Liverpool FC Forum

by **Sir Roger** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:05 pm

shanklygates wrote:i agree actually tony, considering what we were meant to achieve this season, 4th place is now an absolute priority, out the prem race, out the CL, out the league cup. even if we do finish 4th it will just paper over the cracks of what has been a woeful season.

Some sense
:;):

by **Owzat** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 2:29 pm

Instead of him repeating his 'promise' that we will finish top four, perhaps he'd like to stick his neck on the line and say he'll go if we don't. Part of me says he has had all the chances to prove he can win the league and has failed, it took his 5th season to make a proper fist of a challenge and now we have gone back to where Rafa started. Maybe we'll suddenly mount a title challenge again next season, chances are that last season was the one-off and not this season. Should we gamble on keeping Rafa given how BAD we are right now?!? 10 wins in 24 matched by 10 defeats is awful for a supposed good side, even if you make the case that a key player or more were missing it emphasises the case that we won't win with Rafa in charge because we are too dependant on players who are going to get injured ie we can't rely on our best XI playing 38 games a season.

But I have faith, that many more defeats and he'll be on his way out. Finishing fourth may not take a big improvement in form, but he can't keep losing. He lost 14 league games in 04/05, we're one shy of halfway there with three games to go until halfway. The one 'consolation' that the Champions League won't distract us is countered by the unanswered question that is how Rafa will treat it. He may well play a second string to avoid not keeping his promise and not finishing top four

by **shawnk** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 3:15 pm

Actually, Rafa is predictable and the team wont suddenly become a team that would become Champion next season (not to mention the seasons after that).

- without the financial assistance to improve the team
- without good players to choose from (or now knowing the best way to use them)
- worse of all the players have probably lost confidence in him (rumors of losing the dressing room maybe true).
- for some reason they played so badly in the second half of the Arsenal game and he didn't know how to respond and the players weren't really motivated to respond as well. I'm pretty sure the older generation of Liverpool do their best to come back from behind

and so on.... but dont get me wrong, I like the man and I think he's a good manager but not for Liverpool and he has tried long enough. Maybe move him to another position in Liverpool or something after the end of the season or now to let Sammy/Kenny to care take.

At least, this will have the players to see a change or fresh start. Motivation or man management may be the key or at least one thing that can easily be improved.

by **Big Niall** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 3:36 pm

babu wrote:
Emerald Red wrote:
Big Niall wrote:So why can't LFC sack a manager mid season?

Do we have to sacrifice a season for some nobility?

Right now we don't have much to hold onto. Our history is fading and the americans are really working hard to destroy the way this club once behaved.

Let's not add to this by demanding that the manager be sacked mid-season. It's unlikely to happen anyway, the Americans cannot afford to pay him out.

Let's judge our Manager at the end of the season, when it will have no affect on the games being played. Call for his head then, if you feel its right, with the entire season to judge him by.

doing it now, is simply not what LFC is about. (in my opinion)

But getting rid of him now might secure CL place? I feel if we don't get in the CL that we'll lose Torres - and how could blame him?

A world class centre forward cannot be expected to compete for that Europa league nonsense.

Plus we might need to sell him without the CL money.

by **lakes10** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:31 am

after the win last night i know some pro Rafa fans will be saying "in Rafa we trust"

but for me last night sums up why i dont trust Rafa, a 20 mil player given 10 mins at the end? yes he was fit but it was not the right sort of game for him.

a Sub that no one could work out

and our best striker that was fit was left on the bench till 67 min

and all on a night that was in front of the family of the best Manager ever.

last night shoul have been such an easy win but we almost cocked it up.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:00 am

this thread should be renamed "sack him, if you want to win the league"

by **Sabre** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:39 am

lakes10 wrote:after the win last night i know some pro Rafa fans will be saying "in Rafa we trust"

I understand a lot about sackings, I've witnessed quite a few in Spain. And a universal truth tends to be that after a win there's no sacking. So we have Rafa for 3 days more.

If we win against Pompey, he'll have a week more.

And if we progress as we should and as I expect, Rafa will sort things out, get us in the top fourth (that's mandatory), and hopefully get us the FA title.

by **lakes10** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:55 am

FA cup would be nice.

love history.

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:30 pm

lakes10 wrote:after the win last night i know some pro Rafa fans will be saying "in Rafa we trust"

but for me last night sums up why i dont trust Rafa, a 20 mil player given 10 mins at the end? yes he was fit but it was not the right sort of game for him.

a Sub that no one could work out

and our best striker that was fit was left on the bench till 67 min

and all on a night that was in front of the family of the best Manager ever.

last night shoul have been such an easy win but we almost cocked it up.

We have 6 games coming up in a very short time so any chances we get to let the top guys have a rest are well worth taking - we need the top players for the whole season not just the next game

by **lakes10** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:33 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:
lakes10 wrote:after the win last night i know some pro Rafa fans will be saying "in Rafa we trust"

but for me last night sums up why i dont trust Rafa, a 20 mil player given 10 mins at the end? yes he was fit but it was not the right sort of game for him.

a Sub that no one could work out

and our best striker that was fit was left on the bench till 67 min

and all on a night that was in front of the family of the best Manager ever.

last night shoul have been such an easy win but we almost cocked it up.

We have 6 games coming up in a very short time so any chances we get to let the top guys have a rest are well worth taking - we need the top players for the whole season not just the next game

I dont think the player that cost us 20mil will start allof them games.and i am strating to get the feeling he is not that good or is going very rusty from not playing, i have never known a player that has taken so long to get into a team once he was fit.and yes he is fit but Rafa think the games are not right for him.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:34 pm

Which is why I say he gambles too much, makes too many mistakes and costs us points. Last night we won, on other occasions when he has gambled we have not.

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:36 pm

lakes10 wrote:
Benny The Noon wrote:
lakes10 wrote:after the win last night i know some pro Rafa fans will be saying "in Rafa we trust"

but for me last night sums up why i dont trust Rafa, a 20 mil player given 10 mins at the end? yes he was fit but it was not the right sort of game for him.

a Sub that no one could work out

and our best striker that was fit was left on the bench till 67 min

and all on a night that was in front of the family of the best Manager ever.

last night shoul have been such an easy win but we almost cocked it up.

We have 6 games coming up in a very short time so any chances we get to let the top guys have a rest are well worth taking - we need the top players for the whole season not just the next game

I dont think the player that cost us 20mil will start allof them games.and i am strating to get the feeling he is not that good or is going very rusty from not playing, i have never known a player that has taken so long to get into a team once he was fit.and yes he is fit but Rafa think the games are not right for him.

If he had been out for a couple of weeks or a month or two i too would be a bit miffed but the lad was out for 7 months - thats a very long time to be out and to get back his sharpness - first time last night we saw real glimpses of his sharpness and his ability to link up with the rest of them and can see him getting more and more time as we progress.

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:37 pm

s@int wrote:Which is why I say he gambles too much, makes too many mistakes and costs us points. Last night we won, on other occasions when he has gambled we have not.

What ? you got the wrong thread old man

Do you mean Rafa ? i thought one of his main critisms of Rafa was he was too stubborn to make a gamble

by **Scottbot** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:58 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:
lakes10 wrote:
Benny The Noon wrote:
lakes10 wrote:after the win last night i know some pro Rafa fans will be saying "in Rafa we trust"

but for me last night sums up why i dont trust Rafa, a 20 mil player given 10 mins at the end? yes he was fit but it was not the right sort of game for him.

a Sub that no one could work out

and our best striker that was fit was left on the bench till 67 min

and all on a night that was in front of the family of the best Manager ever.

last night shoul have been such an easy win but we almost cocked it up.

We have 6 games coming up in a very short time so any chances we get to let the top guys have a rest are well worth taking - we need the top players for the whole season not just the next game

I dont think the player that cost us 20mil will start allof them games.and i am strating to get the feeling he is not that good or is going very rusty from not playing, i have never known a player that has taken so long to get into a team once he was fit.and yes he is fit but Rafa think the games are not right for him.

If he had been out for a couple of weeks or a month or two i too would be a bit miffed but the lad was out for 7 months - thats a very long time to be out and to get back his sharpness - first time last night we saw real glimpses of his sharpness and his ability to link up with the rest of them and can see him getting more and more time as we progress.

Gybs, it won't hurt every once in while to actually come out and 'Rafa, wot the fook are you doing!? that's bolllo...x that is!' instead of the company line. The whole Aquilani situation is totally mystifying. He would not have got on last night had we not scored the 2nd goal. It's like he will only get a decent amount of playing team if we are cruising 2/3 goals ahead or we are behind. It's so weird. Just play the lad from the start and lets sink or swim with him, the substitution of Aurelio for Lucas nearly cost us last night, and while we're at it, Why the foook is Aurelio starting the game ahead our new £20 million player!?

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 3:23 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:
s@int wrote:Which is why I say he gambles too much, makes too many mistakes and costs us points. Last night we won, on other occasions when he has gambled we have not.

What ? you got the wrong thread old man

Do you mean Rafa ? i thought one of his main critisms of Rafa was he was too stubborn to make a gamble

I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT MATE.

He gambles too much, and makes too many mistakes is my main criticism of him.

Playing players out of position, resting important players in vital games etc etc .

He is too defence minded imo, but thats a totally different argument. Gambling when you are losing is completely different than gambling on your starting line up. There is a huge difference between gambling and going for it, and gambling that you won't need your best players to win.

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