Liverpool FC Forum

by **Lando_Griffin** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:04 pm

Is it right that we're dictated to regarding whom we can employ for the Champions' League?

Surely there's some infringement of Human rights or European employment laws here?

by **GYBS** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:05 pm

You can employ who you want mate - your just restricted on who you can play in CL - nothing stopping you buying anyone .

by **Ben1988** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:06 pm

same as international trade laws and the transfer window....things like that go out of the window with football.

by **aCe'** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:07 pm

JoeTerp wrote:Ace you also left out N'Gog, and with Kuyt not really being a forward anymore and the posisble niggling injury threat to Torres, that leaves us very thin at forward. Nathan Eccleston is the only B list player available in this position, and he only sparingly plays for the ressies.

So basically you are saying that N'gog is a better forward than Kuyt and Babel ?
Fair enough i wont argue that point since i havent seen N'gog playing much competitive footall except for that game when he came on and was absolutely useless... i dont even think he hit double digit starts for PSG when he was there so cant understand how all of a sudden he's Liverpool's backup forward option ahead of all the others. He's a reserves player in my books and until he proves otherwise i wouldnt want him anywhere near the starting 11 !
Anyways N'gog in and ElZhar out... still cant understand why Hyypia is not in that 25 man list !

by **GYBS** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:11 pm

Ngog did well in pre season and was great for the french youth and under 21s - at PSG is was played out of position and we only got him cheap cause of a clause in his contract and psg didnt want to sell . Sami not in becuase of A. We have three CBs better than him now . B. We need to fulfill the quota of english players so no space for sami . yes he has been a great servant etc for the club and was outstanding for the club but there must be a time when we have reeuce the amount of mins these players play .

by **Lando_Griffin** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:12 pm

GYBS wrote:You can employ who you want mate - your just restricted on who you can play in CL - nothing stopping you buying anyone .

But this is like saying to the owner of 2 coal mines: "You can employ 50 German coal miners, but you can't let more than 17 of them work at mine number 1. They can all work at number 2, but not number 1, because we don't like it."

I'm awfully sorry, UEFA, but that's f*cking discrimination, and any barrister worth his salt would sue you for every penny you've ever even thought of.

by **GYBS** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:19 pm

been passed by the court of law mate and abitration of sport so feck we can do about it im afraid .

by **aCe'** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:28 pm

GYBS wrote:Ngog did well in pre season and was great for the french youth and under 21s - at PSG is was played out of position and we only got him cheap cause of a clause in his contract and psg didnt want to sell . Sami not in becuase of A. We have three CBs better than him now . B. We need to fulfill the quota of english players so no space for sami . yes he has been a great servant etc for the club and was outstanding for the club but there must be a time when we have reeuce the amount of mins these players play .

Jeez i didnt know he did well for the under21s and was only sht at PSG cause he was played out of position !
should have said so early on i wouldnt have been discussing this with you !
seriously though... let me put it this way, you's rather have 5 forwards (Torres, Keane, Babel, Kuyt, N'Gog) with only 3 center backs (Carra, Skrtel, Agger) rather than 4 forwards and 4 centerbacks ?
dont see the logic in that...

many youngsters and sht players impress at preseason and u21 level but just quite simply cant compete at the highest level when it really matters.. again i havent seen much of N'gog so cant really say hes a sht player quite yet but if you go back a few posts i said that we can have both N'gog and Hyypia in the squad making everyone happy..
care to explain to me why Hyypia isnt in the squad if this was our 25 man list now ?

GK

Reina
Cava

DEFENDERS

Dossena
Aurelio
Arbeloa
Darby*
Hyypia
Agger
Skrtel
Carra*

MIDFIELDERS

Pennant*
Babel
Riera
Benayoun
Alonso
Gerrard*
Mascherano
Lucas

Forwards

Torres
Keane*
Kuyt
N'gog

by **JoeTerp** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:29 pm

Still not sure how this is legal, but as of right now it is being enforced. I think they got clubs with the ol' boiling the frog trick. It started 2 years ago as a rule that only applied to 4 players of the 25 man squad, and last season it was 6, now this year it is 8. Also I think they use a loophole in that your nationality has nothing to do with the law, Fabregas is "Arsenal" trained, and thus would count as "English" for anybody else. And I guess if you time your transfer correctly you can count as being trained in two different countries. But still, you are locked in to a certain country (most likely where you were born) and your value to a club is going to be less in every other country but the one you trained in. However, I do understand the need for the club trained aspect of the rule, and I agree with it.

by **JoeTerp** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:32 pm

Ace, you yourself just put Babel in midfield on that list, and Kuyt is deployed almost exclusively on the right hand side now. N'Gog in the squad would allow us to keep Babel and Kuyt in their normal positions if one of Torres or Keane went down.

by **GYBS** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:36 pm

aCe' wrote:
GYBS wrote:Ngog did well in pre season and was great for the french youth and under 21s - at PSG is was played out of position and we only got him cheap cause of a clause in his contract and psg didnt want to sell . Sami not in becuase of A. We have three CBs better than him now . B. We need to fulfill the quota of english players so no space for sami . yes he has been a great servant etc for the club and was outstanding for the club but there must be a time when we have reeuce the amount of mins these players play .

Jeez i didnt know he did well for the under21s and was only sht at PSG cause he was played out of position !
should have said so early on i wouldnt have been discussing this with you !
seriously though... let me put it this way, you's rather have 5 forwards (Torres, Keane, Babel, Kuyt, N'Gog) with only 3 center backs (Carra, Skrtel, Agger) rather than 4 forwards and 4 centerbacks ?
dont see the logic in that...

many youngsters and sht players impress at preseason and u21 level but just quite simply cant compete at the highest level when it really matters.. again i havent seen much of N'gog so cant really say hes a sht player quite yet but if you go back a few posts i said that we can have both N'gog and Hyypia in the squad making everyone happy..
care to explain to me why Hyypia isnt in the squad if this was our 25 man list now ?

GK

Reina
Cava

DEFENDERS

Dossena
Aurelio
Arbeloa
Darby*
Hyypia
Agger
Skrtel
Carra*

MIDFIELDERS

Pennant*
Babel
Riera
Benayoun
Alonso
Gerrard*
Mascherano
Lucas

Forwards

Torres
Keane*
Kuyt
N'gog

all you have done is replace degen with hyypia ? why should we have hyypia in the squad when you have three guys who will play instead of him as opposed to degen who may well start a lot of those games. Rafa has decided three cbs is aenough cover for 6 games YES 6 GAMES - are people getting too sentimental about sami ? he isnt better than the three we have got ahead of him anymore.

Plus you need to add 3 more english players to your list .

by **aCe'** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:47 pm

JoeTerp wrote:Ace, you yourself just put Babel in midfield on that list, and Kuyt is deployed almost exclusively on the right hand side now. N'Gog in the squad would allow us to keep Babel and Kuyt in their normal positions if one of Torres or Keane went down.

yea okay... i give up tryin to convinve anyone that N'gog shouldnt be in that squad because clearly everyone thinks he has a role to play and that he can come on to be our next big thing upfront..
personally if Torres and Keane and Kuyt are all not available id play Babel alone upfront before even considering throwing N'Gog in there but again..thats just me

Back to Hyypia not being in that squad

by **GYBS** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:49 pm

why should hyypia be in the squad ?

by **JoeTerp** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:55 pm

aCe' wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:Ace, you yourself just put Babel in midfield on that list, and Kuyt is deployed almost exclusively on the right hand side now. N'Gog in the squad would allow us to keep Babel and Kuyt in their normal positions if one of Torres or Keane went down.

yea okay... i give up tryin to convinve anyone that N'gog shouldnt be in that squad because clearly everyone thinks he has a role to play and that he can come on to be our next big thing upfront..
personally if Torres and Keane and Kuyt are all not available id play Babel alone upfront before even considering throwing N'Gog in there but again..thats just me

Back to Hyypia not being in that squad

I think if the plan was Carra to be Arbeloa's cover at RB, then maybe we would have seen Hyypia or El Zhar make the squad. But I think Rafa would rather have the most attack minded right back at the club for the group stages. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Hyypia chosen for the knockout rounds, as we saw Carra play on the right in the CL on a few ocasions in the really big nights. The inclusion of Degen is also interesting when you consider that Darby was a lock to make the squad (due to his B list/LFC trained status) and he had a good pre-season. Rafa really must see a nitche that Degen can fit into that seperates him from both Arbeloa and Darby.

by **aCe'** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:00 pm

GYBS wrote:
aCe' wrote:
GYBS wrote:Ngog did well in pre season and was great for the french youth and under 21s - at PSG is was played out of position and we only got him cheap cause of a clause in his contract and psg didnt want to sell . Sami not in becuase of A. We have three CBs better than him now . B. We need to fulfill the quota of english players so no space for sami . yes he has been a great servant etc for the club and was outstanding for the club but there must be a time when we have reeuce the amount of mins these players play .

Jeez i didnt know he did well for the under21s and was only sht at PSG cause he was played out of position !
should have said so early on i wouldnt have been discussing this with you !
seriously though... let me put it this way, you's rather have 5 forwards (Torres, Keane, Babel, Kuyt, N'Gog) with only 3 center backs (Carra, Skrtel, Agger) rather than 4 forwards and 4 centerbacks ?
dont see the logic in that...

many youngsters and sht players impress at preseason and u21 level but just quite simply cant compete at the highest level when it really matters.. again i havent seen much of N'gog so cant really say hes a sht player quite yet but if you go back a few posts i said that we can have both N'gog and Hyypia in the squad making everyone happy..
care to explain to me why Hyypia isnt in the squad if this was our 25 man list now ?

GK

Reina
Cava

DEFENDERS

Dossena
Aurelio
Arbeloa
Darby*
Hyypia
Agger
Skrtel
Carra*

MIDFIELDERS

Pennant*
Babel
Riera
Benayoun
Alonso
Gerrard*
Mascherano
Lucas

Forwards

Torres
Keane*
Kuyt
N'gog

all you have done is replace degen with hyypia ? why should we have hyypia in the squad when you have three guys who will play instead of him as opposed to degen who may well start a lot of those games. Rafa has decided three cbs is aenough cover for 6 games YES 6 GAMES - are people getting too sentimental about sami ? he isnt better than the three we have got ahead of him anymore.

Plus you need to add 3 more english players to your list .

6 games is alot mate believe it or not !
3 centerbacks is never enough not even for 2 games id be worried if we didnt have cover for our 2 starting centerbacks at any point ! Agger's been struggling with injuries since last season and whos to say that he'll be match fit anytime soon ?! what if Carra gets injured and Agger isnt quite ready yet ? who do we play ?
fck that forget all that
Lucas has 3 infront of him for that CM spot and Pennant has 3 infront of him for that RW spot ... why were they picked ? Pennant i understand cause hes English but i well and truely cant believe that you are actually saying that its better to have 5 fullbacks (2 of which start) rather than 4 centerbacks (also 2 of which start) ?!

On a side note, i wouldnt want Agger and Skrtel playing together if Carra is injured because i think we'd look very exposed with those two at the back because quite honestly i think their positionin is average at best and even a hlaf decent outfit like Marseille can open them up quite easily.

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Champions League Squad - Hyypia left out of the 25 man list

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