Liverpool FC Forum

by **Scottbot** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:59 pm

It seems to me that there is as much criticism of our performances (on here) as there has been celebration of the results, and this goes for pretty much the whole of the season so far. And as a result I find myself getting pretty frustrated just about every time I come on here. Everyone is entitled to their opinion and I guess a lot of posters can see problems and are simply waiting for it all go horribly wrong. Of course, a couple of losses back to back over Christmas and it could but thankfully those thoughts don't stand in the way of my 'absolute joy' at sitting top of the table. So anyway, please consider this to be a 'positive' thread to discuss what has been going right up until now, save the negative stuff for one of the other threads where it will have plenty of company.

The Defence - It all starts with Reina who, once again has been in superb from this season. Quality player, I wouldn't swap him for any other keeper in the world (and he is one of four players for whom i could say the same). After an on-off season last year Carragher has quietly and confidently re-discovered his top form this time around. The guy has been immense and again, i wouldn't swap him, would you? The full-backs (Arbeloa and Aurelio) - Still a weakness going forward (and one i've posted on many times) however, they deserve credit for the way we have defended. A good back-four doesn't carry players, they are a unit and that is the way they have played this season. Arbeloa hasn't been spectacular (I don't think he can be!) but he has been consistent and Aurelio (when fit) has looked up to the job despite being a little less consistent.

Late wins - This team doesn't seem to know when it's beaten does it?We've always had this ability in the cups (Istanbul, Olympiakos, Luton and West Ham spring to mind) but it has never been that prevalent in the league. Late wins against Boro, City, United, Wigan and Liege (in the Cup) and a late equalizer against Atletico stand us in good stead for the rest of the season. some will say our luck will run out BUT you can bet the team (no matter how badly they are playing) will fancy their chances of pulling something out of the hat when we are a goal (or two) down and you can guarantee the opposition will be thinking the same thing.

Ugly wins - And let's face it most of em have been ugly haven't they? I can't help but think back to Arsenal this time last season. they were playing some of the most spectacular football we've ever seen in the Premier League, it was breathtaking stuff. But it didn't count for much in the end as pundits and fans alike , trotted out the old 'they peaked too early' cliches. Our football hasn't been particularly inspiring but you sense we've got another couple of gears to go through bearing in mind our best football last season came with the same personnel.

The Torres Factor - How much we miss him is underestimated by to many on here in my opinion, it's as if the team should be able to perform to the peaks it reached at times last season WITHOUT our best attacking player. We haven't had a fit and firing Torres at any time this season bar the 2nd half in the derby once he had got his first goal. He makes a MASSIVE difference to our side, I'd argue his presence in the side makes the game 10% easier for just about every other Liverpool player on the pitch. He can tie up an entire back four at once with his clever running, mobility and ability on the ball. Everybody else on the pitch gets a little more time and space with Torres in the side, his strike partner (if he has one), the wide-men and the full-backs all benefit. He makes life easier for everyone. The fact we are doing so well WITHOUT him is a MASSIVE achievement.

Alonso - What a season the lad is having, and thank fook we didn't sell him! I was fairly content to swap him for Barry, I figured it was like for like and that Alonso had really struggled to replicate his form for LFC but he has been EXCELLENT this season. He just seems a step quicker to me this season, he's popping up in positions further up the pitch, influencing our attacking play and bagged his 2nd goal of the season on Saturday. He has outshone the Captain (who is also having a decent season) so far this season and it's almost like having a new signing.

Handling the Pressure - The minute the lads beat Chelsea you sensed a change in the way the club was perceived. the media went on their usual OTT rampage, the players themselves started talking about 'handling the pressure' and the fans suddenly started biting their nails at the thought of us actually being involved in the race for a change. While the anger of a lot of fans/posters is the fact we could be a few points clear at the top if we had swatted (as everyone seems to expect) aside the Stokes and West Hams of this world I honestly think our best hope of winning it this year is for it to be tight with the winner decided in the final couple of games. If we got ahead like Arsenal did last season I sense that the pressure would build, we'd get reeled in and we would sink as they did. does anyone else share this opinion? No-one in the press thinks we are going to win the league this season, not really. The focus is still on the mancs and Chelsea and i'm happy that it is.

What a great position we are in. Playing shi...te and sitting top of the table at the same time! It's not so bad is it!?! It's not all hunky dory with our rivals either. The mancs got lucky against Sunderland (I expected them to put 3 or 4 past them) at the weekend and have got to travel half-way around the world to play the pointless Club World Championship. Chelsea have see their home mystique destroyed just a few months into their new managers' reign, are still struggling for injuries and bizarrely, it seems they have to SELL before they can buy this January! Then you look at Arsenal who have been off the pace, are under pressure from Villa and have just had to sack their crazy Captain for slagging players to the press and had a whole stadium booing one of their players on Saturday.

We've got a tricky Christmas period coming up given the injury to Torres and the form of Keane, Babel and a few others but if we are there or there abouts come the new year I'll be well chuffed...

by **Scottbot** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:08 pm

Think the title should be Glass Half Full! Feel free to change it mods/St.Mick!

by **Judge** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:11 pm

Scottbot wrote:Think the title should be Glass Half Full! Feel free to change it mods/St.Mick!

mods/stmick?

why is stmike singled out

by **Scottbot** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:15 pm

Judge wrote:
Scottbot wrote:Think the title should be Glass Half Full! Feel free to change it mods/St.Mick!

mods/stmick?

why is stmike singled out

Coz he was reading the thread at the time ya numbnuts! And it looks as though he's changed it an all!

by **Fo Dne** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:18 pm

Bah humbug!

by **Scottbot** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:20 pm

Fo Dne wrote:Bah humbug!

Stay outta this thread lad! It's not for you :cool:

by **Sarge** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:27 pm

Scottbot wrote:Playing shi...te and sitting top of the table at the same time!

kinda sweet irony ain't it?

by **Sabre** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:12 pm

I like a lot your thread Scott, the problem is I don't have much to add, because it's spot on.

by **maguskwt** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:29 pm

how can you forget about Riera, Scottbot?

... I think Riera has played a very important role so far this season... the guy is tricky, can take on defenders, doesn't lose the ball too much, a tad slow but his holding up play is superb, has a decent cross and is quick minded... he causes the opponent full backs problems so that their centre backs have to help out this stretches their defence and all our other players have more space... he's been a good buy... a dark horse...

no matter what other people might say about rafa's transfers... I think he has managed to assemble a team that looks pretty classy and surely has the ability to win it all. A team that has gerrard, alonso, mascherano, reina, carragher, agger, torres, riera, keane is a match for anyone in world football...

by **Bad Bob** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:54 pm

Nice one, Scott! :buttrock

I've grown a little frustrated with the persistent negativity 'objectivity' in other threads too. It's all well and good to acknowledge flaws in our performances--and there have been many--but few people seem interested in pointing out what we're doing well. And, sometimes when you do, you get criticized for it. Like you, I'm chuffed to be top of table as we roll into the festive season. Like you, I think we're due to find another couple of gears soon to show what we're truly capable of. Like you, I think a lot of people have underestimated the impact losing Torres has had to our attacking play. And, like you (I'm presuming), I think anyone suggesting that Rafa should be sacked based on our performances to date needs their head tested.

I've highlighted one thing you've said that stands out for me:

Scottbot wrote:If we got ahead like Arsenal did last season I sense that the pressure would build, we'd get reeled in and we would sink as they did. does anyone else share this opinion? No-one in the press thinks we are going to win the league this season, not really. The focus is still on the mancs and Chelsea and i'm happy that it is.

Spot on, as far as I'm concerned. I don't think we quite have the quality nor the mentality to open up a sizeable gap on our competitors and expect to handle the pressure during the run-in. If we're going to win it, we'll do so by flying slightly under the radar and nicking it at the death, IMO. Our aim should be to be in the thick of things come the business end of the season and see how the chips fall in the last few weeks. Pulling out in front of the chasing pack is not something I expect nor something I think will work in our favour down the home stretch.

The only other positive I would highlight is the form of Dirk Kuyt. He's plateaued a bit in the last few weeks, IMO, but was one of our best players for a stretch there when we were finding our feet this season. The various Kuyt slagging threads have gone very quiet and those of us--myself included--who had written him off have had to backtrack a little. So fair play to the lad. He's never gone missing or made excuses...he's simply gotten on with things and has played himself back into some form. With other players off the boil or out injured, that's pretty important.

by **woof woof !** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 6:12 pm

Well, i like to think I'm with the glass half full as opposed to the glass half empty gang, but gotta admit I am saying to myself "half full it may be , but just how big is this glass ? "

Absolutely delighted to be leading the table, but given our lackluster performances week by week I'm wondering how the f'uck we've managed it.

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 6:12 pm

would people rather we stand where we are now in the table and playing how we are, or be 7 points off the pace due to a hypothetical September bliip, but bossed our last 4 games 4-0 looking very good throughout the 90 and shutting it down on the hour and taking off Gerrard?

I think, ESPECIALLY for this team given what has happened the last couple of seasons, its more important to be at the top of the table right now, hoping that it starts to look prettier, rather than hoping we can maintain form and get some breaks while dealing with the pressure of fighting hard just to stay in the conversation.

Its weird that there seemed to be more optimism when we were coming back from behind and snatching late winners and living out on the edge and 2nd to Chelsea, instead of now when we are actually top and gone quite a number of games without conceding a truly meaningful goal.

by **Scottbot** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:42 pm

maguskwt wrote:how can you forget about Riera, Scottbot?

I haven't forgotten at all mate, he's a player I rate very highly and i've given him a lot of credit in the thread about him, same goes for Kuyt. I thought i'd leave a few positives out for others to raise them!

by **Sabre** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 2:35 pm

As I've told you many times, Toshack gives stick to Rafa. Every week these years have talked about his luck, about his signings, about the millions spent.

But, he has joined also the voices that find difficult to understand the stick Rafa is receiving these days. It catched my attention, because when it comes to Rafa he was always a man that saw the bottle half empty.

by **Ciggy** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:11 pm

I think its down to being spoilt and fear.

Spoilt in the fact that most fans take the CL for granted now, Im not even that bothered about tonights game and topping the group is that down to we want the prem more? Or is it a case of oh we have been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
How spoilt have we become since playing in the UEFA Cup.

CL or the prem? BOTH if we can manage it.
What would I prefer then it has to be the league.

Fear:
We have made our best ever start to the prem, we have also thrown away really stupid points, Stoke, Villa, Spurs, West Ham, Fulham. All them games we should have won.
And we know there will be more draws to come this season against teams we should be burying, and this is the fear, thats why a lot of us are scared.

The other two will capitalise on us dropping mindless points, when we fail to capitalise on them dropping points.
Here in lies the problem.

I could be wrong however and I really hope I am.
but what a crying shame it would be if we finish 3rd through no one elses fault but our own.

I am holding my hopes up for the second half of the season, we always play better the latter part of the season, but was that down to Rafa rotating? That our players where fitter?

He hasnt rotated much this season so will our players be knackerd or spring into life, I know we are capable of going on a winning streak of 10 games, and we are still yet to play great in a run of games and not just one offs.

What I have noticed from us this season is that we are incredibly hard to beat, strangling the life out of the other team, its not easy on the eye, infact its quite frustrating at times. The team is being told to be patient by Rafa yet we are running out of patients wanting games dead and buried by half time.

Because at the back of our minds we are thinking the other two are going to knock us off the top of our cliff, we are hanging on there by our finger tips, and I am dreading soon that some b@stard comes along and stands on our finger tips and we lose are grip and fall.

I dont want to think about it but its not going away, but we do have two great players who will be back soon, Skrtell and Torres, plus we might add to the team in January and hopefully we will go on that unbeaten run I was on about.

If anyone would have told me at the start of the season we would be top in December I would have said pull the other, I suppose we just have to enjoy the ride and try stay on as long as we can and in April lift the trophey that we crave the most.

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