Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:08 pm

Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

by **Jimmy the Weasel** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:12 pm

Players these days are generally a) soft- :censored:

nonces and b) highly valuable assets in a hugely competitive multi-million pound industry.

So minor knocks / tiredness seem to be more readily accepted as reasons not to start matches than they were in the past.

by **Judge** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:14 pm

GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

injuries

it would be interesting to see how many players arsenal used during the year they went unbeaten

by **GYBS** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:16 pm

Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

injuries

Injuries back in those days as well mate - plenty of them . More injuries these days due to the high demands of the prem,Cl , internationals etc . The basics of the game will always be the same but the way its played and the demands of it will always change and increase - thats the nature of sports .

by **GYBS** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:18 pm

And prob a fair number due to them playing kids in the Cup maybe ? not sure .

by **Judge** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:31 pm

GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

injuries

Injuries back in those days as well mate - plenty of them . More injuries these days due to the high demands of the prem,Cl , internationals etc . The basics of the game will always be the same but the way its played and the demands of it will always change and increase - thats the nature of sports .

yes and people get physically stronger with better training regimes

by **GYBS** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:36 pm

Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

injuries

Injuries back in those days as well mate - plenty of them . More injuries these days due to the high demands of the prem,Cl , internationals etc . The basics of the game will always be the same but the way its played and the demands of it will always change and increase - thats the nature of sports .

yes and people get physically stronger with better training regimes

But the game moves at a higher rate hence why more players are needed cause no player can play week in week out like they used to do mate .

by **stmichael** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:46 pm

It's truely bizarre that Wenger still seems to avoid the kind of criticism Benitez often comes in for, despite us sitting top of the table unbeaten (and having beaten United and Chelsea) whilst Arsenal have lost away to Fulham, at home to Hull and have thrown away two points to a woeful Spurs side in the most suicidal display of killing a game I've ever seen.

I thought maybe the "rotator" name tag would all but disappear if we were winning, only being reeled out after a defeat. It seems I was wrong. Isn't it strange how you never hear much of the infamous "zonal marking" system anymore? We have one of the best defensive records in the country, yet as soon as we concede one goal from a set play, then out come the Richard Keyes and Andy Gray's of this world to criticise zonal marking, without addressing the fact that it is this zonal marking system that has helped create one of the best defences in the country. Take them blinkers off gentlemen and actually think about what you're saying.

It's as if the nation's media and press have a few basic rules to follow for each club. For Liverpool they always refer back to Gerrard not being played in the middle, despite having his two best seasons wide right and behind the front man. The next one is the zonal marking each time we concede from a corner, and the rotation policy costing us all chance of a league title challenge; forgetting the fact that other sides at the top also rotate, but have just been doing so with superior players than ourselves. Is it too much to ask for journalists to actually think about what they're putting into print and feeding to the nation? The readers that believe all this nonsense are as lazy as they are.

by **Scottbot** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:03 pm

Judge wrote:

kuyt looks hungry to me

Quality

by **Judge** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:22 pm

GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

injuries

Injuries back in those days as well mate - plenty of them . More injuries these days due to the high demands of the prem,Cl , internationals etc . The basics of the game will always be the same but the way its played and the demands of it will always change and increase - thats the nature of sports .

yes and people get physically stronger with better training regimes

But the game moves at a higher rate hence why more players are needed cause no player can play week in week out like they used to do mate .

look the simple fact here is that im right and youre not

by **GYBS** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:24 pm

Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:
Judge wrote:the games faster coz the lads are fitter, eat better, have better medical care, earn more money.

so in fairness, its relative to what i said

So how come no team can get through a season playing the 11-15 players ? the game is more physically demanding hence the need for bigger squads to be used.

injuries

Injuries back in those days as well mate - plenty of them . More injuries these days due to the high demands of the prem,Cl , internationals etc . The basics of the game will always be the same but the way its played and the demands of it will always change and increase - thats the nature of sports .

yes and people get physically stronger with better training regimes

But the game moves at a higher rate hence why more players are needed cause no player can play week in week out like they used to do mate .

look the simple fact here is that im right and youre not

no im right and your wrong and have badges from cub scouts and certificates and courses to prove it so ner :rasp

by **Jimmy the Weasel** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:27 pm

stmichael wrote:It's truely bizarre that Wenger still seems to avoid the kind of criticism Benitez often comes in for, despite us sitting top of the table unbeaten (and having beaten United and Chelsea) whilst Arsenal have lost away to Fulham, at home to Hull and have thrown away two points to a woeful Spurs side in the most suicidal display of killing a game I've ever seen.

I thought maybe the "rotator" name tag would all but disappear if we were winning, only being reeled out after a defeat. It seems I was wrong. Isn't it strange how you never hear much of the infamous "zonal marking" system anymore? We have one of the best defensive records in the country, yet as soon as we concede one goal from a set play, then out come the Richard Keyes and Andy Gray's of this world to criticise zonal marking, without addressing the fact that it is this zonal marking system that has helped create one of the best defences in the country. Take them blinkers off gentlemen and actually think about what you're saying.

It's as if the nation's media and press have a few basic rules to follow for each club. For Liverpool they always refer back to Gerrard not being played in the middle, despite having his two best seasons wide right and behind the front man. The next one is the zonal marking each time we concede from a corner, and the rotation policy costing us all chance of a league title challenge; forgetting the fact that other sides at the top also rotate, but have just been doing so with superior players than ourselves. Is it too much to ask for journalists to actually think about what they're putting into print and feeding to the nation? The readers that believe all this nonsense are as lazy as they are.

I think that the national press have an agenda (or agendas) that they've been pushing for so long now, they'll continue to do so until we actually win the damn thing.

The amount of baseless, short-sighted journalism or punditry that exists around our team (and our league) is ridiculous.

You only have to listen to Match of the Day to hear a string of cliches trotted out week after week, like Shearer et al have pre-determined rent-a-quotes that they'll just apply to the highlights they show.

All too often the account you get on MOTD doesn't even begin to reflect the flow of the match or balance of play.

by **DanAn** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 3:58 pm

I think the big difference is these days players push the boundaries a lot more in terms of what they can do. It's one think to play a lot of games back to back when your training 3-4 times a week. He'll you could even have a beer after the game back in the day. It's another to back up game after game when training 3 times a day and giving it your all. You can't afford to be anything less than 100%.

by **NANNY RED** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 8:50 pm

I read this article yesterday in the times on line an then went an had me dinner an totaly forgot all about it , This fella makes some very valid points here so i found it an put it up :laugh:

October 30, 2008
Rafa The Rotator
What is the difference between resting and rotating?

Why is it that when Benitez makes 4 changes for a midweek game against Portsmouth, he is tinkering or rotating, and breaking up a winning side; yet when Alex Ferguson makes 5 changes to his side for a midweek game against West Ham, he is giving players a much needed rest and giving others an opportunity? Both sides picked up 3 points, yet Rafa's side currently sits top of the table and 8 points clear of Ferguson's. Yet it is the press rolling out their tired old typecast about him rotating as soon as he makes more than one change to his side. It's lazy, and it's annoying.

Over the past two seasons, Rafa Benitez has "rotated" approximately the same number of times as Alex Ferguson, Jose Mourinho, Avram Grant and Arsene Wenger; yet he is the only one that has landed himself with this tag as a rotator. Why?

Wayne Rooney and Ronaldo were "rested" or "rotated" in more league games than Fernando Torres and Steven Gerrard last season, and United had an appalling record when those two, or one of them, were missing from the side. Yet it never gets a mention. Mainly because they won the league; but even throughout the season, when the title was far from decided, there was still no criticism of the policy of resting those players. Yet Benitez leaves Torres on the bench for one game and he is hung out to dry by the nations hacks.

This season we've beaten Man United at home without Gerrard or Torres in the side (Gerrard coming on for the final few minutes), and now beaten Chelsea away without Fernando Torres. We currently sit 3 points clear at the top of the league, unbeaten, and having picked up 26 points from a possible 30. We're also cruising through the Champions League group stages. Yet as soon as the manager makes more than 2 changes to his side, the knives are out. Win the game or not, it's guaranteed to make the headlines the following morning. The red top journalists never let you down on that front, lazy is being polite in describing their work.

We have an away game in London on Saturday afternoon, and an important European fixture a few days later, so the manager decided to keep Mascherano, Agger, Riera and Keane a little fresher for those games by letting them sit out the win over Portsmouth. Putting out a side more than capable of beating a Portsmouth side that are far from the greatest travellers. Keane and Riera were carrying little knocks, Mascherano has been travelling back and forth to Argentina for the International fixtures, while Agger has not played football for almost 12 months. Surely that is resting rather than rotating?

I thought maybe the "rotator" name tag would all but disappear if we were winning, only being reeled out after a defeat. It seems I was wrong. Isn't it strange how you never hear much of the infamous "zonal marking" system anymore? We have one of the best defensive records in the country, yet as soon as we concede one goal from a set play, then out come the Richard Keyes and Andy Gray's of this world to criticise zonal marking, without addressing the fact that it is this zonal marking system that has helped create one of the best defences in the country. Take them blinkers off gentlemen and actually think about what you're saying.

It's as if the nation's media and press have a few basic rules to follow for each club. For Liverpool they always refer back to Gerrard not being played in the middle, despite having his two best seasons wide right and behind the front man. The next one is the zonal marking each time we concede from a corner, and the rotation policy costing us all chance of a league title challenge; forgetting the fact that other sides at the top also rotate, but have just been doing so with superior players than ourselves. Is it too much to ask for journalists to actually think about what they're putting into print and feeding to the nation? The readers that believe all this nonsense are as lazy as they are.

If we beat Tottenham on Saturday and Athletico Madrid in the week, will it have been a good decision to rest those players against Portsmouth and hold back bringing Torres into the side? Or will have just been tinkering and rotating for the sake of it and risking costing us the title challenge we all crave? Time will tell in the end, but at least try and look at the resting / rotating argument in the bigger picture; not just sticking to the faithful "Rafa the Rotator" agenda because you can't be bothered to think about it for yourself.

Now let's hope that horrible zonal marking doesn't rear it's head again if we dare to concede at the weekend! You'd think teams that man marked never conceded wouldn't you?

Paul Jones

by **ruskiy playmaker** » Fri Oct 31, 2008 9:17 pm

^ Good article, these journalist and commentators clearly have something against Rafa. I have to put the mute on before the matches now, because that's all those useless buffoons talk about and it's really getting on my freaking nerves.

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