Liverpool FC Forum

by **Dalglish** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:21 am

Ciggy wrote:I am asking why do you post this tonight when a few of us have had our doubts about rafa yet cannot express them because we get slated for Rafa outers. and its looking like you are one tonight mate.

What is it now 7 draws out of our last 8 games its not good enough. Whats the word on the terraces the faces where enough they spoke a thousand words.

I think I can be disappointed with Rafa without wanting him out Lyns, thats my perogative (and yours or anyones for that matter).

This season though Rafa's demenaour and behaviour has bordered on paranoia at times and I suppose with the turmoil in the boardroom it's little wonder but he appears to me to be a man on the edge to be perfectly honest.........

His outburst over Fergie was IMO embarrassing and the sight of him clutching his "notes" whilst delivering his tirade smacked of someone out of control...............

The whole "Keanegate" affair has been handled very poorly and when Rafa refuses to sign his contract because he wants overall control on which players to buy then we need to know the following :

Did Rafa sanction the signing of Robbie Keane for £20 Million ?

If the answer is Yes then like previous Rafa signings Crouch, Morientes and Fowler before him he needs a run of games.

If the answer is No then Rafa is right to hold out on his contract and get control of who he buys.

But he can't have it both ways.

I hope I'm wrong hun but I think the Titles as good as gone

Whether that means that Rafa ought to be gone as well is a matter of opinion.

For the record I don't think he should go as he is one of a select few that "fit" the Liverpool Way and we have lost enough of that already in the last couple of years.

Walk on ..............

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:54 am

I stand by what I said last season and again earlier this season. You don't change horses halfway through a race. There is still a lot of football to be played between now and the end of the season. Reassess the situation once the season is over regarding Rafa and his contract. No trophies again and 10 or more points off the title and I think he should go.

I thought Rafa was correct to throw down the gauntlet to Fergie, results since have unfortunately proved it a mistake, but I thought he was right at the time, and I do not believe it has affected the players or our results in the slightest.

Maybe because I didn't want us to sign Keane in the first place I am a little more forgiving where Rafa's treatment of him is concerned, but a managers job is to pick the best team not the most expensive players.

We still have two chances to win the league...... Slim and none. I just hope Slim doesn't leave for London with Chelsea.

edit I think 10 points was too many .....5 or more points off the title.

by **slickrick** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 3:10 am

all we can hope now is chelsea win the league and not them other scum

by **The_Rock** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 3:44 am

Gosh...this one result and look how many have turned against benitez (especially in the RAWK forum where the members are berating him).

My take...... i think benitez's loyalty to a few players (especially lucas & kuyt ) is what is undertermining him ....

Anyway...moving on, if there is anything bright to look at ...its that....... i think Benitez has finally learnt (going by post-match interview where i heard he was fuming......raging rafa hehehe)...

Its quite ironic. When we had our best performance against newcastle certain members here pointed out correctly that a negative to take out of that performance is ...... that benitez will be open to making more bold (ie...strange) decisions in terms of starting line-ups and substitutions.. So you can say the reverse now... After going through countless draws...he has to change his methods now. He has to. There is no way he can continue to make these decisions. No one is that stubborn to continue to make the same mistakes again and again right ?

And this will put us on a good "frame-of-mind" in the champions league... Whatever he has learnt in the league...i am sure he will put it to good use there. So my prediction of FA and Champions league double is still valid :buttrock

by **The_Rock** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 3:50 am

peewee wrote:well well well, some of the morons who have given me stick over the years for my stance on rafas lack of ability and lack of tactical nous and his negativity are starting to realise at last just how right i was. don't even get me started on his continued selection of kuyt.

no need to embarrass yourselves in here, i will accept apologies via pm

Original members of "benitez...out" clique......

by **bigmick** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:06 am

Well leaving aside and "bashing" or "gloating", I can still see that we have a chance and I'm surprised some others can't tbh. Once again I'm stressing that I'm saying this forgetting about form and the fact the manager seems to have gone off his head, but purely from our position in the table and the number of matches left to play, we have a chance.

Let me explain my thinking.

I think we have to take it as a given that not only do we have to beat Chelsea at the weekend, but we'll also have to win at Old Trafford as well. Now although that is a tall order to win both games, it's possible. If we run with the idea, and assume that us beating Chelsea cements our position in second, and from then on we match the Mancs (I know but hear me out). If we go there and win, we are right back in it and no mistake. If our next match was at Old Trafford and we won it, we'd be a point ahead of them having played a game more. Now how much of a chance you'd give us over there is up to you, but we would have some sort of chance, and clearly if we won we would be right in the mixer.

Obviously whatever happens between now and then, should we lose at Old Trafford or in all probability draw even, we are gone.

So there you have it. If you factor in a Home win against Chelsea, and an Away win against Man UTd we are serious contenders again. Despite the repeated feck ups, this is STILL the best chance we've had for years. It's by no means as impossible as many people feel right now.

by **akumaface** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:10 am

In a perfect world, we are still in it as we still have to play both Chelsea and Man U. But unless we win virtually every game from now on, we will not win. I have already accepted the fact that it is highly unlikely that we will win this thing as we had already squandered so many chances to pull away. Regardless of the Keane situation, is Rafa's intention not to put the best team on the pitch simply he believed it was the best team or he did it for his own personal reason? If it is the former, then I would forgive him more easily. If it is the later, I'm sorry to say that he needs to go. It really baffers me about how Rafa's select his players. Is it based on attitude? Effort? Personal Favourite? Performances? It seems no matter which criteria it was, it still seems to contradict and after these years he was in charge, he had really become flawed by his stubborness. The thing that I'm worried about now is most of the players had lost their confidence with Rafa in charge.

by **bigmick** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:16 am

Just checked it out on the Betfair and we're 10/1 for the league which is probably a bit skinny IMHO. Chelsea are 9/2 while the Mancs are around 2/5. My point is quite simply that if we beat Chelsea at the weekend we will almost certainly flip flop with Chelsea, perhaps into around 6/1. We wouldn't be the first 10/1 chance to get up though, and if Rafa can revisit his mindset at the start of the season when he had seemingly got over his more eccentric tendencies, then it's certainly possible.

I can't I must say see the manager opting to go back to minimal rotation and generally piking his strongest team, nor can i see him going all out for wins like he appeared to then. If he does though, we do have a chance still I think. Unfortunately, the danger of going for it and actually finishing outside of the top four will probably dissuade him from really chancing his arm. Equally, it won't be long now before the Champions League comes around, and though he has continuously made noises to the contrary I should think we'll see heavily rotated teams in the Premiership in order to facilitate a tilt at his favourite competition.

by **red_guy** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:17 am

To be positive Mick, i'd agree that the win against Chelsea at Anfiled and Man Utd at Old Trafford would make us serious contenders and winning the league is not impossible..it's definitely do-able. Anyway, the problems with us are the screw ups against smaller teams, wrong choices of players (lucas,babel,kuyt) , afraid to take risk (plays safe won't get you anywhere) etc. If we managed to look at the problems and ready to make a change, we have a mighty good chance of winning the premiership. But the thing is i don't know if we're ready or willing to do that.

by **red_guy** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:21 am

On a lighter note, most of my friends (liverpool fans of course) do think Kuyt and Lucas giving Rafa a BJ , week in week out in order to get games.

by **The_Rock** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:37 am

Just got a SMS from a manure supporting colleague that Fergie was interviewed by BBC and he mentioned he was absolutely delighted with our result....

Fergie got no class at all......

Hope gerrard prints the article and pastes it in our lockerroom....if this doesn't get the lads fired up against chelsea...nothing will.

by **112-1077774096** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:47 am

to be fair though rock he is hardly going to say he is devastated by the result

by **The_Rock** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 4:54 am

peewee wrote:to be fair though rock he is hardly going to say he is devastated by the result

He has every right....but he should shut his mouth cos he is pi$$ing me off. Can't wait for this idiot to retire..... It will all be downhill for manure after that (if they don't get mourinho that is) so all the more we should...........if benitez leaves.

That's my mourinho pop for the day.....gotta hide before lando comes after me....

by **boodiddy1** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 6:36 am

WE AINT IN THE TITLE RACE ANYMORE. THAT SHIP HAS SAILED. WE MUST CONTEND FOR THIRD AND FOURTH WITH VILLA AND ARSENAL.

Rafa must sell the likes of babel, yossi, lucas, kuyt, keane and get some real width and another striker to help nando. Still can't believe crouchie went.

by **bigmick** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 6:56 am

OK THEN. I THINK I'VE GOT THE MESSAGE!

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