robbed him of a phemonenal career.

by **metalhead** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 8:20 am

s@int wrote:
metalhead wrote:I disagree with saint and) regarding's torres' weakness as a passer, one prime example is his assist last season to keane against PSV in the CL, or his accurate cross that Gerrard dived in to score the 2nd goal against bolton back in 2009. He actually has a bit part of everything for me, pace, finishing, tackling. Marking (yes a good one in defending set pieces), heading (brilliant), power, and first touch. He reached 50 league goals more than any Liverpool player and that explains a lot. He is physically world class that's why he can't be bullied alot.

I think he is in another category to be honest and potentially can be one of the best strikers Liverpool had

I will make allowances for your youth Metalhead Rush started his career at Chester as a midfield player and later on was a very decent second striker for both Fowler and Collymore, inbetween times he was also the best striker we have ever had . Whether Torres will change that one day is still well into the future in my opinion mate.

I know how great Rush was, but I'm just saying your argument on Torres' passing is b*llox

However, I agree, Torres has the POTENTIAL to become one of our top 5 strikers of all time

by **dawson99** » Sat Apr 10, 2010 8:23 am

metalhead wrote:
dawson99 wrote:Maybe its heart over head but Torres is nowhere near Fowler and Rush for me... maybe if he stopped the diving and the getting injured he would be, but gimme Fowler in his prime anyday (sorry)

Right and fowler never dived? Comon mate everyone dives its part of the game now and we can't do anything about it

Diving is worse than ever, and our two best players are the worst perpetrators of it. Yeah Fowler dived a bit, but nothng compared to what lads get up to nowadays in ALL teams

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