Liverpool FC Forum

by **Ciggy** » Wed Nov 26, 2008 11:11 pm

Havent been very good have they? I think we have only played well a hand full of times this season, and have gotten away with it at times.

People say thats the sign of champions not playing well but getting results, games we should have won this season, Stoke, Spurs, Fulham, Athletico away, should have won them all because because we didnt put our chances away.

Its a strange season for me, dont get me wrong I am over the moon joint top with Chelsea, into the last 16 of the CL.

But we have quite a few players out of form and some that are not good enough, The Doss is Dross for a start where did Rafa get him from

banayoun has done fuck all this season even though he is a squad player he is just not good enough he has been complaining about pastures new, well go and graze them lar.

Babel showed so much promise last season as a super sub, but he has been moaning a lot

Pennant has two Ferraris, is out on the ale nearly every night,

Then we have Robbie Keane moanin @rse never been one of my favourites like Bellamy, but I really hope he succeeds I really want him to do well, he is a great player and I really hope it comes good for him here, so far it hasnt.

I wish him all the luck in the world i really do, I have no bad feelings towards him what so ever but never worth the same amount as our Nando never in a million years.

Reira was absolutly over the moon when he arrived what a breath of fresh air..................
What the fuck has happened since?
He has lost the plot.

Sabre did say he would'nt be up to much as did others but come on Albert get yer act together.

We have got to play well some time soon, we usually go on a roll, cant afford many more draws in the league, and when are we going to start finding our shooting boots?

by **metalhead** » Wed Nov 26, 2008 11:59 pm

I wanted to discuss that. I do think we are struggling at Home this season. We used to outplay teams like Marsielle at Home in the CL, beating other teams 4-1 or 3-0, etc... Now we are struggling to get our act together. Surely we are winning those games, I'm happy, but I don't think it will be too long before we start struggling really badly when our players get tired in the second half of the season.

What is it then? rotation? Rafa hasn't rotated as much as he did last year, so I don't think its an excuse. Tactics? No, the tactics has been mostly spot on this season? the players? well, I don't think so, players can have an off day but come back strong.

The only reason that I can think of is quality. I still think we are short of some quality players in our squad. We need a right winger who adds alot of flair and creativity in our side. We need Robbie Keane to be Keane of Tottenham and we need top full backs who are excellent going forward and excellent in defending.

The only tactic part that worries me is the 4-5-1 formation, I'm sorry it doesn't work when we have Gerrard playing behind Torres, it may work against smaller sides, but against tougher ones both players get isolated. I would keep playing a 4-4-2 formation at home, unless we get a playmaker (ala Aimar at Valencia) then I can say a 4-5-1 formation would be good enough.

by **Quadrophenia** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:33 am

The way I see it is fans are expecting too much. People moan about the fact we haven't played well, well maybe we have played as well as we can. Lets face it, a run of bad performances goes on for two or three games not months. We've had the good displays such as United and Everton but other than that it's all been very similar. Maybe this is Liverpool in top gear. I've got to say I hope it isn't because it's not good enough but this is going on a lot longer than a bad run.

Some of the players are not good enough, that's a fact. Some of the players never will be good enough and that's another fact. Yet they're still being picked week in week out. Our left backs are a complete and utter joke, the pair of them, so give Insua a run out there or swap Arebloa back to left back where he's had some great performances in a Liverpool shirt and give young Darby a go because he's deserved it with his form in the reserves over the last few years. Babel, Lucas, Benayoun, Riera aren't good enough and I wouldn't be disappointed to see them gone in the transfer window. The Brazilian keeper doesn't look much so flog him back, esepcially when David Martin is on his way back at the turn of the year. Ngog and Plessis have shown very little in their few cameo appearances either. One lad who has impressed though is El Zhar, he looks a good little player and deserves more chances than he's getting.

That's why our performances are so down this year because we're playing players who aren't good enough, while stunting the progress of the talented youngsters. Nearly every game this season we've relied on a spark of magic rather than a game of sheer dominance with the entire side playing well. Those sparks of magic have come from Stevie practically every game.

by **metalhead** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:36 am

Quadrophenia wrote:Babel, Lucas, Benayoun, Riera aren't good enough and I wouldn't be disappointed to see them gone in the transfer window.

I disagree with Riera.

While he isn't a top class player, he is still an excellent one and gave us alot of balance in midfield. The only thing that worries me about him is his lack of fitness, hopefully in time he will adapt and get his fitness back on track and maybe we will see the best out of him.

by **Scottbot** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:41 am

Quadrophenia wrote:That's why our performances are so down this year because we're playing players who aren't good enough

I could have picked out one of several quotes from this post but this one was the pick of the bunch for me. God knows what you have been saying about the team the previous 4-5 years when we haven't been ANYWHERE near the top of the league....

by **Quadrophenia** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:44 am

metalhead wrote:
Quadrophenia wrote:Babel, Lucas, Benayoun, Riera aren't good enough and I wouldn't be disappointed to see them gone in the transfer window.

I disagree with Riera.

While he isn't a top class player, he is still an excellent one and gave us alot of balance in midfield. The only thing that worries me about him is his lack of fitness, hopefully in time he will adapt and get his fitness back on track and maybe we will see the best out of him.

If he pulls his socks up from now until the end of the window then I'll be happy to see him stay, if he's still going to be coasting through games then no. He looks like he's just going through the motions now without any desire to push on and become a much better left winger. I'm not expecting a Steve Heighway or John Barnes but someone who has that spark like Riera did when he first joined.

When he arrived he looked a star and proved a lot of doubters wrong but since mid-October he's been quiet, sloppy in possesion and generally the Albert Riera I remember playing at Man City.

by **Scottbot** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:44 am

Quadrophenia wrote:reserves over the last few years. Babel, Lucas, Benayoun, Riera aren't good enough and I wouldn't be disappointed to see them gone in the transfer window.

Riera isn't good enough? Do you watch the games lad? He's been excellent. Same to you Ciggs, his performances haven't dropped off, he's playing consistently. One of our best players tonight (i know that isn't saying too much) and he should have played the full 90.

by **Quadrophenia** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:52 am

Scottbot wrote:
Quadrophenia wrote:That's why our performances are so down this year because we're playing players who aren't good enough

I could have picked out one of several quotes from this post but this one was the pick of the bunch for me. God knows what you have been saying about the team the previous 4-5 years when we haven't been ANYWHERE near the top of the league....

We are top of the league courtosey of what I'd say five players.

1) Reina - faultless from the word go this year.
2) Carragher - been back to his best.
3) Skrtel - player of the year up until his injury.
4) Alonso - refound his first season form.
5) Gerrard - Pulled us out of the :censored:

so often this season.

Every other player this season hasn't been good enough and yes that does include your Torres'/Mascherano's/Agger's.

More often that not this season, we've been reliant on Gerrard and Gerrard alone to get the goals. Kuyt's chipped in well this season for once.

As for the last four or five years...well I've been saying the same thanks mate. Players not good enough. Want me to list them? OK

Josemi, Kromkamp, Nunez, Morientes, Bellamy, Pennant, Traore, Riise, Zenden, Sissoko, Pelligrino, Leto, Biscan, Diao, Carson, Intandje, Kewell, Kuyt (up until this year), Baros, Lucas, Aurelio. Need any more?

The likes of Babel, Dossena, Riera will soon be joining that list. Just because we're top doesn't mean everything is rosey because it blantantly isn't. You don't have nearly 15 bad performances in the opening four months of a season if it is. Good players knock bad form on the head, something Torres is starting to do this year, players like Dossena can't because they are :censored:

.

by **JBG** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:53 am

All I will say is: Dossena, come back Djimi Traore, all is forgiven! :laugh:

by **Quadrophenia** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:53 am

Scottbot wrote:
Quadrophenia wrote:reserves over the last few years. Babel, Lucas, Benayoun, Riera aren't good enough and I wouldn't be disappointed to see them gone in the transfer window.

Riera isn't good enough? Do you watch the games lad? He's been excellent. Same to you Ciggs, his performances haven't dropped off, he's playing consistently. One of our best players tonight (i know that isn't saying too much) and he should have played the full 90.

If you think giving the ball away every time he gets it, constantly failing to hit a half decent cross and failing to track back is a good performance then it's no surprise you rate Riera.

by **Ciggy** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:55 am

Scottbot wrote:Riera isn't good enough? Do you watch the games lad? He's been excellent. Same to you Ciggs, his performances haven't dropped off, he's playing consistently. One of our best players tonight (i know that isn't saying too much) and he should have played the full 90.

Dont agree Scott Reira looked so promising when he arrived he has gone off the boil, he was beating his man when he arrived now he is giving up.

He has had two good games against United and Chelsea where he has really stood out, he has faded the last few weeks maybe its just me?

If he is playing that well Scott why does Rafa keep taking him off?
Maybe thats the problem we know he is a confidence player maybe his confidence has gone.
he was certainly better when he arrived to what he is now.

by **Scottbot** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 12:57 am

Ciggy wrote:People say thats the sign of champions not playing well but getting results, games we should have won this season, Stoke, Spurs, Fulham, Athletico away, should have won them all because because we didnt put our chances away.

Can't deny we have got the winning knack and if we can't do that it's usually a draw. I don't know what the run is but this team have lost just once (and that was a freak result against Spurs) in the league since the beating we took at Old Trafford. Best home record in the league (and STILL someone mentions the Stoke game every couple of days) and 2nd best away record. some of the performances have been ugly, some have been workmanlike, and each of the BIG games have been absolutely top class. We've played virtually the whole season so far with our best striker injured or playing himself back from injury. If he stays fit from here on in I think we will see some prettier stuff again. This board has been all wrong this season. It seems there is more criticism this year than in previous seasons when we were virtually out of it by now. If it's not Robbie Keane, It's Babel or it's rotation or it's Lucas or it's something else. It's not all been pretty this season but I kinda expected posters to be a bit more positive on here. There's a lot of "i'm really chuffed with the fact we've won virtually all our games this season BUT......" Even the lads who have been getting the brunt of the criticism such as Keane, Lucas, Aurelio, Arbeloa, Nennayoun, Dossena (ok he deserves it he is :censored:

!) must have been doing something right. Surely? We're not top of the league in spite of all of those players are we?

by **metalhead** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 1:00 am

Scottbot wrote:
Ciggy wrote:People say thats the sign of champions not playing well but getting results, games we should have won this season, Stoke, Spurs, Fulham, Athletico away, should have won them all because because we didnt put our chances away.

Can't deny we have got the winning knack and if we can't do that it's usually a draw. I don't know what the run is but this team have lost just once (and that was a freak result against Spurs) in the league since the beating we took at Old Trafford. Best home record in the league (and STILL someone mentions the Stoke game every couple of days) and 2nd best away record. some of the performances have been ugly, some have been workmanlike, and each of the BIG games have been absolutely top class. We've played virtually the whole season so far with our best striker injured or playing himself back from injury. If he stays fit from here on in I think we will see some prettier stuff again. This board has been all wrong this season. It seems there is more criticism this year than in previous seasons when we were virtually out of it by now. If it's not Robbie Keane, It's Babel or it's rotation or it's Lucas or it's something else. It's not all been pretty this season but I kinda expected posters to be a bit more positive on here. There's a lot of "i'm really chuffed with the fact we've won virtually all our games this season BUT......" Even the lads who have been getting the brunt of the criticism such as Keane, Lucas, Aurelio, Arbeloa, Nennayoun, Dossena (ok he deserves it he is !) must have been doing something right. Surely? We're not top of the league in spite of all of those players are we?

People will always complain mate

Im not worried now, Im just worried about the second half of the season. Hopefully, we keep on winning.

by **JC_81** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 1:05 am

Some complete fu.cking overreactions on here as usual :no

I don't hear anyone saying Chelsea are having a poor season/struggling to break teams down at home/can't win the league.

The fact is we have matched them so far in the league, have a better home record than them (they have drawn 3 and lost 1 at Stamford Bridge already in the league there, and lost to Burnley) and deservedly beat them and United this season already. Yet because Scolari has them playing a slightly more open style of football they seem beyond criticism.

United are 8 points behind, albeit with a game in hand, and still have the distraction of going to Japan. They've only played well this season when Ronaldo's been in the team - yet we get slagged off for depending too much on Gerrard/Torres/both (depending on what mood the media/pundits are in). We've only beaten Chelsea and United without having both of them on the park though.

Last season, or any season under Rafa for that matter, we'd have killed to be in this position with a third of the season gone. Some people have short memories.

by **Scottbot** » Thu Nov 27, 2008 1:08 am

Quadrophenia wrote:We are top of the league courtosey of what I'd say five players.

1) Reina - faultless from the word go this year.
2) Carragher - been back to his best.
3) Skrtel - player of the year up until his injury.
4) Alonso - refound his first season form.
5) Gerrard - Pulled us out of the <img

But football doesn't work like that. You can't 'carry' SIX players. you can barely get away with carrying one or two in a game. Let alone a whole season as you seem to be suggesting. you've highlighted 5 players who have been playing very well this season but there have been solid performances from many other players this season. The fullbacks have taken a lot of criticism (including plenty from me) but both Arbeloa and Aurelio have played well this season. Agger has come in and played himself up to speed (despite a dodgy game tonight when he was off his game for me) Kuyt, our top scorer and someone you have inexplicably left off your list is having his best season in a red shirt and I disagree completely on Riera. He's never gonna be a Ronaldo type running full-back ragged but he is an intelligent player, who gives us good width, shows feet at all times, draws a lot of fouls and gives us the balance we have missed since Kewell last managed to stay fit for a season.

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