Sack him. if you want the manager sacked - ...put your thoughts in here.

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby Igor Zidane » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:25 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:
Lando_Griffin wrote:
bigmick wrote:I don't think you are desperate to know Lando, but in my opinion there have been a few errors of judgement by the manager. Firstly, I think before the season started our pre season campaign didn't prepare the team correctly and I don't think we've ever really recovered. I think it was a mistake to not sign credible striker cover before the season started, and I think the hugest error which has had the most effect was thinking that Lucas and Masherano would be ample as a central midfield pairing while Aquilani recovered. I think the signing of Aquilani was misguided, and I think a perfectionist such as Rafa would be hugely disappointed that each and every time we defend a set piece we are a shambles. I don't know precisely what he has done in terms of bonding, team building, motivation and the rest but it has clearly not been a success because far too often we have lain down and died in games, showing a complete lack of fight.

Other than that, he has been bang on the money.

Striker - money.

Pre-season - what didn't you like about it? There was nothing wrong with the games, we just didn't get players back in time and we lost too many - nothing wrong with the planning.

Who would you have signed instead of Aqualani?

There wasn't a lot wrong with team spirit last season - what makes you think it's the manager's fault now? Why is it never something else? Why is it ALWAYS Rafa that's to blame?

Do you think he's a sorcerer?

Lando do you actually believe everything you write or is it just because you have been backing the manager so staunchly for so long you feel you have to justify everything ?

Preseason was a shambles, we were nowhere near prepared correctly for what was always going to be a very difficult opening fixture.
Rafa seems to look long term ignoring or maybe not ignoring but not paying enough attention to the short term.
The Atletico madrid game was the only time he let any of the players play more than a half.
Thats not enough, we looked unfit for the first few weeks of the season as Rafa seems to worry about being fit at the end of the season.
By then though we are out of the league anyway.

The Aquilani signing was probably a mistake, we are halfway through the season and have seen nothing.
Rafa knew his injury record and that he was injured when signed so it was always a gamble.
Its an even bigger gamble if your two other options are not great with distributing the ball and dictating the tempo of games like Alonso was.
Who he should of signed is blatantly obvious - the player he coveted before hand, Gareth Barry.

The players have been awful this season, thats not Rafa's fault but he hasnt helped sticking with a system that doesnt work that well without Alonso and when Torres is injured.

I like the fact that you stick by the manager but think at times you appear to defend things just because you feel like you have in the past.

Pre-season was a shambles and rafa is not entirely blameless as it's his job to prepare the players ok . The commercial dept ,Ayre  organised the trip to the far east and in my honest opinion our pre-season tour and all the travelling that that entailed did not help the situation . Torres being on international duty with albert and alonso (before they left lfc) mascherano and lucas being on international duty all contibuted to our poor pre-season . As well as the usual Rafa's sh!te , poor man management ,poor tactician blah blah blah guff.
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Postby Ciggy » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:27 pm

Lets get things straight here once and for all, Liverpool cannot afford to sack Rafa as they dont have the 20 million pounds it would cost.

So people can rant and rave all they like but the simple fact is the club is skint, and if they take out another bank loan to pay him off you and me will be paying for his 20 million pound sacking.
There is no-one anywhere in the world at any stage who is any bigger or any better than this football club.

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REST IN PEACE PHIL, YOU WILL NEVER BE FORGOTTEN.
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Postby Benny The Noon » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:28 pm

exactly saint . While rafa is most certainly at fault in some areas this season he is not fully to blame for our poor season so far but some quite happily lump it all on him , there is many other factors that get ignored easily as it doesnt fit in with the target of blaming the manager for everything and using it as a stick to beat him with and want him sacked . Yes this is the anti rafa thread and its going to be said in here but does it need to be said in every thread ? He was even getting the blame for the match getting called off ? !
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:41 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:exactly saint . While rafa is most certainly at fault in some areas this season he is not fully to blame for our poor season so far but some quite happily lump it all on him , there is many other factors that get ignored easily as it doesnt fit in with the target of blaming the manager for everything and using it as a stick to beat him with and want him sacked . Yes this is the anti rafa thread and its going to be said in here but does it need to be said in every thread ? He was even getting the blame for the match getting called off ? !

I am pretty sure it was Rafa's fault mate. He wouldn't lend Kuyt to the council to pull the gritting wagon :D
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Postby Ben Patrick » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:43 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:Pre-season was a shambles and rafa is not entirely blameless as it's his job to prepare the players ok . The commercial dept ,Ayre  organised the trip to the far east and in my honest opinion our pre-season tour and all the travelling that that entailed did not help the situation . Torres being on international duty with albert and alonso (before they left lfc) mascherano and lucas being on international duty all contibuted to our poor pre-season . As well as the usual Rafa's sh!te , poor man management ,poor tactician blah blah blah guff.

Igor, lately i have no clue how to interperet your posts.

I guess this is another sarcy one ?

We had Spurs away on the opening day of the season, it was always going to be a tougth fixture yet all through preseason we chopped and changed the team and didnt get any sort of settled side going.
I was saying at the time that i didnt think it was good preperation.
The last 3 preseason friendlies i think we should have started our first 11 and then taken players off later that were tired. Not putting 2 total different sides out each half that include loads of fringe players that will be ignored anyway as soon as the season starts.
Sabre looks like a big lezzer
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Postby Ciggy » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:43 pm

From the horses mouth well not a horse but Ryan babel.

This video is in dutch but 2 minutes in he says Liverpool havent got the money to sack Rafa even if they wanted to.

http://www.sportweek.nl/voetbal....ar_Ajax
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Postby Judge » Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:57 pm

Ciggy wrote:Lets get things straight here once and for all, Liverpool cannot afford to sack Rafa as they dont have the 20 million pounds it would cost.

So people can rant and rave all they like but the simple fact is the club is skint, and if they take out another bank loan to pay him off you and me will be paying for his 20 million pound sacking.

gross misconduct would save us 20 million. however, rafas not done that.

i like the man alot, but results etc have not gone our way. performance has been poor, since the departure of alonso and arbeloa, and that we have to play lucas all the time.

we are like souness' team - pi'ss poor

last season was a revelation, but with too many draws, i seriously doubt rafa has the knowledge to take us further, when we couldnt break the likes of stoke city down and all the others we drew with, when we had so many chances to bury teams.

2 defeats all last season in the league and no league title, just shows that under current management we will never win the league. I get fed up with rafa saying we have quality and we must keep going, but that runs dry after a while when we are actually losing more on a regular basis.
where is this quality he talks of, when results speak differently.

the BUCK (not book) stops with manager, it always has done. perhaps its time for dalglish to hold the reigns again, then i reckon we would see an immediate response and turn around

imo
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Postby Igor Zidane » Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:08 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:Pre-season was a shambles and rafa is not entirely blameless as it's his job to prepare the players ok . The commercial dept ,Ayre  organised the trip to the far east and in my honest opinion our pre-season tour and all the travelling that that entailed did not help the situation . Torres being on international duty with albert and alonso (before they left lfc) mascherano and lucas being on international duty all contibuted to our poor pre-season . As well as the usual Rafa's sh!te , poor man management ,poor tactician blah blah blah guff.

Igor, lately i have no clue how to interperet your posts.

I guess this is another sarcy one ?

We had Spurs away on the opening day of the season, it was always going to be a tougth fixture yet all through preseason we chopped and changed the team and didnt get any sort of settled side going.
I was saying at the time that i didnt think it was good preperation.
The last 3 preseason friendlies i think we should have started our first 11 and then taken players off later that were tired. Not putting 2 total different sides out each half that include loads of fringe players that will be ignored anyway as soon as the season starts.

Not disagreeing with you ace .
UP THE PURPS !!!
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Postby Emerald Red » Mon Jan 11, 2010 3:25 pm

Espionage wrote:
bigmick wrote:Why would you want anyone to do that though Lando? Given that we have spent more both gross and net on players since Rafa arrived at Liverpool than Man Utd have, Surely the comparison wouldn't be favourable to our manager ??? Even since last season when we were four points behind them in second, they lost Christiano Ronaldo and Carlos Tevez and replaced them Michael Owen and Antonio Valencia at a net gain of 62 million pounds. We lost Alvarro Arbeloa and Xabi Alonso, replacing them with Glen Johnson and Alberto Aquilani, making a net slightly worse than break even.

When Rafa came, how many of our players would have made the Man United 11 or even the bench? You cant compare net spending from a given point in time. You have to look at the progression. You have probably heard the argument before. Maybe look at how many of our players would get in the squad now?

Our squad in 2004/2005
Gerrard in starting 11
Hyypia, Carragher and Alonso on the bench. They might make the 11 under some circumstances.

Our Squad now
Gerrard, Torres, Mascherano, Johnson, Reina
Yossi, Agger/Carragher on the bench

I think that shows quite a bit of an improvement.


Also I believe that Ronaldo is somewhat of an outlier, a freak amount of money, and they dont happen often. These kinds of crazy returns are not easy for Rafa, he could not throw 10-15m on a 17 y/o like Ronaldo. If we had that kind of financial strength we would not have hesitated with a certain 17 y/o by the name of Aguero. We were in, looking at him for ages before finally losing to Atletico Madrid because we didnt have the resources to take a punt and risk losing out.

Reasonable to assume then that we'd be closer to them than we currently are? I think so, no?

Beating them the last 3 times we played them, and finishing 3 points behind them last season? Again going back to comparing the squad now, to the squad back then, and factoring in our financial woes.... I think that Rafa has done pretty well.

You should post more.
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Postby roberto green » Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:16 pm

Ciggy wrote:From the horses mouth well not a horse but Ryan babel.

This video is in dutch but 2 minutes in he says Liverpool havent got the money to sack Rafa even if they wanted to.

http://www.sportweek.nl/voetbal....ar_Ajax

Ryan Babel would love Rafa to get sacked too I bet ya
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Postby roberto green » Tue Jan 12, 2010 7:17 pm

I don't know if this has been posted in another thread so I'll just put it here.I was quite surprised to see in the Daily Mirror this morning that John Aldridge has called for Rafa's head which was meant to be taken from an interview in NUTS magazine (I know says it all).I was going to put the article in here from the Daily Mirror so you can all read it,  but upon doing so I saw an article where John Aldridge has come out and totaly denied doing so here is the link

[url=http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Angry-Liverpool-legend-John-Aldridge-denies-calling-for-Anfield-manager-Rafa-Benitez-to-be
-sacked-article285191.html]http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news....91.html[/url]

Furious John Aldridge has angrily denied claims that he called for Liverpool to sack manager Rafa Benitez.

The former Anfield striker says he will take legal action over a lads' mag story which said that he lambasted Benitez, saying he "would've lost his job by now if he was at another top club" and that Aldo "could not see any way for Liverpool to finish in the top four".

Aldridge denied speaking to the magazine and says he has told key Liverpool employees that he was misquoted.

He said: "I can categorically say that I never spoke to Nuts Magazine. I certainly wouldn't say anything so inflammatory that Rafa should be sacked.
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Postby access » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:29 pm

Quote- They think its all over ...... it is now
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Postby Cool Hand Luke » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:40 pm

tick tock tick tock tick tock.......
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Postby teamleader1 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:54 pm

Is there even a scrap of doubt that Rafa should be on his way?
he is blinkered beyond belief and is proving beyond ANY doubt that he cant handle the current situation

He has totally lost the plot.

Please let me wake up to the Rafa sacked - King Kenny takes over headlines!
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Postby Red Hot Mama » Thu Jan 14, 2010 12:01 am

teamleader1 wrote:Is there even a scrap of doubt that Rafa should be on his way?
he is blinkered beyond belief and is proving beyond ANY doubt that he cant handle the current situation

He has totally lost the plot.

Please let me wake up to the Rafa sacked - King Kenny takes over headlines!

Oh God yes please
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