Liverpool FC Forum

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:00 am

Alex G. wrote:Fletcher and Park could play for Liverpool, Benayoun, Dossena, Kuyt, Arbeloa never for Man U or Chelsea.

Honestly, catch yourself on.

by **LegBarnes** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:08 am

Emerald Red wrote:
RedEire wrote:Haven't had a chance to go through all the posts so apologies if this is already mentioned - but how was Dossena left on the field for the full game - twice Mendy got past him as if he was not there - the first time a goal was averted by Arbeloa who backheeled the ball away from Barmby just he was about to tap in and the second resulted in Carra's o.g. - meanwhile his defending for the first goal by letting mcShane get above him was very poor. The reason why it appeared he had a better second half was becuase Mendy was brought back to right back when McShane was taken off and this stopped him from strolling past Dossena. His actual awareness of where his man is also shocking - 3 or 4 times i noticed him twirling around looking for his man and in doing so completely lose the flight of the ball. How he remains on the pitch is beyond me.
As for Keane - feel sorry for him. Kuyt for all his work is not good enough and if he has to play should be out wide and Keane should be played in the box - it is an insult to put El Zhar on ahead of Keane - simple as that. Yes Keane has struggled this season but the simple question is this - Is El Zhar/Ngog better player than Keane???
Gerrard did well to score twice but his overall play today was very poor, I thought. He passing was sloppy and first touch was missing.
Masch is struggling for form at the moment, like Keane, yet is given plenty of game time. Benayoun is not good enough to play for LFC. Riera has gone of the boil at the moment after a whirlwind of a start - perhaps he needs to rested.
Arbeloa is beginning to show that he has the ability and is becoming like Finnan - doing his job and putting in consistent performances - well done lad, as I was one of his biggest critics last year.

Great post. I agree with every word of this apart from the part about Riera going off the boil and Kuyt. Riera could have grabbed us the winner today on a few occasions, and his goal mid-week was something else. He could use a rest, yeah, but who would you play instead? Babel? His starting performances have been dire to say the least, but it's an option. As for Dirk, well I don't really care what anyone says, but every team needs a player to do the ugly work and do it for a full 90+. If you have someone who can defend as far up as the opposition's box when we don't have the ball, well that's a good thing IMO, as most class sides have their work horses. I'm not defending Dirk's ability as a player, which can be argued as not being good enough for us - and I certainly wouldn't disagree - but the fella does his fair share for the good of the team, and for that I just cannot slate him in any way whatsoever. Far too many primadonna's in the game, and Kuyt is a sobering reminder of how players used to be before money grabbed the game by the bollox.

Yep i agree riera was great today I have no idea why he took him off he didn't look tierd.

Should have took benny of and played babel as 2nd striker and gone for the win fully.

Then 5 mins later took kuyt off and gave keane a shot.

by **Number 9** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:08 am

I thought Arbeloa was great

by **Kharhaz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:09 am

Just watched the highlights again on MOTD, and you have to give credit to Hull, even at 2-0 up they carried on playing football and going for the 3rd. But in saying that they worked hard through the match to get the ball of the liverpool players and when they did they didnt seem to know exactly what to do with it and soon enough the ball ended up back in liverpools possesion. So yes there attitute was brilliant but they certainly are not the best team to get a result at anfield.

Which raises another question, what is our problem? We cannot beat teams who come to anfield and just sit there for 90 mins time wasting and fielding ten players on the goal line but also we cannot beat teams who have nowhere near the same talent as what liverpool have and yet we still struggle. Is it down to lack of respect from the lesser teams coming to anfield determined to get a result? or is it a lack of respect from the liverpool players (and management) for the lesser teams themself? When we play in big games we perform, games we have expected to not do well in the club get a result, however against the lower teams we struggle.

Whatever take people have on the substitutes in todays match, and to be honest they puzzled me also, why did our urgency drop once we got back to 2-2? why didnt we go out in the second half and try get that 3rd goal? We got a warning that hull were here to play football and get the win, we also learned that if they get a chance they will take it, we also showed that when we pull our finger out we can pin them back in there own half, and we can also score goals. The debate shouldnt be about the failings of rafas subs, it should be about why the players seemed to be content when they got back to 2-2. Yes we got forward a few times afterwards but nothing like the urgency we showed to get them 2 goals back.

by **LegBarnes** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:10 am

I just don't think we played to bad today I feel the tactics was all wrong we sent out wrong message today we was cautious and that can only spur the other team on.

2 DM is stupid at home rafa needs a good slap to wake up.

Rafa tactics are great in cup comps because we are hard to beat but in the prem you need to show a willingness to go for the win right off the bat and put teams to rest.

by **Thewaykokid** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:16 am

Well, i think we can kiss our short title reign goodbye

by **Kharhaz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 12:20 am

Thewaykokid wrote:Well, i think we can kiss our short title reign goodbye

Not really, chelsea could draw tomorrow, stranger things have happened but even if they do win, we are still only 1 point behind. Im hoping this is our blip for the season. Im as fed up as anyone about our recent home form but lets not lose track of the facts. We are still in it, in a better position than united and arsenal, so there is still hope. We really need to improve though.

by **Reg** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:22 am

Lads we know we're struggling to find a partner for Torres, the lad who was brought in didnt even play today.

Torres is injured and we dont have a replacement for whatever reason. Clearly we need to rotate 3 x 20 million strikers to be assured 3 points from these games, 1 injured and 1 off-form is not sufficient.

It aint the end of the world, just another blip on the long road of life.

by **Effes** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:35 am

Keane should have defo played today - Rafa to blame for that, not saying he should have played
from that start - just saying, he should have played with at least 25 mins to go.

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:47 am

Thewaykokid wrote:Well, i think we can kiss our short title reign goodbye

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:47 am

Thought Rafa should have bought on Ngog and Keane for Kuyt and Mascherano around the 65 minute mark. Rafa is normally good at changing games with subs but got it wrong today. He left it to late and then made the wrong decisions.

by **Kharhaz** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 1:53 am

Cool Hand Luke wrote:Thought Rafa should have bought on Ngog and Keane for Kuyt and Mascherano around the 65 minute mark. Rafa is normally good at changing games with subs but got it wrong today. He left it to late and then made the wrong decisions.

On the 60th I would have opted for the keane on for mascherano sub, it just made sense, mascherano wasnt needed for this kind of game. If we went 442 then kuyt would have had more of an impact. When Lucas came on I was clueless, I no longer had any idea what rafa was hoping to achieve.

by **Octsky** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:14 am

when lucas came on. my link went dead. at the end of the day, arsenal draws man u draws and chelshit most prob will lose to west ham

if todays man u is the late 90's one where peter schmichaels is between the sticks they will probably smoke us by now, likewise to say morinho's chelshit. Arsenal's 04 invincibles was dismantle by wenger himself so we may not just need to have a prefect season to win the league.
if we somehow able to get 3 points out of arsenal next wk, we will have gotten the max 9 points out of the big 3, and kick arsenal out of the race.

by **Bad Bob** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 2:18 am

Gutted with the result today. We went 2-0 down thanks to shambolic defending (Dossena truly is muck) but clawed our way back into the match nicely. We should really have grabbed a lead before half-time and that proved our undoing, as Hull came out in the 2nd half looking to defend what they had and, once again, we failed to break a team down at home when they sit in.

I don't know what the situation is between Rafa and Keane but something's up and it's very worrying. You simply do not leave a striker of Keane's pedigree on the bench in a must-win match even if his form has been patchy of late. Babel might get you a winner, El Zhar might contribute to one but Lucas probably won't and that means the match was crying out for Keane. I'm just baffled by the subs and still smarting from another 2 points dropped at home.

by **The_Rock** » Sun Dec 14, 2008 5:38 am

Kharhaz wrote:Which raises another question, what is our problem? We cannot beat teams who come to anfield and just sit there for 90 mins time wasting and fielding ten players on the goal line but also we cannot beat teams who have nowhere near the same talent as what liverpool have and yet we still struggle. Is it down to lack of respect from the lesser teams coming to anfield determined to get a result? or is it a lack of respect from the liverpool players (and management) for the lesser teams themself? When we play in big games we perform, games we have expected to not do well in the club get a result, however against the lower teams we struggle.

Isn't it easy to guess ?

- when we play $hits like benayoun and kuyt on the right who cut in at every opportunity and make the "already crowded" central area even more congested ...making it easy for opposition defenders to defend. Its that easy. All they have to do is to park 10 players behind the ball. Their defence is not stretched at all. If benitez had bought better wing players (ie...pacy and skillfull fullbacks, wingers) our strikers would have more space to score goals.

- Playing $hits like kuyt for our every game.....Kuyt gives 100% every game...yeah i give him that. But against lower opposition is that needed ? Kuyt is more effective against bigger oppositions (hey...not my word....its beneitz's ...hehe). But against sub-par teams all his headless chicken act does just makes it irritating for viewers to watch.

He has to back down and change his ways. He has brought the club this far (which i admit is good)...but if he doesn't change, then someone else will come in...just tweak a little and hit jackpot (ie...winning the premierleague & champions league).

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