Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:04 pm

Does kuyt stay out wide and dribble round everyone mate ?

by **ConnO'var** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:05 pm

Good post andy....

For me, Lucas always looked like he had in him but was more than likely a little star-struck.... can't be easy to ask to fill the boots of such luminaries like Gerrard, Mascherano and Alonso. Plus he's probably settling in a little better.... I've always noticed that players from South America take a little longer to bed-in... The English lifestyle, language and weather takes some getting use to for people from that region.

For the other 3, I think it's a case of confidence.... now that we're winning and winning well, the pressure must be off of them a wee bit. Kuyt, I've always felt, was a good hardworking player.... a valuable player but certainly not 1st team material in a title chasing squad.

For Babel, I think he finally realises that if he doesn't produce the goods, he'll be gone... and most likely to a much smaller team. So he's putting himself about a bit more in the hope of impressing. Personally I still think he's a waster..

Dossena..... is a bit of a mystery.... He's good enuff but doesn't suit the way we play defensively..... maybe that's why he's doing better in midfield. Strange though.

by **112-1077774096** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:10 pm

GYBS wrote:Does kuyt stay out wide and dribble round everyone mate ?

is he capable of dribbling round people?

anyway we already have a kuyt thread for this discussion, lets talk about all the mentioned players.

Lucas couldnt have really got any worse, he looks a different player.

Babel I believe has the ability to go far, I just feel he is not suited to the left, what with being a forward and right footed.

Doss also looks a different player when attacking, he has benefited from the more positive football we have been playing

by **RUSHIE#9** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:16 pm

It's a fair point. A Lot of us (including myself) are very quick to moan, groan and bitch at the play of these guys so it's only fair that they receive the praise for their current form.

In the past month or so Dossena has undoubtedly been the most improved player within the squad and this must be down to playing in a position he finds more comfortable and suited to his game. It shouldn't be allowed to cloud the issue that he's still poor in the position he was bought to fill. That is the reason why I think that his position in the squad is still questionable.

Lucas has been the target for most of the criticism this season and although I don't agree with booing our own players I think a lot of that criticism is justified. He's had a few decent games of late but he still isn't good enough as a squad player never mind 1st team player in my eyes.

As a whole the 'SCAPEGOAT 5' are probably benefitting from the surge in confidence that is flowing through the squad at the moment. Kuyt is the only one though that has shown he is capable of holding down a regular place in Rafa's starting 11. Benayoun is a decent option to have on the bench but Babbel just looks as though he's gonna turn into a dutch version of Collymore.

by **anfieldadorer** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:29 pm

i think rafa's verdict has been proven on the players. he has always said that those players need sometimes before fitting into the system, and today we can see it starts to work after some more games at some given level of stages been introduced and at some stages benefit the players. the development of the overall team also helps the players, including the spines in reina, carra (with his favorite position), gerrard and torres. however, i think there's still some huge spaces for lucas and babel to explore. but remember that lucas and babel were not bad players with their youth reputation. i think they should be patient, they're not in bad hands.

by **GYBS** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:36 pm

peewee wrote:
GYBS wrote:and as for digs against you peewee - i think your getting a bit paranoid - you have already helped ruin one thread lets not start again on another thread. I wasnt digging at anyone so lets not read into something that isnt there in the first place.

i never said it was a dig at me, but nonetheless it was a dig that other posters have picked up on and responded to. In fact i am not aware of any poster who has not given him credit when he has played well. Lets stick to facts and then there can be no misinterpretations

How about stick to the thread instead of ONCE AGAIN trying to create a flame war ok .

I will stick with my inital post as it is what i have seen ok - end of discussion with yourself .

by **Judge** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:38 pm

i do believe peewee is sticking to the thread, and has explained that gybs !!

by **JoeTerp** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:39 pm

Although not a lot came of it against Fulham, I did like to see Lucas getting forward a lot more. He would have been right there had yossi's back heel hit the post. I have also seen Lucas look pretty good when attacking crosses. He seems a little less comfortable jostling for position on long deep balls from a goal kick, but he can elevate reasonably well and just needs to work on his accuracy with his head. Lucas also looks much more of a goal threat when he plays for the reserves or in pre-season friendlies where there is less pressure.

by **JoeTerp** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:45 pm

Rafa Benitez today hailed the contributions of Lucas Leiva and Andrea Dossena to Liverpool's fantastic winning streak.
The duo were both strong contenders for the man of the match award in Saturday's 1-0 victory over Fulham at Craven Cottage and the Reds boss is tipping the pair to continue their impressive form.

"My idea about Lucas has always been the same," said Benitez. "He is a good player and a good professional and he always looks to do his best for the team.

"Against Fulham he played really well and was working very hard and it was clear that he is now playing with more confidence.

"It is good for the fans to see someone like this because they know that he will keep on trying for the team and keep on working hard.

"With Dossena it is slightly different because we asked him to play in a different position for the good of the team at Fulham and he did a good job.

"We wanted someone to give the left hand side of midfield some energy and Dossena did that even though he is normally a left back and we were very pleased with him.

"He could maybe play there again in the future because he showed that he can do a good job."

Dossena was unfortunate not to find the back of the net against the Cottagers as the Italian full-back struck the crossbar twice in the first-half.

However, having scored in Liverpool's emphatic victories over Real Madrid and Manchester United last month, Benitez believes the 27-year-old is currently high on confidence.

"When you buy a foreign player you know that you have to be patient," added the Anfield boss.

"It is always better to wait a few months before talking about how good they are and in recent weeks Dossena has been doing a good job for the team.

"He has scored goals against both Real Madrid and Man United and he had more opportunities to score against Fulham because he was getting into good positions."

by **GYBS** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:48 pm

Like i said Judge end of discussion where he is concerned - im not going to get dragged into what i witnessed this morning .

I think you got it right there about Lucas Joe- when he first started he seemed a bit unsure of which role he was playing - the masher one sweeping up in front of the back four or Xabi spraying the ball about without out actually just playing to his own best abilities and just playing his own game which is short simple passing - looking for tidy clever one twos and attacking crosses into the box . If he plays his natural game he hopefully will get more confident and come in the games a bit more .

by **heimdall** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:52 pm

stmichael wrote:
andy_g wrote:i think kuyt is the only one that can make a genuine claim to the starting 11 most games - partly because he does anyway and partly because i think he is starting to make the position his own. despite that i'm loving seeing benny in form - maybe that is what is pushing kuyt on even more, though i think the guy is probably able to motivate himself enough to give 100% every game. i'm happy to see kuyt and benny sharing the wide right position in a similar way that riera and babel were for much of the early part of the season.

The problem with the Kuyt haters (they know who they are) is that they only look at what he does wrong instead of what he does well. Yes he doesn't excite the way Aaron Lennon does for example does but then Aaron can't cross and doesn't score as many goals as Kuyt.

How are these players who play for teams below us in the league more effective than Kuyt? He's the fourth highest midfield scorer in the Premiership. He's also been involved in some damn intelligent play (example, Torres's goals against Everton) and was involved in most of our important goals this season. He was one of the most hated figure last season and he won almost everyone over since then.

So do you consider him the 4th best midfielder in the league then?
He is an important player, Kuyt that is, but he's still rubbish with the basics like being able to control and pass the ball.
Having said that I have never ever seen him loose heart and he keeps going th efull 90 minutes adn I have a lot of respect for that. He should be in the squad but never a regular first XI player.

by **heimdall** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:55 pm

peewee wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:That last bit is spot on Owzat - Kuyt is prime example - people will get on his back the minute he does something wrong with the normal he is sh ite etc etc but will never give the guy credit when he does well .

actually i have not been a fan of kuyt, but have recognised his effort, and ive also given him credit where it is due. so i post my thoughts on both sides of the coin

your argument falls down my friend

even me, his biggest critic praises him when he plays well, but admitting that would stop gybs pretending he is the only fan on the forum,

just give the digs a rest gybs

I would like to argue that I'm an even bigger critic of Kuyt, yet I also give him credit when he does well. You really have to give this line of argument a rest GYBS becuase it is simply not true, show me the peoster who always criticises and never gives praise, where is this invisible imaginary poster who only you can read?

by **heimdall** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:58 pm

GYBS wrote:Does kuyt stay out wide and dribble round everyone mate ?

Now you mention it I can't recall ever seeing Kuyt dribbling past another player, but I guess he isn't that KIND of a player right?

by **GYBS** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:59 pm

That was the point in my post :help

by **heimdall** » Tue Apr 07, 2009 3:02 pm

GYBS wrote:Like i said Judge end of discussion where he is concerned - im not going to get dragged into what i witnessed this morning .

I think you got it right there about Lucas Joe- when he first started he seemed a bit unsure of which role he was playing - the masher one sweeping up in front of the back four or Xabi spraying the ball about without out actually just playing to his own best abilities and just playing his own game which is short simple passing - looking for tidy clever one twos and attacking crosses into the box . If he plays his natural game he hopefully will get more confident and come in the games a bit more .

You fecking hyporcrite GYBS, you come out with yet another snide and completely bullsh1t comment about posters not being fair to Kuyt but when picked up on it, instead of being a man and apologising, you start accusing other people of starting a flame war, you really are a miserable worm with zero contribution to this forum other than to annoy and disrupt perfectly good threads.

To the subject of the thread I think it is only players who massively fail to impress who are made into scapegoats and Babel, Lucas, Dossa and Kuyt have all done this although they are showing big signs of improvement recently.

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