Liverpool FC Forum

by **azriahmad** » Sat Sep 18, 2004 11:14 am

Guys and gals,
Lay off Stu a bit and Stu, don't take such a forthright attitude in responding and taking in other people's views...this is a public forum for Liverpool fans and we should be able to present our views and opinions freely, as long as there no abuses...

by **Redrider** » Sat Sep 18, 2004 4:34 pm

Stu, Keep talking the good sense !!

by **72-1090627431** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 12:30 am

Redrider wrote:Stu, Keep talking the good sense !!

yes, please do................................... :Oo:

by **7_Kewell** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 12:51 am

Hustler........as a weeds utd fan........tell us why they are struggling in the 'championship' :laugh:

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 11:02 am

stu_the_red wrote:Kenny, seriously mate, i'm thinkin of takin u up on meetin u at the arkles if ya carry on dissin Owen

Nar seriously, Can you honestly say you've seen a better player live when he was at his best. I can't. I've seen a few as good, but none actually better. He just oozed class everytime he was on the pitch. Even last season and the one before he still shown it. Can you imagine Owen at his best in this team now? This to me now looks the most Balanced and creative Liverpool side i've seen since i actually understood the game properly. For the first time ever it seems as if we're build a side which is capable of battering teams and keeping a clean sheet. Its still early days, but to me this is starting to look very promising.

Owen had become disllilusioned imo. Hence the reason he had two poor seasons. Yet still managed 47 from 92 starts, 5 of which were sub appearances.

If you watched him play he had lost confidence in the people around him with the exception of Gerrard. His game was inconsistent but he did show ALL aspects of his game. He'll get back to his best and once again be recognised as one of the top 5 or 6 in world.

stu you really are deluding yourself.

henry and van nistelrooy, even fathead boy are better than what michael owen was at his best, by a long shot aswell.

everyone in the football world knows this bar you.

by **115-1073096938** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 2:48 pm

Your wrong. Simple as that.

Where were you the year Owen got Europian player of the year? He looked like he was gonna score in every game and it was a serious shock that year when he didn't score. The hatrick against the Germans, the goals against the Mancs, the goals against the ******...

Where were you lad? I've never seen a better player at a live game. Am only young, but i've seen the likes of Batistuta, Beckham, Keane, Vieira, Henry, Pires, Ferdinand, Aimar, van Nistlerooy, Yorke, Scholes, Gerrard, Hyypia, Rivaldo, Kluivert, Lucio, Ze Roberto, Scholl, Kahn, Schmeichal, Stam, Baraja etc etc... I know a class act when i see one. He's the best player who's played for Liverpool in the last 15 years by quite a distance.

Owen beat Zidane to that title when Zidane was in his prime. He wasn't given that title for being a quick runner or a pretty face.

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:08 pm

ok we'll all accept that owen at his best is better than zidane henry and van nistelrooy.
if you wanna talk about awards etc, which in themselves are debatable (beckham even gets up there), zidane has been world player of the year, owen hasnt.
i admire your undying support stu but no-one agrees with you, not that the majority are always right of course

you need to realise that its not that people dont see how good he is, but how good he is was never best in the world.

when you see henry at his best, every football fan agrees they've never seen a player like him. you have to look at what the neutrals say cos they will never be biased.

by **115-1073096938** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:21 pm

Thats where i disagree. You take Henry out of the Arsenal side and he's not the same player. Yes he's still world class but you have a great player playing to his strengths for Arsenal. He's a great player playing in a great team. Owen was a great player playing in a good team...

He's not got more ability than Owen. He's at a similar level. Just the fact that Owen hasn't played in a team which gets the best out of him to see how good he really is. Owen on top form in a side which suits his style and he has the confidence around him again and you'd see what i mean. I'd expect a very similar impact. Maybe not in terms of alround play, but in terms of goals and probably a similar number of assists.

Owen at his best had Hamann, Gerrard, Smicer, Heskey and Murphy around him. Only Hamann, Gerrard and occasionally Heskey has real class. Gerrard wasn't the player he is now and Hamann wasn't forward thinking. He had little service from the wings and he had no creative spark behind him consistently.

Where as if you look at Henry you have Bergkamp, Reyes, Pires and Viera around him. Reyes in my opinion is a better player.

I think my arguement is perfectly valid. I simply think Owen is in the top 5 or 6 in the world.

by **banana** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:37 pm

stu_the_red wrote:Thats where i disagree. You take Henry out of the Arsenal side and he's not the same player. Yes he's still world class but you have a great player playing to his strengths for Arsenal. He's a great player playing in a great team. Owen was a great player playing in a good team...

He's not got more ability than Owen. He's at a similar level. Just the fact that Owen hasn't played in a team which gets the best out of him to see how good he really is. Owen on top form in a side which suits his style and he has the confidence around him again and you'd see what i mean. I'd expect a very similar impact. Maybe not in terms of alround play, but in terms of goals and probably a similar number of assists.

Owen at his best had Hamann, Gerrard, Smicer, Heskey and Murphy around him. Only Hamann, Gerrard and occasionally Heskey has real class. Gerrard wasn't the player he is now and Hamann wasn't forward thinking. He had little service from the wings and he had no creative spark behind him consistently.

Where as if you look at Henry you have Bergkamp, Reyes, Pires and Viera around him. Reyes in my opinion is a better player.

I think my arguement is perfectly valid. I simply think Owen is in the top 5 or 6 in the world.

Stop embarassing yourselves Stu. You have done a lot of damage to your credibility by your silly posts. Your constant whining and your efforts to turn every posts in this forum into Owen posts are really annoying. It seems to me that you are obsessed with Owen, and perhaps a greater fan of him than Liverpool FC.

by **115-1073096938** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:38 pm

And your constant knowledgeless posts bore me. If you don't like them, don't reply!

And your credibility was lost when you stated Baros was a better player than Owen and you thought Hyypia was overated.

by **bigmick** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:47 pm

Stu I've never locked horns with you before which probably makes me unique on these pages. However when you compare owen to Henri I have to ask are you being serious? Favourite players and loyalty are all very well but to make your point sensibly you have to maintain a sense of realism. I think most of us would say that at his best he was a top talent, although I'm certainly of the opinion that Fowler in his pomp was a much better player. In the top six in the world? Once again possibly at his very best. European footballer of the year? By virtue of an astonishing turnaround in the FA cup final and a memorable winning goal and an even better celebration seen by millions around the world. Comparable to Henri? Not in any way shape or form whatsoever. Are you honestly suggesting that Man U would be more concerned tomorrow night if Owen was playing up front for us than they would be if we had Henri? Surely not.

by **banana** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:49 pm

Knowledgeless?

You supported Houllier to the bitter end. I wanted him sacked for the good of the CLUB. I remember fighting you over this. Even after he was gone you applauded his "massive" achievements and told everyone that Houllier shouldn't have been fired. I dare say you have been proved wrong.

You were devastated when Murphy left and Alonso was signed to replace him. I put the CLUB ahead of any single player. You put Murphy ahead of the club. Now he is being booed off the pitch in Charlton. They think he is lazy and they are tired of his mishit passes already. While Liverpool are looking like a new team with the inclusion of Garcia and Alonso in midfield. Wrong X 2

You are the one that claim Henry doesn't have more skills than Owen. You are seriously biased and WRONG X 3

I can go on and on Stu. But I don't want to. My only hope is that you finally will be able to move on and concentrate on Liverpool FC instead of blindly supporting players. Are you a Liverpool FC supporter or do you prefer to support Owen and Murphy? If then your clubs should be Charlton and Real.

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:57 pm

stu_the_red wrote:Thats where i disagree. You take Henry out of the Arsenal side and he's not the same player. Yes he's still world class but you have a great player playing to his strengths for Arsenal. He's a great player playing in a great team. Owen was a great player playing in a good team...

He's not got more ability than Owen. He's at a similar level. Just the fact that Owen hasn't played in a team which gets the best out of him to see how good he really is. Owen on top form in a side which suits his style and he has the confidence around him again and you'd see what i mean. I'd expect a very similar impact. Maybe not in terms of alround play, but in terms of goals and probably a similar number of assists.

Owen at his best had Hamann, Gerrard, Smicer, Heskey and Murphy around him. Only Hamann, Gerrard and occasionally Heskey has real class. Gerrard wasn't the player he is now and Hamann wasn't forward thinking. He had little service from the wings and he had no creative spark behind him consistently.

Where as if you look at Henry you have Bergkamp, Reyes, Pires and Viera around him. Reyes in my opinion is a better player.

I think my arguement is perfectly valid. I simply think Owen is in the top 5 or 6 in the world.

stu your argument is pure speculation.
apart from france, when has henry ever played for anyone else? how can you discredit people's obvious ability by saying such nonsense like "its cos of the players around him".

by the same token, how can you tell what owen is gonna be like in a better, or worse side? its just pure guesswork.

oh my god stu how can you say he's not got more ability?
this will be my last post about it cos some people are clearly blinded with owen tinted spectacles, and its just not worth it trying to make someone see..
owen's touch a lot of the time is dreadful. have you ever watched him strike the ball properly? he's got a terrible shot. (his finishing is not the same as his shot), hence why he fluffed all those pens, and hardly ever scores outside the box.

henry is a f***** super human being who can do almost anything on the field. owen isnt that type of player, he's just a great striker.
we'll see what happens in madrid, he's got the best of the best there, and it doesnt look as though he's gonna light the world up with his performances, even though he'll probably hold his own.

there are dozens of players better in the world than owen. if you ask every member on this board to name them i bet they all name the same ones.

by **Ade** » Sun Sep 19, 2004 7:54 pm

stu_the_red wrote:Kenny, seriously mate, i'm thinkin of takin u up on meetin u at the arkles if ya carry on dissin Owen

Nar seriously, Can you honestly say you've seen a better player live when he was at his best. I can't. I've seen a few as good, but none actually better. He just oozed class everytime he was on the pitch. Even last season and the one before he still shown it. Can you imagine Owen at his best in this team now? This to me now looks the most Balanced and creative Liverpool side i've seen since i actually understood the game properly. For the first time ever it seems as if we're build a side which is capable of battering teams and keeping a clean sheet. Its still early days, but to me this is starting to look very promising.

Owen had become disllilusioned imo. Hence the reason he had two poor seasons. Yet still managed 47 from 92 starts, 5 of which were sub appearances.

If you watched him play he had lost confidence in the people around him with the exception of Gerrard. His game was inconsistent but he did show ALL aspects of his game. He'll get back to his best and once again be recognised as one of the top 5 or 6 in world.

Gotta disagree with you there Stu. With Dudek in goal I rarely feel like we're gonna keep a clean sheet. See Kirkland's on the bench at OT tomorrow - the way Thommo was cracking on about him on Sky uring the Monaco game, you could tell who him and GH considered our first choice. Get him in and we may be a real force this year.

As for Owen, I don't think he'll ever be the player he was in 2001. he's lost his pace by bulking up to protect his hamstrings. I think he made a big mistake going to Madrid: they increasingly look like a circus act and the top teams in Spain have got their number. He'll never supplant Raul as 1st choice striker and I think his less than perfect 1st touch will cost him dear in la liga. beckham, Figo and ronaldo are all on the wane, and their transfer policy is all about galacticos, not building a team. It'd be brilliant for us if Madrid were eliminated from the CL in the group stages and strugglin in La liga by January - they'd have little chance of prising Gerrard away this season.

Also on Owen, I think the last 2 seasons he was part of the problem at Anfield; there were games when he missed so many chances he cost us points. When we drew 2-2 with Arsenal, Heskey equalising in injury time, he had at least 4 one on ones with Seaman in the first half alone that should have won us the match and he ****** them all up.

If Cisse and Garcia and Baros can do it consistently, we're better off without Owen. And if he doesn't play consistently for madrid over the next season, his world cup place for 2006 will be in peril.

I can see owen coming back after one or two seasons, like Rushie did.

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