Liverpool FC Forum

by **Owzat** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:20 pm

s@int wrote:Nah mate, I still believe in the team, I believe with the right man pulling the strings we could go one better than last season. We had a good team last season and we still have a good team, we just aren't getting the best out of them.

I think its the manager that costing us, you obviously think the team is not good enough.......which boils down to the manager anyway

The buck stops with the manager, money can be used as an excuse regardless of where we finish until such a time as you enter sparky territory and it's clear the manager doesn't know what he's doing when he's thrown huge amounts of money at players and the side is still ordinary. They may have beaten the Arsenal kids but that was with their strong side and that happens in the cup or Arsenal would have won it recently.

The main worry for me is the things that are unlikely to change, not the money, but within the manager. He's showing no signs of fixing his failings.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:21 pm

stmichael wrote:
heimdall wrote:Arsenal are much much closer to winning the prem than we are

bet you any money we finish above them this season, AGAIN

Yeah, if we manage to finish above them this season that will be twice on the trot ...... but if they finish above us they will only have done it twice in three years

by **Owzat** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:25 pm

Comes to something when the height of our ambitions are besting Arsenal, as if that is good enough

by **aCe'** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 3:33 pm

s@int wrote:I think we have a much better team than Arsenal, and under normal circumstances I would expect us to finish well clear of them in the league.

Wenger has done well with no money, but even he can't work miracles. I think Heimdall does have a point, that their future looks rosier than ours but only if this restriction on our spending continues.

Yep.. gotta agree with that... Our starting 11 are better than Arsenals i think... Perhaps they have better backup or more exciting prospects coming throught but in terms of quality, i think we have the better side...

When it comes to the league cup, well... if im not mistaken we've lost to them twice now in the past few years... them always playing their kids (and anyone who doesnt think that the side they put out against us and ManCity are kids is absolutely deluded... only 2 20+ players and everyone else is 18 and 19 ... ffs... and they do very well in that competition too...

Just to put things in percpective regarding this season though... They're 2 points ahead of us in the league WITH A GAME IN HAND, qualified to the next stage of the CL, knocked us out of the league cup, are still in the FA cup.... Id say they were in a much better position than we are atm...

And Wenger... dont think you'll find many who doubt his capabilities as a manager... Unfortunately the same cant be said about Benitez...

by **shawnk** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 3:52 pm

Not sure why people are talking about Arsenal, they are non factor and never been for a long time. The strong rivals have been ManUtd and Chelsea. Hopefully next season will be better or else we'll be missing our aging players like Gerrard.

by **Ben Patrick** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:59 pm

aCe' wrote:
s@int wrote:I think we have a much better team than Arsenal, and under normal circumstances I would expect us to finish well clear of them in the league.

Wenger has done well with no money, but even he can't work miracles. I think Heimdall does have a point, that their future looks rosier than ours but only if this restriction on our spending continues.

Yep.. gotta agree with that... Our starting 11 are better than Arsenals i think... Perhaps they have better backup or more exciting prospects coming throught but in terms of quality, i think we have the better side...

When it comes to the league cup, well... if im not mistaken we've lost to them twice now in the past few years... them always playing their kids (and anyone who doesnt think that the side they put out against us and ManCity are kids is absolutely deluded... only 2 20+ players and everyone else is 18 and 19 ... ffs... and they do very well in that competition too...

Just to put things in percpective regarding this season though... They're 2 points ahead of us in the league WITH A GAME IN HAND, qualified to the next stage of the CL, knocked us out of the league cup, are still in the FA cup.... Id say they were in a much better position than we are atm...

And Wenger... dont think you'll find many who doubt his capabilities as a manager... Unfortunately the same cant be said about Benitez...

I think wenger the last few years is just as stubborn as Rafa and has let Arsenal down.
He gets leeway because of what he won early into his tenure as Arsenal manager, does that remind you of anyone

Seriously though they have had the same problems for 3 seasons and he hasnt sorted them out.
They need a top keeper still and a couple of more defensive minded players.
He did have them previously with Viera, Petit, Edu, Gilberto, Flamini, but has sold them all and not brought in anyone similar.
Great to watch still but the problems are clear to see and he hasnt addressed them.
Thats not good enough and they will win feck all again this season, despite being in a better position than us.

by **heimdall** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:33 pm

supersub wrote:
heimdall wrote:I think Wenger is twice the manager Rafa will ever be, and the future for Arsenal under Wenger is looking a hell of a lot rosier than it is for us under Rafa, Arsenal are much much closer to winning the prem than we are, I don't think they have a chance this year because Chelsea re just too damned strong but they are getting better and better and have a fantastic squad of "youngsters" coming through, whereas what do we have?

you are an ars.hole fan...I knew it

by **heimdall** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:34 pm

stmichael wrote:
heimdall wrote:Arsenal are much much closer to winning the prem than we are

bet you any money we finish above them this season, AGAIN

OK, how much?

by **heimdall** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:39 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:
aCe' wrote:
s@int wrote:I think we have a much better team than Arsenal, and under normal circumstances I would expect us to finish well clear of them in the league.

Wenger has done well with no money, but even he can't work miracles. I think Heimdall does have a point, that their future looks rosier than ours but only if this restriction on our spending continues.

Yep.. gotta agree with that... Our starting 11 are better than Arsenals i think... Perhaps they have better backup or more exciting prospects coming throught but in terms of quality, i think we have the better side...

When it comes to the league cup, well... if im not mistaken we've lost to them twice now in the past few years... them always playing their kids (and anyone who doesnt think that the side they put out against us and ManCity are kids is absolutely deluded... only 2 20+ players and everyone else is 18 and 19 ... ffs... and they do very well in that competition too...

Just to put things in percpective regarding this season though... They're 2 points ahead of us in the league WITH A GAME IN HAND, qualified to the next stage of the CL, knocked us out of the league cup, are still in the FA cup.... Id say they were in a much better position than we are atm...

And Wenger... dont think you'll find many who doubt his capabilities as a manager... Unfortunately the same cant be said about Benitez...

I think wenger the last few years is just as stubborn as Rafa and has let Arsenal down.
He gets leeway because of what he won early into his tenure as Arsenal manager, does that remind you of anyone
Seriously though they have had the same problems for 3 seasons and he hasnt sorted them out.
They need a top keeper still and a couple of more defensive minded players.
He did have them previously with Viera, Petit, Edu, Gilberto, Flamini, but has sold them all and not brought in anyone similar.
Great to watch still but the problems are clear to see and he hasnt addressed them.
Thats not good enough and they will win feck all again this season, despite being in a better position than us.

I agree with that but Arsenal's purse strings are even tighter than ours, the second Wenger gets a decent amount to spend and gets in the missing 2-3 players they need, they will be terrifying. We on the other hand need about 4-5 players, excluding getting in decent subs which Arsenal, Manure, Chavs, Tottingham, Citeh already have but which we clearly lack.

by **Ben Patrick** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:44 pm

heimdall wrote:
Ben Patrick wrote:
aCe' wrote:
s@int wrote:I think we have a much better team than Arsenal, and under normal circumstances I would expect us to finish well clear of them in the league.

Wenger has done well with no money, but even he can't work miracles. I think Heimdall does have a point, that their future looks rosier than ours but only if this restriction on our spending continues.

Yep.. gotta agree with that... Our starting 11 are better than Arsenals i think... Perhaps they have better backup or more exciting prospects coming throught but in terms of quality, i think we have the better side...

When it comes to the league cup, well... if im not mistaken we've lost to them twice now in the past few years... them always playing their kids (and anyone who doesnt think that the side they put out against us and ManCity are kids is absolutely deluded... only 2 20+ players and everyone else is 18 and 19 ... ffs... and they do very well in that competition too...

Just to put things in percpective regarding this season though... They're 2 points ahead of us in the league WITH A GAME IN HAND, qualified to the next stage of the CL, knocked us out of the league cup, are still in the FA cup.... Id say they were in a much better position than we are atm...

And Wenger... dont think you'll find many who doubt his capabilities as a manager... Unfortunately the same cant be said about Benitez...

I think wenger the last few years is just as stubborn as Rafa and has let Arsenal down.
He gets leeway because of what he won early into his tenure as Arsenal manager, does that remind you of anyone
Seriously though they have had the same problems for 3 seasons and he hasnt sorted them out.
They need a top keeper still and a couple of more defensive minded players.
He did have them previously with Viera, Petit, Edu, Gilberto, Flamini, but has sold them all and not brought in anyone similar.
Great to watch still but the problems are clear to see and he hasnt addressed them.
Thats not good enough and they will win feck all again this season, despite being in a better position than us.

I agree with that but Arsenal's purse strings are even tighter than ours, the second Wenger gets a decent amount to spend and gets in the missing 2-3 players they need, they will be terrifying. We on the other hand need about 4-5 players, excluding getting in decent subs which Arsenal, Manure, Chavs, Tottingham, Citeh already have but which we clearly lack.

He went and signed arshavin in january when they had loads of options in that area.
He just cant help signing similar players. Tricky creative flair players.
Arshavin is class, i would have loved him at Liverpool. But is he what Arsenal needed ?

by **heimdall** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:50 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:
He went and signed arshavin in january when they had loads of options in that area.
He just cant help signing similar players. Tricky creative flair players.
Arshavin is class, i would have loved him at Liverpool. But is he what Arsenal needed ?

As said, I agree.

but for how many seasons now have been lacking a genuine right midfielder/winger now? or a second striker

by **Emerald Red** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:11 pm

aCe' wrote:
s@int wrote:I think we have a much better team than Arsenal, and under normal circumstances I would expect us to finish well clear of them in the league.

Wenger has done well with no money, but even he can't work miracles. I think Heimdall does have a point, that their future looks rosier than ours but only if this restriction on our spending continues.

Yep.. gotta agree with that... Our starting 11 are better than Arsenals i think... Perhaps they have better backup or more exciting prospects coming throught but in terms of quality, i think we have the better side...

When it comes to the league cup, well... if im not mistaken we've lost to them twice now in the past few years... them always playing their kids (and anyone who doesnt think that the side they put out against us and ManCity are kids is absolutely deluded... only 2 20+ players and everyone else is 18 and 19 ... ffs... and they do very well in that competition too...

Just to put things in percpective regarding this season though... They're 2 points ahead of us in the league WITH A GAME IN HAND, qualified to the next stage of the CL, knocked us out of the league cup, are still in the FA cup.... Id say they were in a much better position than we are atm...

And Wenger... dont think you'll find many who doubt his capabilities as a manager... Unfortunately the same cant be said about Benitez...

Didn't we put out our fringe and reserve players against Arsenal's so called "wonder kids"? As I recall, we were the better team that had chances to put us out of sight in that match. And why are Benitez's credentials as a manager in doubt over that of the w@nktastic Arsen Wenger? Sure the man is a genius in the transfer market at finding youngsters, but those youngsters rarely get to stay the course as they are a selling club, something like Rafa has been doing since day one here. Oh, and has Wenger won any European trophies lately, or ever? No. So why should Benitez be in doubt? Wenger is no better off now than what Benitez is and that's a fact. No success in approaching five seasons with his "growing up side". Super.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:23 pm

Emerald Red wrote:
aCe' wrote:
s@int wrote:I think we have a much better team than Arsenal, and under normal circumstances I would expect us to finish well clear of them in the league.

Wenger has done well with no money, but even he can't work miracles. I think Heimdall does have a point, that their future looks rosier than ours but only if this restriction on our spending continues.

Yep.. gotta agree with that... Our starting 11 are better than Arsenals i think... Perhaps they have better backup or more exciting prospects coming throught but in terms of quality, i think we have the better side...

When it comes to the league cup, well... if im not mistaken we've lost to them twice now in the past few years... them always playing their kids (and anyone who doesnt think that the side they put out against us and ManCity are kids is absolutely deluded... only 2 20+ players and everyone else is 18 and 19 ... ffs... and they do very well in that competition too...

Just to put things in percpective regarding this season though... They're 2 points ahead of us in the league WITH A GAME IN HAND, qualified to the next stage of the CL, knocked us out of the league cup, are still in the FA cup.... Id say they were in a much better position than we are atm...

And Wenger... dont think you'll find many who doubt his capabilities as a manager... Unfortunately the same cant be said about Benitez...

Didn't we put out our fringe and reserve players against Arsenal's so called "wonder kids"? As I recall, we were the better team that had chances to put us out of sight in that match. And why are Benitez's credentials as a manager in doubt over that of the w@nktastic Arsen Wenger? Sure the man is a genius in the transfer market at finding youngsters, but those youngsters rarely get to stay the course as they are a selling club, something like Rafa has been doing since day one here. Oh, and has Wenger won any European trophies lately, or ever? No. So why should Benitez be in doubt? Wenger is no better off now than what Benitez is and that's a fact. No success in approaching five seasons with his "growing up side". Super.

I don't think its as simple as that mate. We have had no success in approaching 4 years. We have spent approx £100million net while he has spent -£2million.

We are hardly a selling club (so far) mate

They have sold a lot of their stars, we have sold Alonso who requested a move!

I prefer seeing thing as they are. We have a better team, which we should have with the money we have spent, they have the better youngsters which they should have after the money they have spent.

by **Benny The Noon** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:27 pm

Hasnt wenger been told many times by his board that he can buy whoever he likes and their is always money available for him but he decides not to spend it .

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:31 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:Hasnt wenger been told many times by his board that he can buy whoever he likes and their is always money available for him but he decides not to spend it .

Yeah and we were told we could sign snoopy doogy and that Rafa could spend the same this year as every other year. What the owners say and what the manager gets aren't always the same thing mate.

Last I read was Wenger saying that he would have to make £24million a year for 17 years to balance the books!

"We manage at Arsenal to maintain all our football ambitions - national and European - while having to free up, for 17 more years, an annual surplus of £24million to pay for our stadium," said Wenger.

Taking into consideration the limitations forced on the club, Wenger outlined their strategy to raise the required money: "The strategy of the club is to sell every year and to buy less expensive players."

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