Debate - Sensibly

Please use this forum for general Non-Football related chat

Postby aCe' » Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:22 pm

tonyeh wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:once we get legit democracies all over the world, there wont be any more wars.

Really?

"Democracies" like Israel the world could do without, IMHO.

Just because a Country embarks on a "Democratic" path (Though TRUE Democracy has never really existed) doesn't mean there will be no more war.

exactly... while in theory the concept of a democracy might sound idealistic to many, the fact that there never was, and there never will be a perfect democracy, means that the concept as a whole is vastly ooverrated by most...

most countries are operated in a mixed political and economical environment that include democratic and socialist operations and agendas...

the people of israel couldnt all possibly be in agreement of their governments methods when it comes to policies related to palestinian and middle eastern policies..

the only way to stop wars is by changing the philosophical basis of every country at a given time... in other words getting every country to agree to follow the richest/most powerful/largest..etc country blindly... while many countries do that at the moment, the few who dont are the ones who are seemingly causing problems... as bush puts it.. "if ur not with us, ur against us"... ur basically labelled a danger to world peace and u automatically classify as a fckin terrorist..

anyways... cant see anything changing for quite some time... if anything, things can get alot worse before they get better.
User avatar
aCe'
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 6218
Joined: Sat Jul 22, 2006 8:47 pm
Location: ...

Postby tonyeh » Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:26 pm

As long as Israel have the unquestioning backing of America, they will continue to act as the Mid East bully boy, because any UN resolution or action will be guaranteed to be vetoed by the US, meaning that the UN with all the good intention in the world is impotent in this situation.

While Israel talks about "having the right to defend itself", no fair minded or objective observer can possibly condone their actions (both past and present). Targeting clearly marked schools and UN compounds, knowing full well the consequences of striking such an institution is indefensible given the sheer weight of military superiority (both numerical and technological) that Israel possesses.

Israel may alledge that Hamas are "using schools to launch rockets from", but this simple off-hand excuse is the usual unprovable one that Israel have been tossing out for years now and it's still a very poor one.

No matter how many rockets Hamas fire into Israeli occupied land, Israel will still be the aggressor nation, due to the fact that they illegaly occupy Palestinian land and concentrate a group of people into easilly controlled camps severely restricting the lives of those people.

No other Nation on Earth will be allowed to get away with this.

The will be only one solution to this and that is Israel must get out of the occupied areas, offer the right of return to Palestinians who were ethnicaly clensed in 1948 and most importantly recognise the right of a Palestinian state to exist.

Israel may keep banging on about the right of their nation to exist and for Hamas to awknowledge that, but that's a two way street.
User avatar
tonyeh
 
Posts: 2397
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:41 pm
Location: Dublin

Postby account deleted by request » Sat Jan 10, 2009 5:50 pm

BAM SAYS :-

I'm no real big fan of the Americans, but lets get one thing straight here as there seems to be a fair bit of America bashing going on here. Its a tad Ironic I feel to hear someone like Emerald Red blowing Bubbles about the Yanks when twenty 40 years ago or so I doubt he would of condemed the Americans for aiding the IRA with funds and weapons. To help his fellow countrymen sorry "ex"-countrymen , in their fight for independence against the British.

But feck it hey, lets forget about any of the deemed "good" the Yanks have done for some. And crucify them for the fact they back the Israeli's in this war in the Middle East. Are people that naive to firstly hold America accountable for the Israeli/Palestinian war thats older than the USA itself. Secondly and more importantly are people really that naive to see why the Americans "back" Israel ?

I'm happy in the know that the Americans have got a finger in the pie when it comes to that Godforsaken place (The middle East) apologies to MH. A massive and fundamental part that people obviously dont realise is. To ensure a tight grip on Global economics and Politics which I might add I'd rather the Yanks have than the French, Irish, Swiss, Afghnanies (imagine that!), Iraq (again imagine that), the Russians ?, the Chinese the Germans the list is endless who I'd rather not see as the one superpower call the shots, so to speak. And before anyone asks why should a superpower be just that and 'call the shots' WWII is the answer. We never want o see something like that happen again and I believe as long as the Yanks have their strategics in place i.e a finger in the pie in the Middle East another in South America, the South Pacific and anywhere else on earth where they deem its important to strategically locate themselves, I'm all for that.

Yes they go about things sometimes in the wrong way, yes they f.uck up, yes they shoot allied planes down out of the sky. But like your big brother you stand by him no matter what, Britain and Australia will ALWAYS stick by the Yanks. Because they know the World is a better place with America leading the way than the unknowns of China, N.Korea, France Afghanistan or any other country at the helm. Could you imagine what the world would be like if you gave Bin Ladern or any other extremist Muslim the Finance and Power the Amerians have. I tell you what, you'd be singing a totally different tune had the Russians, Afghanies or anyone else had the Global pull the Yanks did.

So I ask, try to remember what the World would be like if the Yanks didnt have much needed strategical allies in place. Some of you also may do well to remember the President Elect, Obama who had some admittedly in tears and professed on here to others .. "He'll change things for the good". One things for sure, he wont drop ties with the likes of Israel to satisfy the Commie view. He cant afford to and neither can we.
account deleted by request
 
Posts: 20690
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2006 5:11 am

Postby Number 9 » Sat Jan 10, 2009 5:58 pm

Bams spot on!

BOUT TIME THE LAD WAS ALLOWED BACK AS WELL!!

Sort it out mods! :)
Image
User avatar
Number 9
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 7601
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:19 pm
Location: South Belfast

Postby metalhead » Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:23 am

Number 9 wrote:BUT..WTF are Hamas at?Its their fault.Just stop firing stupid crude homemade bombs indiscriminately into Israel..its really that simple!I back Israel 100% in what they are doing.They just want to live in peace but are protecting its people.

so basically you think its justifiable killing over 200 Children and over 700 Civilians? ???

Do you really think Israel, right now reached their goals in stopping the missiles?

Do you really think that Hamas has the same cause as Al Quada in wiping out every ''infidel'' and turning the world into an extremist muslim world?

Hamas is created for one reason only! to resist Israel and drive invaders out of THEIR land.
ImageImageImage
User avatar
metalhead
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 17476
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 6:15 pm
Location: Milan, Italy

Postby Emerald Red » Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:39 am

JoeTerp wrote:once we get legit democracies all over the world, there wont be any more wars.

Well, that's clearly bollox, and I really don't understand America's infatuation with forcing democracy down the necks of those who don't really want it, or at least their version of it. No matter what, people will always find something to argue over. There will always be ways of life to ensure; people will always have different opinions and that's the trouble with the world. If someone else has it, others will want it. Democracy in the end means literally f*ck all, because one man's democracy is another's bane. And of course there's the paradox that with democracy there is politics, and politics bring indifference of opinion, and as through the span of time, it is mostly the politician that starts the wars. Well, in a modern democratic society anyway.
Image
User avatar
Emerald Red
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 7289
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2007 3:22 pm
Location: Ireland

Postby metalhead » Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:15 pm

Jack Bernstein

very good read
Last edited by metalhead on Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ImageImageImage
User avatar
metalhead
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 17476
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 6:15 pm
Location: Milan, Italy

Postby maypaxvobiscum » Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:45 pm

hey Metalhead, hows it going in Lebanon? last i heard from you, Israel tapped into your telecommunications network?
User avatar
maypaxvobiscum
 
Posts: 9665
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2007 7:02 am
Location: Singapore

Postby Judge » Fri Jan 16, 2009 4:27 pm

lets wish maypax happy 23rd birthday for later this month now

as i fear he will be assasinated before then :D
Image
User avatar
Judge
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 20477
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 11:21 am

Postby metalhead » Fri Jan 16, 2009 5:00 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:hey Metalhead, hows it going in Lebanon? last i heard from you, Israel tapped into your telecommunications network?

woah, that was last year :D
ImageImageImage
User avatar
metalhead
>> LFC Elite Member <<
 
Posts: 17476
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 6:15 pm
Location: Milan, Italy

Postby maypaxvobiscum » Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:19 am

metalhead wrote:
maypaxvobiscum wrote:hey Metalhead, hows it going in Lebanon? last i heard from you, Israel tapped into your telecommunications network?

woah, that was last year :D

was it in december? its counted as last month too! stop making me look off the scene man. Judge will have a field day he is already plotting my downfall.  :D
User avatar
maypaxvobiscum
 
Posts: 9665
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2007 7:02 am
Location: Singapore

Previous

Return to General Chat Forum

 


  • Related topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 36 guests

  • Advertisement
ShopTill-e