Liverpool FC Forum

by **Kharhaz** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:57 am

s@int wrote:I am not asking anyone to agree with what I have said here, this is an opinion. But I ask you please to respect my opinion without burdening me with you're very own egocentric view.

That statement dismisses itself. Does it not?

by **account deleted by request** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:14 am

Kharhaz wrote:
s@int wrote:I am not asking anyone to agree with what I have said here, this is an opinion. But I ask you please to respect my opinion without burdening me with you're very own egocentric view.

That statement dismisses itself. Does it not?

Its pointless asking me questions mate, I only posted it ....... I didn't write it

by **account deleted by request** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:39 am

Kharhaz wrote:
s@int wrote:I am not asking anyone to agree with what I have said here, this is an opinion. But I ask you please to respect my opinion without burdening me with you're very own egocentric view.

That statement dismisses itself. Does it not?

Kharhaz, I only asked to have my opinion respected. However with ideologies in Western society being as they are today, you must either conform to the egocentric view of left wing notions. If not you are lambasted as a facist racist.

The British public have had to swallow the political view of left wing notions for far too long now, to the point where it has become silly to say the least. Protestors who used their democratic right against the opening of a mosque which without compassion and diplomacy opended on the annivesrsary of 9/11. Where labelled as racists' this card has been used far too much now and people I suspect are becoming sick and tired of having to tread on eggshells where ethnic minorities are concerned.

Check OECD reports on birth rates also in western countries, I think this is why SIOS protest in fear of becoming an ethnic minority in Britain.

As for 'trying to construct a proper argument' that all seems a bit rich coming from the ignorance of someone who couldn't be ar.sed to get all the their facts straight about the protesters and the timing of the mosque being opened.
Indeed it is tiresome.
----------------------------------
posted on behalf of a mate

by **Lando_Griffin** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:59 am

s@int wrote:
metalhead wrote:
Lando_Griffin wrote:
Madmax wrote:Lando your comment about islam is just a load of shyte.. Seems like you have a problem with the religion rather than the extremists using their twisted interpretation. What you mentioned stating we don't want this we don't want that... Did some mullah come to convert you or something lool...

No it isn't. If I don't want to adopt their ways, why should I? Should I be forced to pretend that I agree with some backwards philosophy which teaches that women are second-class citizens, alcohol is banned, you must pray X amount of times per day, you must starve yourself for Ramadan, etc, etc, etc.

It's all a load of cobblers. It serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever and no God worth following would want people to waste their lives with that kind of crackpot behaviour, in my very honest opinion.

backward philosophy? treat women as a second class citizen? loads of tosh that is mate, no disrespect, but thats b*llox. You have no idea what Islam is. Its not the religion that treats women to be below men, this has been before Islam even emerged! back in the dark ages in the Middle East, where there were bedouen tribes and villages scattered all over the desert in the gulf region, where women were not treated equally, ask any historian and he will tell you this. Infact Islam puts women and men together they teach you to respect the other gender and to care. However, most of you watch the news, look at Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan etc... then assume that women are treated like sh!te because of Islam. This is a cultural aspect, not a religious aspect which has been there for a long long and long time. You have no idea what Ramadan means do you as well? Lando, sometimes you really need to educate yourself about other types of religion before you go on posting comments that are wrong and doesn't show any understanding on the religion type (Islam).

I'm not even a religious muslim, I drink alot of fanta (barry ), like to , like to go to clubs and bars. However, I do follow certain codes of my religion, which I respect because I understand their meanings and they serve for the good of humanity, not the other way around.

Good post mate. What some people seem to forget is that it is only a relatively short while ago that women were seen very much as second class citizens in the West. When I first joined the Civil Service in the early 70's a wife was a chattel in law as well as in practise, and had no rights to tax allowances in her own right (I think this only changed completely in 1990)

When I first entered the private sector I was told that "they didn't like to employ women because they only got pregnant and leave and they just distracted the men from their jobs anyway!"

I never said it was exclusive to Islam.

But two wrongs don't make a right.

by **Lando_Griffin** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:11 am

metalhead wrote:
Lando_Griffin wrote:
Madmax wrote:Lando your comment about islam is just a load of shyte.. Seems like you have a problem with the religion rather than the extremists using their twisted interpretation. What you mentioned stating we don't want this we don't want that... Did some mullah come to convert you or something lool...

No it isn't. If I don't want to adopt their ways, why should I? Should I be forced to pretend that I agree with some backwards philosophy which teaches that women are second-class citizens, alcohol is banned, you must pray X amount of times per day, you must starve yourself for Ramadan, etc, etc, etc.

It's all a load of cobblers. It serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever and no God worth following would want people to waste their lives with that kind of crackpot behaviour, in my very honest opinion.

backward philosophy? treat women as a second class citizen? loads of tosh that is mate, no disrespect, but thats b*llox. You have no idea what Islam is. Its not the religion that treats women to be below men, this has been before Islam even emerged! back in the dark ages in the Middle East, where there were bedouen tribes and villages scattered all over the desert in the gulf region, where women were not treated equally, ask any historian and he will tell you this. Infact Islam puts women and men together they teach you to respect the other gender and to care. However, most of you watch the news, look at Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan etc... then assume that women are treated like sh!te because of Islam. This is a cultural aspect, not a religious aspect which has been there for a long long and long time. You have no idea what Ramadan means do you as well? Lando, sometimes you really need to educate yourself about other types of religion before you go on posting comments that are wrong and doesn't show any understanding on the religion type (Islam).

I'm not even a religious muslim, I drink alot of fanta (barry ), like to , like to go to clubs and bars. However, I do follow certain codes of my religion, which I respect because I understand their meanings and they serve for the good of humanity, not the other way around.

No, I don't need to educate myself about Islam, because I have no desire to know anything about it.

Is alcohol not banned?

Do you not starve yourselves for Ramadan? (I know it's meant to teach patience and spirituality, and that it's a way of asking for forgiveness for their sins, etc. If it were me and I were nutty on Islam, I would not commit any sins throughout the year and carry on eating - is that an option?)

Are women not treated like 2nd-class citizens? (No matter the reason, it's the way of things in Muslim countries. If the religion said "women and men are equal", that bearded dustbin c*nt wouldn't treat them like sh*t, because no interpretation of the religion would come to that conclusion.

If it ordered that women and men were equal, women would be allowed to make eye contact, speak to outsiders, show more than their eyes, etc, etc, etc.)

I haven't just imagined this - it's how it is.

The religion on the whole is full of goodness and light. It's just a pity it's unlikely to be real.

by **account deleted by request** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:40 am

In most religions women are second class citizens.

Christians also have restrictions on what and when they can eat. Lent for example. No meat on a friday was another, no meat on Good Friday,etc etc

Then we have sexual repression (no contraceptives) and all gays are condemed to hell, priests and Nuns who can't marry, yet seemingly its ok to abuse young children?

Flagilation, people nailed to the cross and various other tortures are still performed by the extemist minority.

Most religions have people who will take it to extremes, and maybe its only the fact that religion for the majority in the West is now more or less a choose your own belief system rather than rules to live your life by that has diminished the problem.

Personally I think the world would be better off if we had no gods and no religions, because there will always be people who take ANYTHING to extremes and others that will follow them like sheep.

by **Bad Bob** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:39 am

s@int wrote:In most religions women are second class citizens.

Christians also have restrictions on what and when they can eat. Lent for example. No meat on a friday was another, no meat on Good Friday,etc etc

Then we have sexual repression (no contraceptives) and all gays are condemed to hell, priests and Nuns who can't marry, yet seemingly its ok to abuse young children?

Flagilation, people nailed to the cross and various other tortures are still performed by the extemist minority.

Most religions have people who will take it to extremes, and maybe its only the fact that religion for the majority in the West is now more or less a choose your own belief system rather than rules to live your life by that has diminished the problem.

Personally I think the world would be better off if we had no gods and no religions, because there will always be people who take ANYTHING to extremes and others that will follow them like sheep.

Plenty of fundy Christians frown on alcohol as well. My family had to hide the booze at the back of the kitchen cupboard for years when certain relatives stopped by. My wedding got a little awkward as well when that side of the family got sight of the bar at the reception. :laugh:

by **LFC2007** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:03 pm

s@int wrote:Kharhaz, I only asked to have my opinion respected. However with ideologies in Western society being as they are today, you must either conform to the egocentric view of left wing notions. If not you are lambasted as a facist racist.

etc.. etc.. :laugh:

Check OECD reports on birth rates also in western countries, I think this is why SIOS protest in fear of becoming an ethnic minority in Britain.

What do you think the aim of 'Stop the Islamisation Of Europe' is?

They exist to 'combat the covert and overt expansion of Islam in Europe'. Their efforts are dedicated to this, not the issue of ethnicity and the changing demographic - or so they claim.

What you've actually regurgitated is BNP rhetoric, a reflection - I suspect - of your own political alignment.

The British public have had to swallow the political view of left wing notions for far too long now, to the point where it has become silly to say the least. Protestors who used their democratic right against the opening of a mosque which without compassion and diplomacy opended on the annivesrsary of 9/11. Where labelled as racists' this card has been used far too much now and people I suspect are becoming sick and tired of having to tread on eggshells where ethnic minorities are concerned.

As for 'trying to construct a proper argument' that all seems a bit rich coming from the ignorance of someone who couldn't be ar.sed to get all the their facts straight about the protesters and the timing of the mosque being opened.
Indeed it is tiresome.

Hoist with one's own petard.

As I initially suspected from the reports I'd read, and what has since been confirmed to me, the mosque did not celebrate its opening last Friday. There was no scheduled 'opening' or 'celebration', just the usual Friday prayer. Indeed, the new construction for the new mosque project has yet to be completed in full, and when it does it is likely we'll be into 2010.

What's disconcerting is that four members of this forum opted to believe the line that the mosque had selected the date of 9/11 for its opening either on purpose, or through oversight, before proceeding to use this ill-conceived assumption to castigate the Mosque and to fuel anti-Islam rhetoric in general. Rather than checking their facts, rather than 'leaving it open', they - and you're one of them - followed their prejudices through to their unjust conclusions. As is the self-serving way.

by **Greavesie** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:09 pm

Ican relate to a lot of whats being said here. When I speak about the views held by people like S@int the lads at Uni label me a masive racist and sh!t

by **LFC2007** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:29 pm

That's s@int's mate I was replying to, btw.

by **Lando_Griffin** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:51 pm

All this political correctness is well and good, but part of that is the basic human right to choose what you want to do with your own life - how to live it, and to live without fear.

Unfortunately, the fears of the native population don't count when it comes to issues such as this. Only the minorities matter, evidently.

Do the limp-wristed politicians not grasp the remarkably simple premise that their incessant human-rights bottom-wiping of the immigrants has, in turn, undermined the human rights of their electorate? The BNP managed to get seats in the European Parliament purely because of Labour's pathetic dissolution of Britain's moral fabric and their constant, unerring obsession with selling us out to Countries we have absolutely nothing in common with;

"You can't sell pints, ounces, pounds, gallons, stones."

"You can't sell tomatoes which are too small or too big."

"You can't sell bananas which are too straight or too bent."

"You can't fly the Union flag/ St George's Cross becaus eti might cause Johnny Foreigner offence. (But Johnny Foreigner can hang his flags out of his window and to hell with what you think.)"

"Sorry, Mr 'worked hard all his life and paid all his taxes but is now out of work having lost his job because his firm decided to uproot and relocate to China for cheaper labour', but you can't have any help with your mortgage because we're too busy putting the thousands of criminal immigrants up in the lap of luxury, because to send a serial rapist back to his homeland where he will quite rightly get f*cking stoned to death is against his human rights. We don't really give a f*ck that he'll go out and rape your sister and someone's wife, because that's perfectly acceptable as he came from a broken home."

"We won't lock little Johnny up for burgling a charity shop because it's only the second time he's been caught. But rest assured that the next time he's caught, he'll have a jolly stiff 4 month sentence in an open prison somewhere by the sea. Yes, we are aware that statistically he will have committed dozens of burglaries between each arrest, but f*ck it - it's not our homes, is it? We have 24 hour security guards, see? Besides, it's against his human rights to lock him up at all."

"If some scumbag breaks into your house at night armed with a knife and you batter the little c*nt with a stick, we'll throw YOU in prison and give you a longer sentence than the little turd who started it."

"We'll charge you more and more tax to pay for all these immigrants, but don't look to us if you need any help. If the immigrants start robbing you in the street because a house and £300 per week isn't enough to fund their drug habits and their family of 8,000 back home - we won't deport them. That would be against their human rights. No, what we'll do is EDUCATE them. We'll give them the benefit of the doubt and let them go free after a week."

"Gangs are ruining Britain. But it's not the Triads or the Sri Lankans. It's not the Muslim extremists or the f*cking yardie 'Gangsterz, innit'.

No, it's the white Brits who cause it all. Skinheaded scum that they are. They're the cause of all our problems, not the b*stards who came here and took over entire areas, maiming anyone who innocently stepped in their 'hood.
Here's a plan - why don't we deport the Brits - then all our problems would be solved, right?"

"Britain must accept and keep immigrants who travel to it and cannot deport them. This is despite the fact that they travel through several of our fellow Europeans' Countries to get here. France, despite being more than twice th esize of Britain, can get shut as and when they please. Britain can't, though, because it'd be against their human rights."

It's ridiculous, it's painful and it's an insult to the millions who fought to keep this country free. The braindead maggots in Parliament are so far detached from reality they probably still believe that they've actually improved this country.

They probably still believe in the f*cking Tooth Fairy.

What this country needs is a Churchill of the 21st Century. Someone who will stand up to Brussels and say "F*ck you - we're leaving this sh*t-tip of a union and going it alone."

What does France do for us? What benefits do Germany bring us? What improvements have we seen since we were lumped in with Poland, Switzerland, Spain, Holland and f*cking Belgium? What good has it done for us? If anything, travel around Europe is now harder and certainly a sight more expensive.

Are any of our lives better than they were before we began being Governed by a bunch of unelected pr*cks, no more than 2% of whom actually have this Country's best interests at heart?

All they have done is reduce jobs (minimum wage cost thousands of people the vocations they were perfectly happy in previously), meddle with our lives (droves of foreigners invading every town, creating their own little insular communities. Gypos can invade Farmer Giles' land and ruin everything about it but can't be moved on without a protracted Court case or a large sweetener from Mr Giles), and criminalise f*cking green grocers.

It stinks. It stinks like a rotting pilchard covered in dog sh*t on a warm Summer's day.

And until someone stands up and tells Europe to f*ck off, it's only going to get worse.

We MUST adopt Australia ro America's policies - "If you will improve us, you can come in gladly. If you're going to be a leeching b*stard who steals, rapes, murders and sits on his a*se claiming the dole and sending the money to his bomb-making counsin in Afghanistan, you can f*ck right off, mateyboy.

And here's a kick up the a*se for good measure."

When will this gang of f*ckwits in London EVERr learn? :no

by **Sabre** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:28 pm

LFC, I don't want to join this debate but I want to clarify something.

What do you think the aim of 'Stop the Islamisation Of Europe' is?

I think UK, like Spain, is a non-denominational state, is this right?

And I think UK, like Spain, is a country that provides freedom of creed (sp?), that is, their citizens have the right to have whatever the creed they want (including no creed at all). Is this right?

So, how can be possible an islamic state? I mean, right now, the fact that most people are christians doesn't avoid that Uk is a non-denominational state. I wanted to clarify these doubts, but I'm not sure the words are correct, hope you get my drift.

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:49 pm

Lando_Griffin wrote:
metalhead wrote:
Lando_Griffin wrote:
Madmax wrote:Lando your comment about islam is just a load of shyte.. Seems like you have a problem with the religion rather than the extremists using their twisted interpretation. What you mentioned stating we don't want this we don't want that... Did some mullah come to convert you or something lool...

No it isn't. If I don't want to adopt their ways, why should I? Should I be forced to pretend that I agree with some backwards philosophy which teaches that women are second-class citizens, alcohol is banned, you must pray X amount of times per day, you must starve yourself for Ramadan, etc, etc, etc.

It's all a load of cobblers. It serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever and no God worth following would want people to waste their lives with that kind of crackpot behaviour, in my very honest opinion.

backward philosophy? treat women as a second class citizen? loads of tosh that is mate, no disrespect, but thats b*llox. You have no idea what Islam is. Its not the religion that treats women to be below men, this has been before Islam even emerged! back in the dark ages in the Middle East, where there were bedouen tribes and villages scattered all over the desert in the gulf region, where women were not treated equally, ask any historian and he will tell you this. Infact Islam puts women and men together they teach you to respect the other gender and to care. However, most of you watch the news, look at Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan etc... then assume that women are treated like sh!te because of Islam. This is a cultural aspect, not a religious aspect which has been there for a long long and long time. You have no idea what Ramadan means do you as well? Lando, sometimes you really need to educate yourself about other types of religion before you go on posting comments that are wrong and doesn't show any understanding on the religion type (Islam).

I'm not even a religious muslim, I drink alot of fanta (barry ), like to , like to go to clubs and bars. However, I do follow certain codes of my religion, which I respect because I understand their meanings and they serve for the good of humanity, not the other way around.

No, I don't need to educate myself about Islam, because I have no desire to know anything about it.

Is alcohol not banned?

Do you not starve yourselves for Ramadan? (I know it's meant to teach patience and spirituality, and that it's a way of asking for forgiveness for their sins, etc. If it were me and I were nutty on Islam, I would not commit any sins throughout the year and carry on eating - is that an option?)

Are women not treated like 2nd-class citizens? (No matter the reason, it's the way of things in Muslim countries. If the religion said "women and men are equal", that bearded dustbin c*nt wouldn't treat them like sh*t, because no interpretation of the religion would come to that conclusion.

If it ordered that women and men were equal, women would be allowed to make eye contact, speak to outsiders, show more than their eyes, etc, etc, etc.)

I haven't just imagined this - it's how it is.

The religion on the whole is full of goodness and light. It's just a pity it's unlikely to be real.

You really do know nothing about everything.

Stop embarrassing yourself and stick to making crude jokes and comments that are not funny.

by **Emerald Red** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:10 pm

Ah, some folks need to realize that it really is a small world afterall.

by **Emerald Red** » Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:11 pm

Big Niall wrote:what is helping the catholics and protestants bond in Northern Ireland is the burning out of the houses of immigrants. Nothing unites like a shared hatred (Britain had France many centuries ago to cement it as a country) You just need a common enemy. Blame the Luxemburgers for all Britains problems and I bet it wouldn't be long before white britains and muslim young men started to look for pesky luxemburgers to beat up. There are so few of them around you'd have peace on the streets.

Perfect sensible solution.

What a complete load of bollox.

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