Liverpool FC Forum

by **Thewaykokid** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:26 am

I have a feeling that Benitez surprised Fergie with the comments he made, and it wasn't because the comments where hurtful or abusive, but simply because he actually MADE a comment. Seems our manager has grown a pair

by **Reg** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:00 pm

Great article, exactly the kind of support Benitez needs. If Fergie gets rattled, it will filter down to his team.

Forza Rafa !!

by **GYBS** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:08 pm

its quite funny before the stoke match everyone was praising him and calling him god etc etc then couple of days later its open season on him . Man for man the 11 he picked on sat were better than the stoke 11 and once that white line is crossed its up to the players to get the result and they didnt and a lot of blame in fact most of it should go to the 11 plus subs as man for man they were poor and not good enough and that includes our world class , top class , prem class and decent players . All need to have a look at themselves and wake up and start fighting again like they did at the start of season . Hopefully this will be a massive kick up the :censored:

for them .

by **tonyeh** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:19 pm

GYBS wrote:its quite funny before the stoke match everyone was praising him and calling him god etc etc then couple of days later its open season on him . Man for man the 11 he picked on sat were better than the stoke 11 and once that white line is crossed its up to the players to get the result and they didnt and a lot of blame in fact most of it should go to the 11 plus subs as man for man they were poor and not good enough and that includes our world class , top class , prem class and decent players . All need to have a look at themselves and wake up and start fighting again like they did at the start of season . Hopefully this will be a massive kick up the for them .

Hmmm...not everyone.

by **aCe'** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:42 pm

GYBS wrote:its quite funny before the stoke match everyone was praising him and calling him god etc etc then couple of days later its open season on him . Man for man the 11 he picked on sat were better than the stoke 11 and once that white line is crossed its up to the players to get the result and they didnt and a lot of blame in fact most of it should go to the 11 plus subs as man for man they were poor and not good enough and that includes our world class , top class , prem class and decent players . All need to have a look at themselves and wake up and start fighting again like they did at the start of season . Hopefully this will be a massive kick up the for them .

so basically what ur saying is that teams like ManUtd, and Chelsea and ourselves dont need managers ?

absolutely ridiculous !

the lineup AND setup were both wrong and for that you have the manager to blame... you will never convine me that its the players' fault that they went out and looked lost against a poor side that was there for the taking...

by **GYBS** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:07 pm

not saying that at all . The players arent bloody stupid and clueless and know how to play the game , they have been playing it for long enough to know what to do . They have to take a lot of the responsibilty of what happens during the game , they are the ones kicking the ball , they are the ones that get the credit when we win and they get the headlines when win so they should also get the critism when they dont perform and dont play well and win . The manager picked 11 players good enough to win the game , they got to go out and get that win .

by **heimdall** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:15 pm

GYBS wrote:not saying that at all . The players arent bloody stupid and clueless and know how to play the game , they have been playing it for long enough to know what to do . They have to take a lot of the responsibilty of what happens during the game , they are the ones kicking the ball , they are the ones that get the credit when we win and they get the headlines when win so they should also get the critism when they dont perform and dont play well and win . The manager picked 11 players good enough to win the game , they got to go out and get that win .

Ok so at what point does Rafa get any blame or is he completely immune to any criticism? Almost everyone agrees he should have started with Keane for example.

I'm fairly certain that even if Rafa walked up to you and booted you in the crotch you'd still find some way of defending him

by **GYBS** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:22 pm

did i say rafa should be immune from any blame ? No i didnt . All we have had so far is people blaming rafa or the normal scapegoats ie kuyt and lucas yet all the players on show were shi t and not good enough .

by **Homebooby** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 2:46 pm

s@int wrote:Graham Poll takes Man Utd boss Alex Ferguson's side in refereeing row
By Administrator on Jan 13, 09 08:05 AM in Journalists
FORMER Premier League referee Graham Poll believes Liverpool manager Rafael Benitez was wrong to claim his Manchester United counterpart Sir Alex Ferguson gets under the skin of match officials.

Benitez argued that Ferguson's criticism of referees was "killing" them, and claimed the FA have not acted strongly enough.

But Poll claimed last night: "What I would say about refereeing at Old Trafford is it's the place to go and referee in the Premier League - because it's the biggest one, so that's where referees aspire to.

"The first time you go there, of course you're going to be nervous; of course you're going to be tentative and you're well aware of reputations.

"But once you're an experienced referee it doesn't make any difference. You go out and referee completely impartially to the best of your ability.

"It's a slight on the top referees to say they are intimidated by Ferguson, because I don't think they are."

Poll also dismissed suggestions Sir Alex exerts any more pressure on referees that other managers at games. He said: "He doesn't do any more. What he does, he does better. That I think is the key."

Pundit Poll described Benitez's attitude to referees as "almost ambivalent" and claimed referees have "no contact" with the Liverpool manager at matches, claiming Ferguson is more personable.

What does everyone think about this? I know it happens, but I idealistically don't think it should.

In my opinion the ref can walk to the players before a game and outline what he wants to see, but I don't agree with them having any contact with managers unless it is on official territory.

That in a nutshell I think is what Benitez is referring to as well.

Why would a manager need to speak to a ref at any point? You wouldn't go up to a policeman and discuss the way he is going to apply the lawbook to you would you?

by **redbeergoggles** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:15 pm

big al wrote:Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Like so many people on here my first instinct on Friday night was 'good for you Rafa' but as the night wore on and the fans feedback came in I could'nt help thinking what a big bloody mistake Rafa had made. Some of the more considered fans on here were also saying the same thing and fair play to them for being so insightful.

Theres is no doubt a lot of truth in what Rafa was saying about Ferguson, I bet only the Manc fans would disagree. However the mistake Rafa made was in timing. He made what was a very important issue appear to be casued by his own insecurities as a manager. Had he raised this issue earlier in the season then the Mancs would not have been able to counter his statements in the way they have.

I am not the most objective person to say this but the truth is ' Ferguson is the blue eye of the British media.' In their eyes he can do no wrong. Alex Ferguson stands for everything that is the British establishment and added to this is the hatred the media have of Liverpool. I live in Ireland so whilst I am a Liverpool FC fan I hope I am ojective enough to see the absolute downright prejudice that the British media have of the people of Liverpool. No other city in England is treated with such distain as Liverpool is. The sterotyping of Liverpools people by the media is an absolute disgrace. For those of you who believe that the Sun newspaper printed the lies it did about Hillsbrough without any prior malice then think again. The gutter press would only and could only have printed such dispicable stories because they envolved Liverpudlians.

Some people may think that I am now ranting but the fact is I am writing this with calm and in a very collective state. Whenever I see reports in the media about the city of Liverpool I see slanted journalism which seeks to show everything Liverpudlian in a prejudicial and maligning fashion. The little Englander superiority of the newspaper media is based at looking down its nose a scousers who are either, thieves, drug dealers, con-sters or rouges.

Calling Rafa's attack on Sir Alex Ferguson a 'Rant' was inevitable. Remember Sky Sports belongs to Rupert Murdock who in turn owns the Sun newspaper. I watch the smiles of sky sports reporters when comments from Manc fans came rolling in saying Sir Alex had wound Rafa up, they loved it.

My work mate reminded me today of a conversation we had about a month ago when I said that Rafa was to only manager who was oblivious to Sir Alex Fergusons rants. I obviously spoke to soon.

With hindsight what Rafa did was bring pressure on his own side against Stoke, detracting from game and then fire Man U players up. To be frank, yesterdays preformance by Man U was their best all season thanks to Rafa. He should have chuckled praised Ferguson for his achievements and picked the right team to play Stoke.

One last thing. On Friday night he told Stoke how he was going to play. He expected them to push forward as they were at home. He felt that if they did this Liverpools counter attacking football would eventually open them up. Stokes manager in the end knew how Rafa was going to play and was set up to defend the point they started the game with. The biggest failing of Rafa has been his inability to change things around and I dont mean players hes a bloody genius at that. No he needs to take risks. Winning the premiership is about taking risks. Rafa only takes risks when we are behind, when he does take risks his players very rarely fail to come through. He needs to do this in some games from the start and he needs to keep quiet. Rafa Should read Kiplings 'IF' I hope Im not breaking any copywrite by adding it here. I draw your attention to the first verse.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

IF.....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

IF you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:
If you can dream - and not make dreams your master;
If you can think - and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
And stoop and build 'em up with worn-out tools:

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breathe a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: 'Hold on!'

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
' Or walk with Kings - nor lose the common touch,
if neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much;
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run,
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Good post Al ,as always well penned.
I consider Benitez's words at the now already infamous press conference needed to be said, and i applaud Rafa for his valour ,sometimes it takes a really strong character to martyr himself for the greater good .
I honestly believe Rafa knew he would court a certain amount of ridicule and deemed this essential,lets face it the press and the sycophants and all those who refer to Taggart as Sir Alex ,would be oblivious to its call to arms ,but it would hit home at grass roots level ,real fans would no the importance of Rafa's profound message

I am not naive enough to expect Rafa's message to make a real difference ,but for every fan who still cares about the game, its saying its not just us who find Fergusons monopoly of the game despicable ........"HERE HERE RAFA BENITEZ"

by **tubby** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:25 pm

Just in from the BBC.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/7827052.stm

Benitez 'close' to Liverpool deal

Liverpool manager Rafael Benitez has revealed he is close to signing a new deal at Anfield after agreeing the length and salary of a new contract.

Benitez, 48, revealed there are still some points that need discussing before he puts pen to paper.

"We have agreed the length of contract and we have agreed the salary.

"Now we have to discuss my role and my responsibilities as manager of the club," the Spaniard told the Liverpool Echo paper.

It had been reported that a potential stalling point for any new deal was that Benitez wanted complete control over transfers. 606: DEBATE
All Liverpool fans want the same thing and that is the league and I believe under Rafa we can win it

Alonso_Must_stay

But the Liverpool manager denied there were any problems between him and the club's American co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett over the remaining terms of the deal.

"I don't have any problems at all with the American owners. My agent only received the draft document of my contract on (Monday) evening," he said.

"My surprise is that some journalists can talk about there being problems before I have even read it properly and discussed it."

Details of the length of the contract and the salary offered to the Liverpool manager have not been announced.
-------------
Sounds good imo.

by **Reg** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:33 pm

Fergietwat is off again !!!!!!!
++

From The TimesJanuary 13, 2009

Irate Manchester United manager Sir Alex Ferguson goes on attack again

Sir Alex Ferguson is furious that the man who presided over Patrice Evra's disciplinary hearing is an Arsenal season-ticket holder
Oliver Kay, Football Correspondent
Sir Alex Ferguson is on another collision course with the Football Association after being infuriated by the discovery that an Arsenal season ticket-holder was chairman of the disciplinary commission that suspended Patrice Evra for four matches last month.

The Manchester United manager has struggled to contain his anger at the FA’s handling of the Evra affair, which related to a fracas involving a Chelsea groundsman during a post-match warm-down at Stamford Bridge last April, but his outrage grew when he discovered that Nicholas Stewart, QC, who chaired the four-man commission, has a season ticket at the Emirates Stadium.

While the integrity of Stewart, a specialist in sports law, is not in question, the decision to appoint an Arsenal fan to oversee the case has been seized upon by Ferguson as yet more evidence of a perceived anti- United conspiracy within the FA.

It emerged last night that Ferguson was so incensed by the discovery that he made reference to it in his column in the match programme for United’s 3-0 victory over Chelsea on Sunday, only to remove his complaint on the recommendation of David Gill, the club’s chief executive.

Gill, a less confrontational figure, shared some of Ferguson’s unhappiness, but was able to persuade the United manager that it was not the time or the place to air such concerns.

Ferguson nonetheless made a more oblique reference to his latest grievance, writing: “I’m still shocked by the four-match ban handed out to Patrice following the incident at Stamford Bridge that saw him at odds with one of their groundsmen. It’s gone now, of course, and the important thing is our full concentration on getting the right result against a team who historically have done well at Old Trafford.”

Evra returned from suspension to play against Chelsea, having missed Barclays Premier League matches against Stoke City and Middlesbrough, an FA Cup tie against Southampton and the Carling Cup semi-final, first leg against Derby County.

United were highly critical of the FA’s handling of the case, both in terms of the severity of the defender’s punishment — Evra was also fined £15,000 — and the lack of action against the Chelsea employee, though they decided not to appeal. The club’s unhappiness grew when the FA published the full details of the commission’s report, including criticism of the testimonies of Mike Phelan, the assistant manager, and Richard Hartis, a goalkeeping coach. Lord Triesman, the FA’s independent chairman, felt compelled to apologise to Gill when they met on December 23.

Triesman tried to dismiss Ferguson’s concerns about an alleged anti-United bias at the FA, but it seems that the Scot is unconvinced. While Rafael Benítez, the Liverpool manager, has infuriated Ferguson with a series of complaints about United in recent days, Ferguson appears determined to intensify his crusade against the game’s establishment.

Neither United nor the FA would comment last night, while Stewart could not be contacted. Stewart, who was called to the bar in 1971 and has been a QC since 1987, is described on the website of Ely Place, his chambers, as “a safe pair of hands” and is also an appeal board chairman and a specialist member of the FA’s judicial panel.

He was appointed to chair the Evra case, where he was joined on the commission by Barry Bright, the chairman of the FA’s disciplinary committee, Roy Carter, of the West Riding FA, and David Pleat, the former Tottenham Hotspur manager.

by **fitforthetitle** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:49 pm

Ferguson 1 Rafa 0 on this one if you ask me . Both teams reactions on the pitch after that press conference clearly show Benitez made a mistake here that could prove very costly.

by **supersub** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 7:54 pm

fitforthetitle wrote:Ferguson 1 Rafa 0 on this one if you ask me . Both teams reactions on the pitch after that press conference clearly show Benitez made a mistake here that could prove very costly.

teams performances nothing to do with press conference..

I did say earlier in the week it was fergie 1 rafa 0 but on reflection I'm glad this is now in the open for journalists to pursue and I'm happy to award rafa with an equalizer :laugh:

therefore the present score is Blotchy 1 Rafa 1

by **tubby** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:08 pm

If come this weekend utd go top then it will be Fergie 1 Rafa 0. The way everyone will it that we dropped points and allowed utd to leapfrog us meaning Rafa allowed his team performance to be affected by the comments.

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