Liverpool FC Forum

by **puroresu** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:05 pm

Yes. After 5 years we still struggle hugely when Gerrard is not in the side. Why does Rafa deserve a new big contract? It's been 5 years and no title. Give him another 4 or 5 and still there will be no title.

by **roberto green** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:08 pm

Lets get mourinho he wil sort us out.(not messing by the way)

by **boodiddy1** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:10 pm

It isn't just this season is it? The number of times we draw at home to smaller teams is unbelievable. We (if you are honest) are not enjoyable to watch. We are far too negative and regimented in our play. The players only express themselves when we get ourselves into the brown stuff.

Rafa will continue to cause mayhem, even with new owners. He did it at Valencia when they were flying. "i ask for a table and they give me a lamp". I wonder what he will say when he leaves this great club?

For me, i want a change! But, this is the main thing, who would take over with the club as it is? We can forget the mourinho's, MON etc.

What i'd love but i'm not sure could happen is; King Kenny back at the helm with someone like Molby as his number two.

I grew up on Liverpool football, and i'm tired of this stagnent, diabolical and regimented footie.

Sorry, but your time is up. :angry:

by **puroresu** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:15 pm

boodiddy1 wrote:It isn't just this season is it? The number of times we draw at home to smaller teams is unbelievable. We (if you are honest) are not enjoyable to watch. We are far too negative and regimented in our play. The players only express themselves when we get ourselves into the brown stuff.

Rafa will continue to cause mayhem, even with new owners. He did it at Valencia when they were flying. "i ask for a table and they give me a lamp". I wonder what he will say when he leaves this great club?

For me, i want a change! But, this is the main thing, who would take over with the club as it is? We can forget the mourinho's, MON etc.

What i'd love but i'm not sure could happen is; King Kenny back at the helm with someone like Molby as his number two.

I grew up on Liverpool football, and i'm tired of this stagnent, diabolical and regimented footie.

Sorry, but your time is up.

We draw far too many games and for anyone to suggest its the way we play isnt the problem is crazy. We dont play good attacking football. As you said you only seem to see real intent when we are in trouble. We never go out to beat sides by as many goals as possible and if this is the case after 5 years then no way will it change under the current Manager. Some people try to cling onto the excuse of teams come to Anfield playing 10 at the back but fail to mention our rivals get the same treatment as well. We need a change!!

by **parchpea** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:44 pm

If its true hes turned down 5 contract offers theres a good chance he wants to go anyways and it looks like he will use the alleged control issues within these deals as his get out card. Personally if I had put 5 offers on the table and someone knocked each one back I would assume they dont want the job so hopefully he will walk away. Maybe he wants us to beg him to stay and then write his own job description before he will extend :no

by **Greavesie** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:46 pm

I've been back and forth on the matter and the questions raised by TheBaron are my concerns. While there is no assurance of money, a godd replacement or fear of a player exodus Rafa has to stay at the club

by **bigmick** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:51 pm

parchpea wrote:If its true hes turned down 5 contract offers theres a good chance he wants to go anyways and it looks like he will use the alleged control issues within these deals as his get out card. Personally if I had put 5 offers on the table and someone knocked each one back I would assume they dont want the job so hopefully he will walk away. Maybe he wants us to beg him to stay and then write his own job description before he will extend

This "demand" for control though would be all very well if it was being made from a position of strength. It's now looking likely that over his five year tenure, we'll have won an arguably fortuitous (some people do argue it) Champions League with most of the players he was left, and an FA Cup. Let's be honest here he's hardly uprooting trees, and this is while he has had the services (free from transfer liabilities) of arguably the best player in the World at the moment.

People keep asking "well who else is there?" and it's a good question. If you look at what the new manager if he comes in has to live upto though, surely we must be able to find someone. We need someone who can match a record which is likely to read no trophies in three seasons and a top four finsih in the Premiership, while being able to spend on a par with every other club in the Premiership bar possibly one or two at the most.

When Ferguson fecks off, or when Mourinho fecked off, or dare I say it when Wenger fecks off, they aren't easy to replace. Managers who win feck all though are not to hard find alternatives to.

by **tonyeh** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:26 pm

I'm still somewhat undecided. I'd like to think that Benitez would look at this season (and last season too) and change some of the obvious problems with his approach to the game (we all know what they are). But reality tells me that he won't, even if we come 4th again.

We may scrape a lucky CL again (I don't believe we will) and that may save Rafa's career again for another contract, but that only means we'll have to put up with more of the same Rafa nonsense we've seen this season, next year, with the same results probably. We've blown a massive chance to secure the title and handed Man Utd parity in titles. That's a big deal for me and I don't think we'll get the same lucky breaks next season.

I've been talking to a lot of "others" over the last few weeks, Arsenal fans, Spurs fans, Chelsea fans etc and they all have nothing against Liverpool...but they think Benitez is a farce and agree with each other that he is holding Liverpool back. In fact, a Villa supporter said to me that he believes that if Liverpool had Martin O'Neil in charge (plus the same lucky streak in the season) they probably would have won the title this year. And I have to say, I didn't really have a good comeback for that. Honestly though, O'Neil has done wonders with the current Villa squad, which is of less quality than ours and although they have benefited from an off colour Chlesea and Arsenal too, I can't help wondering what O'Neil might have done with Liverpool's squad this year.

by **Sir Roger** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:10 pm

Those of us who are not wearing rose tinted specs or are guilty of blind loyalty will see that this was always going to happen
I said long ago that we wouldnt win the league while Rafa was manager
I see no reason to change that opinion

He is stuck in his ways and too stubborn to change

The sad thing is we could have won it if only he would have listened

by **bigmick** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:13 pm

Someone posted this up on the Times online.

The table below represents the clubs net spend per season from the beginning of season 04/05 to date. This was the season that Rapha Benitez became Liverpool manager. Purchases is the total spent on buying players, sold is the total received from the sale of players and Nett equals the Purchased minus Sold giving a total of the money spend on players.

The per season column gives an average of the money spend in each season in the corresponding period season 04/05 to date. The columns are total spend, total sold, net spend, and average spend per season.
# Net Spend 04 - 09 Purchased Sold Nett Per Season

1 Chelsea £221,450,000 £90,300,000 £131,150,000 £26,230,000
2 Manchester City £171,020,000 £49,900,000 £121,120,000 £24,224,000
3 Liverpool £215,490,000 £98,030,000 £117,460,000 £23,492,000
4 Tottenham £230,800,000 £137,250,000 £93,550,000 £18,710,000
5 Manchester United £169,350,000 £76,050,000 £93,300,000 £18,660,000
6 Aston Villa £95,150,000 £21,255,000 £73,895,000 £14,779,000
9 Sunderland £80,580,000 £11,650,000 £68,930,000 £13,786,000
7 Newcastle £120,750,000 £83,400,000 £37,350,000 £7,470,000
8 Middlesborough £62,200,000 £32,500,000 £29,700,000 £5,940,000
10 Everton £80,100,000 £54,200,000 £25,900,000 £5,180,000
12 Arsenal £102,050,000 £81,720,000 £20,330,000 £4,066,000
11 West Ham £75,145,000 £61,625,000 £13,520,000 £2,704,000
13 Portsmouth £77,700,000 £71,010,000 £6,690,000 £1,338,000
14 Blackburn Rovers £36,100,000 £36,290,000 -£190,000 -£38,000

Some interesting numbers there, but i don't know how reliable the stats are.

This is the site http://www.transferleague.co.uk/

by **JC_81** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:29 pm

I think Benitez has had enough if I'm honest. I think there is a very real chance that he won't be here next season - not because the club will sack him, but because he'll walk. And if I was a betting man I'd be sticking money on him being Madrid boss next season.

by **puroresu** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:35 pm

john craig wrote:I think Benitez has had enough if I'm honest. I think there is a very real chance that he won't be here next season - not because the club will sack him, but because he'll walk. And if I was a betting man I'd be sticking money on him being Madrid boss next season.

Why Madrid would want Rafa I have no idea. He will be another Capello where the style of football comes 2nd to the results. That isnt acceptable at Real.

by **JC_81** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:38 pm

puroresu wrote:
john craig wrote:I think Benitez has had enough if I'm honest. I think there is a very real chance that he won't be here next season - not because the club will sack him, but because he'll walk. And if I was a betting man I'd be sticking money on him being Madrid boss next season.

Why Madrid would want Rafa I have no idea. He will be another Capello where the style of football comes 2nd to the results. That isnt acceptable at Real.

I tend to agree. I think if or when Benitez takes the Madrid job, he won't last long.

by **welsh wizzard** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:40 pm

Its starting to annoy me now Rafa is losing the majority of the fans i feel !! He has become so negative with team selection and tactics, he has messed up big time in getting rid of robbie keane and no replacement, i would have kept him and gave the lad a chance.
He has a way of shattering very good players confidence Keane, Crouch, Aggar, etc to name some, the players we have now likes of Dossenna, lucas, degan, babel these are players just average and when called apon are not taking there chances and looking the part. Our squad is very thin and we just haven't the quality in depth. We were better when we had likes of Crouch, Garcia, risse, finnan, to call on to fall straight in when thay were needed.
When Alonso is missing especially this season we have no cutting edge in midfield, Lucas is a joke Brazilian do me a favour he just keeps giving the ball away. Dossena italy's no1 left back god help them lol,
It has just become totally frustrating now all these games at home ending in draws under a more attack minded manager we would have won these games, Rafa i just think has run out of ideas in how to prepare his team for the premiere league. I feel we need a manager in the mould of martin o'neil who knows the league and can get the best out of his players and give them confidence, m.o.n would have had this team at the top now and them draws would have been wins most anyway.
Rafa is champions league through and through but we want the league and under RAFA i just dont think he will ever get us NO19.

by **account deleted by request** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:44 pm

bigmick wrote:Someone posted this up on the Times online.

The table below represents the clubs net spend per season from the beginning of season 04/05 to date. This was the season that Rapha Benitez became Liverpool manager. Purchases is the total spent on buying players, sold is the total received from the sale of players and Nett equals the Purchased minus Sold giving a total of the money spend on players.

The per season column gives an average of the money spend in each season in the corresponding period season 04/05 to date. The columns are total spend, total sold, net spend, and average spend per season.
# Net Spend 04 - 09 Purchased Sold Nett Per Season

1 Chelsea £221,450,000 £90,300,000 £131,150,000 £26,230,000
2 Manchester City £171,020,000 £49,900,000 £121,120,000 £24,224,000
3 Liverpool £215,490,000 £98,030,000 £117,460,000 £23,492,000
4 Tottenham £230,800,000 £137,250,000 £93,550,000 £18,710,000
5 Manchester United £169,350,000 £76,050,000 £93,300,000 £18,660,000
6 Aston Villa £95,150,000 £21,255,000 £73,895,000 £14,779,000
9 Sunderland £80,580,000 £11,650,000 £68,930,000 £13,786,000
7 Newcastle £120,750,000 £83,400,000 £37,350,000 £7,470,000
8 Middlesborough £62,200,000 £32,500,000 £29,700,000 £5,940,000
10 Everton £80,100,000 £54,200,000 £25,900,000 £5,180,000
12 Arsenal £102,050,000 £81,720,000 £20,330,000 £4,066,000
11 West Ham £75,145,000 £61,625,000 £13,520,000 £2,704,000
13 Portsmouth £77,700,000 £71,010,000 £6,690,000 £1,338,000
14 Blackburn Rovers £36,100,000 £36,290,000 -£190,000 -£38,000

Some interesting numbers there, but i don't know how reliable the stats are.

This is the site http://www.transferleague.co.uk/

I still believe the most frightening figures are the ones not shown in your table Mick. FIFTY-ONE PLAYERS BOUGHT and FIFTY-SIX PLAYERS SOLD. Thats an average of over 10 players in and 10 players out per season! Throw in a goalkeeper and you have a first team

Liverpool FC Forum

All things Rafa (merged threads) - stick yer Rafa sh'it in here

Who is online