Liverpool FC Forum

by **Homebooby** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:59 am

I don't think that ManU will suffer in the way that is being anticipated here to be honest, I think the majority of their success is purely down to tactics and the winning mentality that has been instilled in the team/club for the last 20 years. I don't think you lose that overnight and so long as Fergie still has all his faculties, I think they will be a force to be reckoned with and I am genuinely concerned that they will be even harder to beat this season than last. They have a lot to prove following the loss of some key/star players and I think that is exactly what Fergie needs. I hope I am wrong, but I think you'll see them solid out of the blocks, taking close to full points. It may not be pretty, but it will be workmanlike and effective.

Conversely I think that there is huge pressure on our squad and the only real doubt I have about them is whether they are mentally up to the task over the course of the 38 games. They stuck in there last year to the end, which was admirable, but it is easier chasing than staying ahead and we showed last year that we were incapable of sustaining and capitalising on our lead. I think every year that goes without a title adds massive pressure to the club as a whole and the fact that we are moving from star players in their prime (Gerrard/Carra) towards their twlight years adds significant additional strain and I am concerned that we don't lose the balance that the squad was starting to show last year through people trying too hard etc, a la Stevie 4 years ago. It's also key that we keep people fit this year, but currently if Torres or Stevie get knobbled in the first few weeks, we'll struggle again imho.

I guess what I am saying is that it is important to keep up with the pack and show the league that we are serious contenders cos I think that a lot of people are expecting us to fall behind quite quickly and that last year was more of a fluke. I don't think that is the case, but I have my doubts whether we actually have a winners mentality that will keep us at the front over the 40 games. We used to have that 20 years ago and I think we are still regaining that now and it really needs a title to solidify it in the minds of the team and club I think. I expect a bumpy ride this year, but hopefully we will have a good slice of fortune (as is often the way) that just pushes us over the edge.

I also think that a stable environment is essential for the mindset of the team. Let's hope we have a season without any nonsense and allow the lads to stay 110% focused.

by **heimdall** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:34 pm

Homebooby wrote:I don't think that ManU will suffer in the way that is being anticipated here to be honest, I think the majority of their success is purely down to tactics and the winning mentality that has been instilled in the team/club for the last 20 years. I don't think you lose that overnight and so long as Fergie still has all his faculties, I think they will be a force to be reckoned with and I am genuinely concerned that they will be even harder to beat this season than last. They have a lot to prove following the loss of some key/star players and I think that is exactly what Fergie needs. I hope I am wrong, but I think you'll see them solid out of the blocks, taking close to full points. It may not be pretty, but it will be workmanlike and effective.

Conversely I think that there is huge pressure on our squad and the only real doubt I have about them is whether they are mentally up to the task over the course of the 38 games. They stuck in there last year to the end, which was admirable, but it is easier chasing than staying ahead and we showed last year that we were incapable of sustaining and capitalising on our lead. I think every year that goes without a title adds massive pressure to the club as a whole and the fact that we are moving from star players in their prime (Gerrard/Carra) towards their twlight years adds significant additional strain and I am concerned that we don't lose the balance that the squad was starting to show last year through people trying too hard etc, a la Stevie 4 years ago. It's also key that we keep people fit this year, but currently if Torres or Stevie get knobbled in the first few weeks, we'll struggle again imho.

I guess what I am saying is that it is important to keep up with the pack and show the league that we are serious contenders cos I think that a lot of people are expecting us to fall behind quite quickly and that last year was more of a fluke. I don't think that is the case, but I have my doubts whether we actually have a winners mentality that will keep us at the front over the 40 games. We used to have that 20 years ago and I think we are still regaining that now and it really needs a title to solidify it in the minds of the team and club I think. I expect a bumpy ride this year, but hopefully we will have a good slice of fortune (as is often the way) that just pushes us over the edge.

I also think that a stable environment is essential for the mindset of the team. Let's hope we have a season without any nonsense and allow the lads to stay 110% focused.

How on earth will Manure be harder to beat this year than last when they have lost their main source of goals in Ronaldo plus one of the main strikers Tevez, please explain that one to me.

by **Homebooby** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 2:34 pm

There's not just one thing that I can point to such as a goalscorer or playmaker as you are referring to, it's more a gut feeling than anything. You can win a game 1-0 or 5-0 and I think you will see ManU grinding out a lot of results. I think that they will set themselves up resiliently, be v. hard to score against and nick a lot of wins.

It just seems strange that everyone is writing them off at the moment all because of Ronaldo and Tevez going.

by **Tim LFC** » Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:09 am

bigmick wrote:
The Real Deal wrote:HI Mick

new member here.

Im not getting my hopes up at the start of season. Just beacause I was excited that we started so well last season up until december. 10 pints clear or somewhat, then stevie gets arrested and we could not escape from 0-0 results with stoke (home and away) hull, fulham etc etc and threw it all away.

Im not nervous about the first few games. if we do happen to start well, i just wonder if we can keep it going.

Chelsea ....i expect to be just as strong, esp now under ancelotti. a v. good manager.

Man Utd.... Will be well organised although loss of tevez and Ronaldo (two best players) will mean they will strugle for top 4 finish.Owen, fit , sharp and playing in a good side could come bac to haunt us. i wanted him back at anfield.

Arsenal, loss of adebayor and toure will cost them i feel.

Man city , i think may be a dark horse in the top 4 race. but the players they have got....bellamy, adebayor, barry, tevez, robinho. ..many of them have never won a prem league title so pedigree is a question, so depends how they come together.

for LFC...all about can they keep it going. I just worry if stevie or Torres get a lay off for bit, what will happen. last season we looked a lot weaker without one or other.

Nice post mate, and you're almost certainly right about Gerrard and Torres. We showed last season that we can go without one or the other for a bit, but I think if we either had to do without one for a long period (particularly Gerrard I think) or perish the though do without both for half a dzen matches, we could be out of it quickly.

Yeah i agree. I do think Aquilani or someone like Reira or Kuyt could help Gerrard or Torres if one of the other are out. But i think Aquilani will definitely be in the top 3 of the team now. No more Torres and Gerrard. It'll be Torres,Gerrard and Aquilani. Which will benefit the team as Reira or Kuyt might be able to come more into the game if these 3 really are the pinnacle of the team.

by **paisleyred** » Sun Aug 09, 2009 11:16 am

not worried about upcoming season.
glen johnson will have a major impact marauding down the right giving quality crosses and dirk kuyt as usual giving 100% and covering glens overlapping runs.
benayoun will be eager to make more of an impact after signing a new deal.
dont know much about aquilani but obviously no mug for that kind of dough.
expect at least 1 more signing.
beat manu last season without torres and gerrard.
the preseason games havent been insparational but they show for very little.

by **Sabre** » Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:00 pm

I'm worried this season, and the reason is not Alonso's departure.

The reason I'm worried is that we've been progressing these years, but there were still some areas we could improve. Last season I missed two things to win the league and win those draw games that we could have won: A proper replacement for Torres, and more dynamic game from the right wing (Hopefully Johnson alone will solve that but I'm not sure).

None of which seem to have been adressed in this transfer window when there's a week left to start the league

But in Rafa I trust.

by **tubby** » Sun Aug 09, 2009 2:03 pm

Sabre wrote:I'm worried this season, and the reason is not Alonso's departure.

The reason I'm worried is that we've been progressing these years, but there were still some areas we could improve. Last season I missed two things to win the league and win those draw games that we could have won: A proper replacement for Torres, and more dynamic game from the right wing (Hopefully Johnson alone will solve that but I'm not sure).

None of which seem to have been adressed in this transfer window when there's a week left to start the league

But in Rafa I trust.

Agreed. For the striker problem I am really dissapointed we haven't offloaded Voronin. I was really hoping if we didn't sign a new striker then we could at least use Nemeth or Pacheco as backup but I doubt that now.

by **Tim LFC** » Sun Aug 09, 2009 4:01 pm

I just hope Rafa gets at least one more signing or we try to test our Youth more .

by **Dazzer** » Mon Aug 10, 2009 12:59 pm

I personaly think our biggest problem will defence first 5 games I hope we can get agger back asap.The 2 young lads who steped up vs A.Madrid did as well as we would have expected but I Really don't think they could cope with prem yet.

Wierd tho it might sound , I really think we looked better when Torres come off in that friendly , maybe it was the shape we adopted or maybe it was gerrard moved back alittle more and left space for babel to use in center.Maybe it time to give babel a chance behind Torres and drop gerrard deeper with masch just behind.I don't think I can trust lucus just yet even tho he has shown a large improvement and rafa really is backing him to make his mark.

But don't really matter what little old me thinks it will be rafa that lives or dies by his choices this season and good luck to him.

by **Effes** » Mon Aug 10, 2009 2:40 pm

Liverpool

Spurs (A)
Stoke (H)
Villa (H)
Bolton (A)
Burnley H)
West Ham (A)
Hull (H)

It's all about winning most of your games, as it always is.
I'd take a loss against Spurs if it meant winning the next 5 games.

All those home games are must wins.

Which leaves Bolton away - must win that, they are half the team they were under Fat Sam.

That just means beat Spurs or West Ham away.

So all in all - I expect 6 wins from those 7 games if we are going to have a really good start.

I expect no less than 5 wins, otherwise we are up against it from then on.

Im saying that without even considering the other teams - just concentrate on what we're doing.

by **we all dream...** » Mon Aug 10, 2009 2:56 pm

6 wins from 7 and we will be top of the league and I I am hopeful that it will happen. I think if we beat Spurs we can win all of them but the tough one will be West Ham Away for me, I think Villa at home will be ok..

by **Roger Red Hat** » Mon Aug 10, 2009 3:09 pm

looking at those opening 6 games it realistic to say we'd probably draw most of 'em.

but we wont.

WE'LL STUFF THE LOT OF 'EM!

by **bigmick** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:18 pm

bigmick wrote:I've a feeling anyone who doesn't come out firing on all cylinders is going to be under extreme pressure in terms of keeping up very quickly. Here's a look at each teams opening fixtures:

The Mancs Chelsea Liverpool

Birmingham (H) Hull (H) Spurs (A)
Burnley (A) Sunderland (A) Stoke (H)
Wigan (A) Fulham (A) Villa (H)
Arsenal (H) Burnley (H) Bolton (A)
Spurs (A) Stoke (A) Burnley H)
Man City (H) Spurs (H) West Ham (A)
Stoke (A) Wigan (A) Hull (H)

Arsenal Man City

Everton (A) Blackburn (A)
pompey (H) Wolves (H)
Man U (A) Pompey (A)
Man C (A) Arsenal (H)
Wigan (H) Man U (A)
Fulham (A) West Ham (H)

Now a couple of things are obvious. Firstly, if you were Arsene Wenger you'd want to wreck the computer, secondly, Man Utd and in particular Chelsea have easy starts. We've got to get rid of the monkey on our back of drawing winnable Home games straight away, And we are going to need I think to get at least 5 out of the first 9 points (1 win 2 draws) to be not immediately under pressure.

Does it matter anyway? What do you reckon?

So anyway, we're out and obviously it didn't go according to plan. Suddenly the upcoming games for us and our rivals take on a much more meaningful look, and it maybe stating the obvious but as it's never stopped me before, I'll plough on regardless.

I think the other members of the big five will ALL win their next match (Chelsea Away to Sunderland being IMHO the only potential banana skin) and if we were to fail to beat Stoke, we could concieveably be five points behind all of Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and Man City.

Would we be out of it? Would it be all over? Well no, not exactly, but we wouldn't exactly be in it either.

Are we capable of giving Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal and Man City a five point start and then overhauling them inside 36 matches?

While we ponder that question, suffice to say I think we could really do with winning on Wednesday, big time.

by **burjennio** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:39 pm

Personally i think the title will be won with a lot less points this season, the top 4 do not look as strong and other teams have strengthened and improved, Spurs being the most obvious example as well as Man City, I think a total of 82-85 points could win it (no scientific method behind this, I just cannot see too many 10 game winning runs being put together this season)

by **bigmick** » Mon Aug 17, 2009 9:46 pm

burjennio wrote:Personally i think the title will be won with a lot less points this season, the top 4 do not look as strong and other teams have strengthened and improved, Spurs being the most obvious example as well as Man City, I think a total of 82-85 points could win it (no scientific method behind this, I just cannot see too many 10 game winning runs being put together this season)

I think the points total of the winners depends on a few factors to be honest mate, and sometimes people kind of take it the wrong way when a team achieves such and such.

I think the main reason the Mancs got as many as they did last season for instance was becase they had to. Had we not kept going over those last ten games, I've no doubts they'd have got 6 or 7 points less. Really, us winning at Old Trafford kept the thing alive, had we lost there as we normally do the Mancs would have won it at a canter and would have eased off.

On other occasions other factors have come into play. When Mourinho's Chelsea set the record at 96 points in his first season in England, I think he wanted to make a statement, to get as many as they could. The following season (his second in England) although they absolutely p!ssed the league again, it was won with time to spare and they eased off a bit to 91 points.

My point I guess is that the eventual total will probably IMHO depend less on how much Spurs have or haven't improved, and more upon whether someone pulls clear of the pack. If it's a two way dogfight (the best way of pushing the points total up) then the eventual winners could easily end up with high 80's again. I don't see anyone getting near the record anytime soon though.

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