Liverpool FC Forum

by **metalhead** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:18 pm

This is not even close to being worse, check out some other forums, especially the echo forum, you have people calling Rafa a fraud and whoever chants for him in games are called peasants and thickos

believe me its true

by **LFC2007** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:12 pm

andy_g wrote:i actually find it quite annoying when people bang on about torres being the best striker in the world because i don't think he is (though of course i think he's exceptional etc etc etc) - and i find it equally annoying when people talk about voronin (for example) as a piece of sh!t and all that.

what's wrong with sensibly and objectively debating the sensible ground which is closer to the middle?

Speaking for myself, I think an in-form Torres is the best out-and-out striker in world football and to say so doesn't mean I lack objectivity; it's genuinely how I would assess him in relation to the others who are in that select group.

Obviously I can't make a truly objective assessment of his ability - nobody can - because I can only see it through my own eyes and to that extent, my affiliation with the club and especially the fact that I've seen him play more often than the others will inevitably cause me to look at him in a more favourable light, as it would with everybody in the same situation. The best you can do is make yourself aware of these facts and come to as objective a judgment as possible.

by **bigmick** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:17 pm

In the Premiership the best three strikers are Torres, Drogba and Rooney. They are very different so it's hard to compare them, but I'd have Torres shading it from the other two who I couldn't split. As for how he compares to David Villa and the like, I couldn't really say as I've barely seen the other fella play. I do think he's (Torres) in a different league to Ibrhahimovic though, and while I thought Eto was a wonderful player a couple of years back,his powers have probably waned a bit.

So best in the World? I don't know enough about the others really to say for sure, but there can't be many better surely.

by **Dazzer** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:33 pm

bigmick wrote:In the Premiership the best three strikers are Torres, Drogba and Rooney. They are very different so it's hard to compare them, but I'd have Torres shading it from the other two who I couldn't split. As for how he compares to David Villa and the like, I couldn't really say as I've barely seen the other fella play. I do think he's (Torres) in a different league to Ibrhahimovic though, and while I thought Eto was a wonderful player a couple of years back,his powers have probably waned a bit.

So best in the World? I don't know enough about the others really to say for sure, but there can't be many better surely.

I think Mick we tend to base the best striker in the world based on the level of our league being the best in the world and I think that is wrong just because they are doing the best in this league isn't a automatic ok he is best in world sort of thing.There is many great strikers in the world and only a fool would say one is the best because on thier day any of the top 10 can perform like the No.1 I think to say Torres is a top 10 in the world is the most sensible way to put it with out making you self ( not you , in general) look bias and a right tit.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:37 pm

Of course, it's just a judgment - you can't test who is the best. Nobody could ever 'claim' that he was the best, just that they're of the opinion that he is.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:39 pm

Dazzer wrote:
bigmick wrote:In the Premiership the best three strikers are Torres, Drogba and Rooney. They are very different so it's hard to compare them, but I'd have Torres shading it from the other two who I couldn't split. As for how he compares to David Villa and the like, I couldn't really say as I've barely seen the other fella play. I do think he's (Torres) in a different league to Ibrhahimovic though, and while I thought Eto was a wonderful player a couple of years back,his powers have probably waned a bit.

So best in the World? I don't know enough about the others really to say for sure, but there can't be many better surely.

I think Mick we tend to base the best striker in the world based on the level of our league being the best in the world and I think that is wrong just because they are doing the best in this league isn't a automatic ok he is best in world sort of thing.There is many great strikers in the world and only a fool would say one is the best because on thier day any of the top 10 can perform like the No.1 I think to say Torres is a top 10 in the world is the most sensible way to put it with out making you self ( not you , in general) look bias and a right tit.

How can you say he's in the top 10 if you haven't seen all the other strikers in all the other leagues, and if you have, how can you be sure they're of comparable quality?

by **LFC2007** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:55 pm

Let's see:

Torres, Eto'o, Villa, Rooney (would you even call him an out-and-out striker?), Aguero (ditto),Ibrahimovic, Drogba.

Who are the others?

For me, Torres is the standout pick. That is to say, if I was building a team from scratch and could pick any set of players from any league, and if it suited such that I had the idea of utilising an out-and-out striker in the system I hoped to employ, I would pick Torres ahead of any of the others.

Eto'o is world class, but getting on a bit, Aguero and Rooney aren't what I would classify as out-and-out strikers, while Villa would be a pretty close second, followed by Drogba, with Ibrahimovic coming firmly last.

by **Dazzer** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:06 pm

LFC2007 wrote:Let's see:

Torres, Eto'o, Villa, Rooney (would you even call him an out-and-out striker?), Aguero (ditto),Ibrahimovic, Drogba.

Who are the others?

For me, Torres is the standout pick. That is to say, if I was building a team from scratch and could pick any set of players from any league, and if it suited such that I had the idea of utilising an out-and-out striker in the system I hoped to employ, I would pick Torres ahead of any of the others.

Eto'o is world class, but getting on a bit, Aguero and Rooney aren't what I would classify as out-and-out strikers, while Villa would be a pretty close second, followed by Drogba, with Ibrahimovic coming firmly last.

I would love to live your world where every thing is so simple.

Guess is you listen to andy gray to much you start to think like him IE Torres is best in world bla bla he is great but can under perform like any striker.

by **JC_81** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:08 pm

LFC2007 wrote:Let's see:

Torres, Eto'o, Villa, Rooney (would you even call him an out-and-out striker?), Aguero (ditto),Ibrahimovic, Drogba.

Who are the others?

For me, Torres is the standout pick. That is to say, if I was building a team from scratch and could pick any set of players from any league, and if it suited such that I had the idea of utilising an out-and-out striker in the system I hoped to employ, I would pick Torres ahead of any of the others.

Eto'o is world class, but getting on a bit, Aguero and Rooney aren't what I would classify as out-and-out strikers, while Villa would be a pretty close second, followed by Drogba, with Ibrahimovic coming firmly last.

I'd just about go along with that mate, except I genuinely think it's a tough pick between Torres and Villa at the moment in terms of who is number one. Both class players. They were the reason Spain won the Euros (everyone bangs on about Iniesta/Xavi and rightly so, but goals win games and tournaments).

Like yourself I'd have Drogba just on their coat tails and wouldn't have Inbrahimovich in that list to be honest.

If anyone's interested, this is World Soccer magazine's list of the top 20 'strikers' based on all goals scored for club and country over the past four seasons and taking into account difficulty of league... (I don't agree with it by the way)

1 Villa
2 Eto'o
3 Ronaldo
4 Klose
5 Toni
6 Huntelaar
7 Drogba
8 Henry
9 Torres
10 Kanoute
11 Berbatov
12 Forlan
13 Fabiano
14 Gomez
15 Rooney
15 Messi
17 Kaka
18 Van Nistelrooy
19 R. Keane
20 Ibrahimovich

Ibrahimovich and Villa's positions are possibly the only two I agree with

:laugh:

by **Dazzer** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:10 pm

john craig wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:Let's see:

Torres, Eto'o, Villa, Rooney (would you even call him an out-and-out striker?), Aguero (ditto),Ibrahimovic, Drogba.

Who are the others?

For me, Torres is the standout pick. That is to say, if I was building a team from scratch and could pick any set of players from any league, and if it suited such that I had the idea of utilising an out-and-out striker in the system I hoped to employ, I would pick Torres ahead of any of the others.

Eto'o is world class, but getting on a bit, Aguero and Rooney aren't what I would classify as out-and-out strikers, while Villa would be a pretty close second, followed by Drogba, with Ibrahimovic coming firmly last.

I'd just about go along with that mate, except I genuinely think it's a tough pick between Torres and Villa at the moment in terms of who is number one. Both class players. They were the reason Spain won the Euros (everyone bangs on about Iniesta/Xavi and rightly so, but goals win games and tournaments).

Like yourself I'd have Drogba just on their coat tails and wouldn't have Inbrahimovich in that list to be honest.

If anyone's interested, this is World Soccer magazine's list of the top 20 'strikers' based on all goals scored for club and country over the past four seasons and taking into account difficulty of league... (I don't agree with it by the way)

1 Villa
2 Eto'o
3 Ronaldo
4 Klose
5 Toni
6 Huntelaar
7 Drogba
8 Henry
9 Torres
10 Kanoute
11 Berbatov
12 Forlan
13 Fabiano
14 Gomez
15 Rooney
15 Messi
17 Kaka
18 Van Nistelrooy
19 R. Keane
20 Ibrahimovich

Ibrahimovich and Villa's positions are possibly the only two I agree with

No idea why van persie isn't in there that lad is world class.

by **JC_81** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:13 pm

Dazzer wrote:No idea why van persie isn't in there that lad is world class.

Probably because he's not played enough games and therefore not scored enough goals mate, due to injuries. The coefficient they worked out didn't take into account goals to games ratio, so players prone to injuries probably won't feature. He is good though.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:14 pm

That sounds about right. Luca Toni ahead of Messi and Kaka.

And Fredi Kanoute :buttrock

by **JC_81** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:17 pm

LFC2007 wrote:That sounds about right. Luca Toni ahead of Messi and Kaka.

And Fredi Kanoute

Yeah

In fairness it's supposed to be a measure of how prolific a goalscorer they are, not how good a player.

If they included Lampard and Gerrard I'm sure they'd be ahead of most of those guys too... still doesn't mean they'd be better strikers than them...

by **Dazzer** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:17 pm

LFC2007 wrote:That sounds about right. Luca Toni ahead of Messi and Kaka.

And Fredi Kanoute

Like john said tho its based on form most prob like goals to games ratio and points on league standing.

This is point I was making tho you can't say one player is better then another because you can only truely base if a player is best in world on how thier form is really.We all know that is up and down year on year.I could just jump on bandwagon and say yeah Torres is best because he is pool player and use my red tinted glasses or I could say he is one of many great forwards in world and hold a better arguement in general.

by **JC_81** » Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:22 pm

Dazzer wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:That sounds about right. Luca Toni ahead of Messi and Kaka.

And Fredi Kanoute

Like john said tho its based on form most prob like goals to games ratio and points on league standing.

It's worked out by counting all goals in the past 4 seasons...

Goals are weighted...

1 point for a league or domestic cup goal in the majority of countries

2 points if the above is in the English, French, German, Spanish or Italian leagues

3 points if the goal is in European competition or Internationals

Bit of a dodgy ratio... explains why Keane is in there with his International scoring record though.

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