Liverpool FC Forum

by **Number 9** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:36 pm

Welcome back BigMick ya dildo selling kunt!!

by **bigmick** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:46 pm

Number 9 wrote: Welcome back BigMick ya dildo selling kunt!!

Ah good to cross swords with you too Barry. I look forward to some interesting exchanges. Now your diplomatic immunity as far as the forum is concerned is well and truly established, it may take me a little while to get a grip on the ground rules though so you may have to bear with me for a bit.

by **dawson99** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:53 pm

The most important thing we have learnt is that we can do it. A double over Chelsea and Manure, we believe, and that's more important than anything.
We have also realised that it's 0-0 draws with the likes of Villa and sh!te results against the so called lower teams that have cost us the title... easily rectified.

by **bigmick** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:20 pm

I might as well have a stab at answering my own questions.

1. I think as I touched on earlier we've proven beyond all doubt that on the issue of "styling", we were doing it wrong for a very long time before we "saw the light". Last season we had Torres fit for pretty much all of it, he scored 30 odd goals and we finished in fourth, never ever in it. This season, our star striker has missed half the campaign but we rotated much much less, particularly at the start of the season and we're right in there. It's not ALL because of rotation (people won't read that bit but it doesn't matter, I'll put it in anyway) but it's had a significant influence. That's the first lesson we've learned or had already learned, mass roation from game one is not the way to go. I've no doubts whatsoever that we won't be revisiting the more eccentric aspects of the styling with anything like the regualrity we've seen in the past.

2. Wins are everything in the Premiership. I remember being called allsorts for suggesting that we were wrong to settle for a point at the Emirates once Fabregas had been carried off and Adebayor incorrectly sent off. Similarly, when Wigan equalised at the JJB and we took our attacking threats off, those of us who bemoaned the decision copped loads. The draws at Home were dismissed, as were those who contemplated that they might cost us. As of now though, it all looks different. If we manage to beat Arsenal this week but don't win the title, we will have the incredible, unbelieveable record of having taken 16 points out of 18 against the big four clubs and STILL failing to win the title. Nobody will ever do that again, that is a certainty. To be in a situation where you have a six point edge over both Chelsea and the Mancs, and a four point edge over Arsenal and yet still not win it would be quite incredible. If it does come to pass, it's quite simply because we didn't chase wins with enough hunger. The hunger we are showing now, if displayed throughout the season would have seen us only needing to fall over the line as of now to win it. Hopefully a lesson learned there.

3. It is possible to get under the skin of Ferguson and rile him up, making him come out with ridiculous statements. Whether it actually advantageous to us or not is by the by, the manager has certainly riled him. On this question, I note that man Utd played a considerably weakened team in the FA Cup semi final (and lost, as teams generally do when they do that). I wonder if there's even a slight possibility that Rafa's hounding of him has made him even more determined to win the league, even more hell bent on not risking players in the less important FA Cup. Seeing his mate Moyes take Everton to the FA Cup final wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for him either. We learned (or at least I have) that you can get to Ferguson, whether it does you any good or not though is still to br proven.

4. I think the Keanegate issue is/was obviously huge and there'll be plenty of debate on that, as indeed there already has been. I'll not go into that here as it'll derail the thread (such as it is :laugh:

) but clearly there are lessons to be learned there too.

5. Don't buy Italian left backs.

by **Number 9** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:24 pm

bigmick wrote:
Number 9 wrote::D Welcome back BigMick ya dildo selling kunt!!

Ah good to cross swords with you too Barry. I look forward to some interesting exchanges. Now your diplomatic immunity as far as the forum is concerned is well and truly established, it may take me a little while to get a grip on the ground rules though so you may have to bear with me for a bit.

I was genuinly pleased to see ya mate! :sniffle

by **Fowler_E7** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:46 pm

Regardless of were we finish this season, we still need significant investment in the playing squad for next season as the squad is still pretty short on top quality players, IMO we have probably played above ourselves with the players we have at our disposal, i would say that Man Utd and Chelsea still have considerably better quality players than we have, but we have developed a real team spirit this year and the team really seems to be working hard for each other which is excellent. many of the players have been together for a few years now and that familiarity is clearly showing this year, especially the last few months.

I would still say all our problems on the pitch stem from a lack of good players, i wouldnt say we need loads of new players but a few more good quality players and next season we could maybe set the pace in this league rather than do the chasing.

by **fivecups** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:55 pm

bigmick wrote:3. It is possible to get under the skin of Ferguson and rile him up, making him come out with ridiculous statements. Whether it actually advantageous to us or not is by the by, the manager has certainly riled him. On this question, I note that man Utd played a considerably weakened team in the FA Cup semi final (and lost, as teams generally do when they do that). I wonder if there's even a slight possibility that Rafa's hounding of him has made him even more determined to win the league, even more hell bent on not risking players in the less important FA Cup. Seeing his mate Moyes take Everton to the FA Cup final wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for him either. We learned (or at least I have) that you can get to Ferguson, whether it does you any good or not though is still to br proven.

It may be that you're right about this Mick, obviously we're just speculating, but it used to be all about going for the quintuple with United - now it's all about equalling Liverpool's title record. You've got to wonder if the slanging match shifted his priorities a little bit towards the league.

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:59 pm

Lesson learned - football is a game of 90 minutes. Never give up until the final whistle has sounded.

Lesson learned - if we win the league, we'll have learned our lessons.

That is all.

by **fivecups** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 10:00 pm

Fowler_E7 wrote:Regardless of were we finish this season, we still need significant investment in the playing squad for next season as the squad is still pretty short on top quality players, IMO we have probably played above ourselves with the players we have at our disposal, i would say that Man Utd and Chelsea still have considerably better quality players than we have, but we have developed a real team spirit this year and the team really seems to be working hard for each other which is excellent. many of the players have been together for a few years now and that familiarity is clearly showing this year, especially the last few months.

I would still say all our problems on the pitch stem from a lack of good players, i wouldnt say we need loads of new players but a few more good quality players and next season we could maybe set the pace in this league rather than do the chasing.

Great post - completely agree.

The problem here is that as a club, in financial terms, we are significantly poorer than United or Chelsea. Compared to United - we have less gate income, less sponsorship and less income from TV rights.

At the minute, it's hard to know were the money is going to come from. Hicks defaulted on his latest interest payment on debts of nearly $400 million. I'd say he's been hammered by the global financial crises. I hope some of the Emirate states are still interested because I'd say we could be up for sale in the very near future.

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 10:07 pm

Fowler_E7 wrote:Regardless of were we finish this season, we still need significant investment in the playing squad for next season as the squad is still pretty short on top quality players, IMO we have probably played above ourselves with the players we have at our disposal, i would say that Man Utd and Chelsea still have considerably better quality players than we have, but we have developed a real team spirit this year and the team really seems to be working hard for each other which is excellent. many of the players have been together for a few years now and that familiarity is clearly showing this year, especially the last few months.

I would still say all our problems on the pitch stem from a lack of good players, i wouldnt say we need loads of new players but a few more good quality players and next season we could maybe set the pace in this league rather than do the chasing.

I'm not so sure about this now. On current form, the squad we have is outperforming these so called teams with massive financial backing. We need a world class back up for up front, and a world class winger and probably a back up for Arbeloa. Three key players. That is all. I'd take a quality winger and a quality striker. Enough for us to do some serious damage in any competition.

by **Number 9** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 10:16 pm

Emerald Red wrote:
Fowler_E7 wrote:Regardless of were we finish this season, we still need significant investment in the playing squad for next season as the squad is still pretty short on top quality players, IMO we have probably played above ourselves with the players we have at our disposal, i would say that Man Utd and Chelsea still have considerably better quality players than we have, but we have developed a real team spirit this year and the team really seems to be working hard for each other which is excellent. many of the players have been together for a few years now and that familiarity is clearly showing this year, especially the last few months.

I would still say all our problems on the pitch stem from a lack of good players, i wouldnt say we need loads of new players but a few more good quality players and next season we could maybe set the pace in this league rather than do the chasing.

I'm not so sure about this now. On current form, the squad we have is outperforming these so called teams with massive financial backing. We need a world class back up for up front, and a world class winger and probably a back up for Arbeloa. Three key players. That is all. I'd take a quality winger and a quality striker. Enough for us to do some serious damage in any competition.

And a central defender for Skrtel!!
After that we are good!

by **JC_81** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 10:29 pm

If we have only learn one thing from this season let it be that you don't need a complete overhaul of the squad every season to progress - quite the opposite.

Of our signings last summer, Degen and Cavalieri don't really count as they've basically not played. Keane has been and gone. Dossena and Ngog have a handful of starts between them. So basically we've only really added one significant player to the team this season - Riera, who is a player and while not being top class, does have a bit of quality about him. We've kept a fairly similar team to last season and been a lot better. Continuity has been the key imo, with few but better quality additions.

Another thing we have learned is not to screw about with the Gerrard-Torres partnership. Keane upset the balance and it didn't work. Keep these two in the positions they are in, and build the team around that. I'd go all out and sign one really good attacking player to play with them - ideally someone who is versatile enough to play on the right when Gerrard/Torres are fit, and maybe fill in for say Gerrard if he is out. Then I'd sign a decent, not top, quality striker as backup for Torres.

Our first XI may not look as good as Chelsea's or United's on paper, but collectively it's as least as good if not better. It's lack of decent backup in attacking positions that's cost us.

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 11:03 pm

john craig wrote:If we have only learn one thing from this season let it be that you don't need a complete overhaul of the squad every season to progress - quite the opposite.

Of our signings last summer, Degen and Cavalieri don't really count as they've basically not played. Keane has been and gone. Dossena and Ngog have a handful of starts between them. So basically we've only really added one significant player to the team this season - Riera, who is a player and while not being top class, does have a bit of quality about him. We've kept a fairly similar team to last season and been a lot better. Continuity has been the key imo, with few but better quality additions.

Another thing we have learned is not to screw about with the Gerrard-Torres partnership. Keane upset the balance and it didn't work. Keep these two in the positions they are in, and build the team around that. I'd go all out and sign one really good attacking player to play with them - ideally someone who is versatile enough to play on the right when Gerrard/Torres are fit, and maybe fill in for say Gerrard if he is out. Then I'd sign a decent, not top, quality striker as backup for Torres.

Our first XI may not look as good as Chelsea's or United's on paper, but collectively it's as least as good if not better. It's lack of decent backup in attacking positions that's cost us.

Oddly enough, Craig, your last point there just doesn't stand up. Why? Because we've scored the most goals in the league in all competitions now for what looks like two seasons in a row.

by **Dundalk** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 11:15 pm

Welcome back Mick..

I think this season we have learned to believe. If we don't win it this season we now know that we are capable of winning it. In other season its always been a possibility but now we know it can be done.

The experience we have learned from this season will be invaluable also. For the first time in a long time we are in a title race in April and it will do the players, fans and manger no harm to learn from the experience of coping with the pressure of it all.

We have learned that we are a strong team going forward if we want to be and not to be afraid of going anywhere and winning. Its worth noting that this season we have won away at Real Madrid, Man United and Chelsea

by **JC_81** » Sun Apr 19, 2009 11:27 pm

Emerald Red wrote:
john craig wrote:If we have only learn one thing from this season let it be that you don't need a complete overhaul of the squad every season to progress - quite the opposite.

Of our signings last summer, Degen and Cavalieri don't really count as they've basically not played. Keane has been and gone. Dossena and Ngog have a handful of starts between them. So basically we've only really added one significant player to the team this season - Riera, who is a player and while not being top class, does have a bit of quality about him. We've kept a fairly similar team to last season and been a lot better. Continuity has been the key imo, with few but better quality additions.

Another thing we have learned is not to screw about with the Gerrard-Torres partnership. Keane upset the balance and it didn't work. Keep these two in the positions they are in, and build the team around that. I'd go all out and sign one really good attacking player to play with them - ideally someone who is versatile enough to play on the right when Gerrard/Torres are fit, and maybe fill in for say Gerrard if he is out. Then I'd sign a decent, not top, quality striker as backup for Torres.

Our first XI may not look as good as Chelsea's or United's on paper, but collectively it's as least as good if not better. It's lack of decent backup in attacking positions that's cost us.

Oddly enough, Craig, your last point there just doesn't stand up. Why? Because we've scored the most goals in the league in all competitions now for what looks like two seasons in a row.

Oddly enough, Red, it doesn't matter who has scored most goals in the league or in all competitions, it's the spread of goals that counts.

United are ahead of us in the league and have gone further in every cup competition. I'd say that's primarily because they have more attacking players likely to make the difference in games than we have. If Rooney and Ronaldo are off form/ injured, they have Berbatov and Tevez who can be the game breakers. While Torres and Gerrard are as good a front two as any in world football imo, we lack a good plan B when they're injured/ off form, hence we need more depth in attack, so I stand by my opinion.

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