Liverpool FC Forum

s@int wrote:I think thats the problem though mate

Warnock v Dossena
Guthrie v Lucas
Pongole v N'gog

Is the difference worth the cost and the trouble and the high wages? Bring in Torres for Mellor and no one is going to complain really. But when you bring in poor  or average players instead of giving a decent prospect a chance ...... thats when people get a little annoyed.

s@int wrote:

GYBS wrote:

s@int wrote:I think thats the problem though mate

Warnock v Dossena
Guthrie v Lucas
Pongole v N'gog

Is the difference worth the cost and the trouble and the high wages? Bring in Torres for Mellor and no one is going to complain really. But when you bring in poor  or average players instead of giving a decent prospect a chance ...... thats when people get a little annoyed.

But both warnock and pongolle had chances with us and never shone and guthrie had a whole season playing in the prem and didnt pull up any tress .

To be fair neither have Dossena, Lucas or N'gog so far.

GYBS wrote:But both warnock and pongolle had chances with us and never shone and guthrie had a whole season playing in the prem and didnt pull up any tress .

GYBS wrote:well ngog hasnt had the chances that pongolle had same with dossena but he has managed to become first choice italian left back and lucas in my opinion has shown himself to be better than guthrie .

Mintal27 wrote:

GYBS wrote:But both warnock and pongolle had chances with us and never shone and guthrie had a whole season playing in the prem and didnt pull up any tress .

Pongolle shone enough to be back up. He is certainly better than Kuyt and better than Voronin. We went one step forward in selling Pongolle and then went two steps back when we signed Kuyt and Voronin a season or two later.

Warnock again was immense against Leverkusen and with enough match experience in the first team would have improved. Sometime reserve players like foreigners come into a club and need time to settle in to start producing. Warnock like Pongolle never really got enough of a chance to perform.

Guthrie was quality at Bolton, he was one of their best players.

Mintal27 wrote:

GYBS wrote:well ngog hasnt had the chances that pongolle had same with dossena but he has managed to become first choice italian left back and lucas in my opinion has shown himself to be better than guthrie .

Everytime N'Gog has come on its like we are playing with ten men and its the same with Dossena, he's so sluggish that he reminds me of Pellegrino. If we as a team are going to ship out the likes of Warnock, Pongolle and Guthrie then you need to sign better players in their place and nothing I have seen from N'Gog, Lucas or Dossena lead me to believe that they are an improvement. We have swapped like for like in some regards.

GYBS wrote:but pongolle didnt want to be just a back up and wanted to go so that point is mute . warnock had plenty of games for us but was never going to get ahead of riise and aurelio who at the time where both better than him and warnock also wnated more first team football and has for guthrie being a star player for bolton doesnt really say much and i myself never saw that anytime i saw him play same again when seeing him for newcastle .

I'm not saying we shouldn't have sold Warnock, Pongolle and Guthrie but we should have signed better replacements. As for Riise and Aurelio neither are good enough for this club. Aurelio would be decent back up with Insua taking the reigns as starter LB. We sold Guthrie and signed in Lucas, when we could have held onto Sissoko and of course sign Mascherano later on. The same with Pongolle, we sell him and sign in the likes of Voronin. Where is the improvement. It's as though Rafa has sold a lot of deadwood and then signed more deadwood players who aren't up to the bill.

Last summer I was expecting good signings following the Torres one and I was bitterly disappointed to see some Brazlian goalkeeper sign for us when we already had some French one, a left back when we already had Aurelio and Insua was getting rave reviews in the reserves, a right back who I knew was poor as I watch Bundesliga, a striker who looked great when he played alongside one of the best strikers in Europe and a French player who couldn't even break into the Paris Saint Germain first team.

Dossena looks worse than Traore. The back up keeper is as poor as the French one, we might as well have saved our money, sold the French one and kept Carson. N'Gog is no better than our strikers in the reserves and Degen who is an extremely poor player is a sicknote. And for an extra ten million we could have launched a bid for one of the Premierships best strikers, Berbatov.

The signings at this club keep getting worse and worse.   

GYBS wrote:Ngog has played a total of 9 times - prob starting a couple and got himself on the scoresheet with a cracking finish plus he did well in pre season as well - the guy is still young and got plenty of time and would say 9 games mainly as a sub is hardly enough to rate someone not good enough . dossena has played 17 times in his first 6 months and has taken a lot of time to settle but played well in his last game .

Also those players didnt arrive as replacements for both warnock or pongolle

Mintal27 wrote:

GYBS wrote:but pongolle didnt want to be just a back up and wanted to go so that point is mute . warnock had plenty of games for us but was never going to get ahead of riise and aurelio who at the time where both better than him and warnock also wnated more first team football and has for guthrie being a star player for bolton doesnt really say much and i myself never saw that anytime i saw him play same again when seeing him for newcastle .

I'm not saying we shouldn't have sold Warnock, Pongolle and Guthrie but we should have signed better replacements. As for Riise and Aurelio neither are good enough for this club. Aurelio would be decent back up with Insua taking the reigns as starter LB. We sold Guthrie and signed in Lucas, when we could have held onto Sissoko and of course sign Mascherano later on. The same with Pongolle, we sell him and sign in the likes of Voronin. Where is the improvement. It's as though Rafa has sold a lot of deadwood and then signed more deadwood players who aren't up to the bill.

Last summer I was expecting good signings following the Torres one and I was bitterly disappointed to see some Brazlian goalkeeper sign for us when we already had some French one, a left back when we already had Aurelio and Insua was getting rave reviews in the reserves, a right back who I knew was poor as I watch Bundesliga, a striker who looked great when he played alongside one of the best strikers in Europe and a French player who couldn't even break into the Paris Saint Germain first team.

Dossena looks worse than Traore. The back up keeper is as poor as the French one, we might as well have saved our money, sold the French one and kept Carson. N'Gog is no better than our strikers in the reserves and Degen who is an extremely poor player is a sicknote. And for an extra ten million we could have launched a bid for one of the Premierships best strikers, Berbatov.

The signings at this club keep getting worse and worse.   

GYBS wrote:you do know that sissoko didnt want to stay cause he was nothing more than back up ? you cant keep hold of players all the time just as back up - some of them in fact most of them want to play regular first team footy so they leave - just like crouch . add carson to that list as well . and when exactly did this striker we signed look great alonside torres ? and Ngog was in the PSG team and they didnt want to sell him but we got him cheap cause of a clause

Mintal27 wrote:

GYBS wrote:you do know that sissoko didnt want to stay cause he was nothing more than back up ? you cant keep hold of players all the time just as back up - some of them in fact most of them want to play regular first team footy so they leave - just like crouch . add carson to that list as well . and when exactly did this striker we signed look great alonside torres ? and Ngog was in the PSG team and they didnt want to sell him but we got him cheap cause of a clause

Sissoko was sold, it was nothing to do with him not starting. Yes, you can keep hold of players, the players sign contracts and it is their obligation to fulfill those contracts unless the club sell them before the expiry date. And N'Gog was not a first team player at PSG.

GYBS wrote:So you would make them stay to fulfill their contracts just so they are decent back up for us then ?

Mintal27 wrote:

GYBS wrote:So you would make them stay to fulfill their contracts just so they are decent back up for us then ?

I would make them stay if no viable replacement had been found and had signed for the club. You replace members of your squad with better players than the ones already present, that's the objective every manager should take into the transfer market.