Liverpool FC Forum

Effes wrote:

s@int wrote:It proves nothing mate, just backs my opinion that Keane is not as much a creative second striker as people seem to think, and is more a frontline striker that runs from deep like Bellamy.

That doesn't mean he can't play that role ........ just that he hasn't done regularly at Spurs or Leeds. At Coventry he did but he was very young then.

As a creative second striker you should be looking at 10/15 goals a season and around 10/15 assists, obviously more or less depending on ability etc etc. Which is where my won't score 20 league goals comes from, whether he can up his assists towards the 10/15 mark is the big question........ if Rafa even plays him in that role of course.

Play him as a frontline striker with Torres and he may get 20 goals but in all likelyhood only his usual 3 or 4 assists, which would obviously have a detrimental effect on Torres and the number of goals he would score.

As far as actual assists goes ..... no doubt he had a hand in quite a few more (as all players do) but as a front player, obviously he is more likely to make the final pass, touch or flick on than say a CB OR EVEN A MIDFIELDER WOULD.

So S@int,

Where would you play Keane in a 4-2-3-1?

Also, would it be worth going 4-4-2 to make him and the team more effective?

I prefer 4-4-2 as 4-2-3-1 or 4-5-1 tends to leave the striker isolated against better opposition imo.

If we play 4-2-3-1 however, I think either Kuyts role on the right or possibly interchanging with Gerrard in the centre(support striker) are the 2 likeliest possibilites.

In the 4-4-2 I think he may take the role of second striker playing from deeper but as Rafa said we dont really have the wingers, so unless Gerrard moves out to the right I think we may still have a few problems.

Possibly Degen could play winger, but I don't honestly see that happening. 

maybe a 4-3-3 with Keane, Torres and Babel as the front 3 could also be an option? Barry(Alonso), Masch and Gerrard as the midfield trio.

Rafa certainly has a few options 

Effes wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:Im wondering what will be Rafa's preferred formation now that we've got Keane.

I think the 4-2-3-1 worked really well last year, so not sure I want us to go 4-4-2.

Where does anyone reckon he is best deployed in the 4-2-3-1?

He could certainly do a job in Gerrard's role behind Torres, I'd prefer him there than
in Kuyt's position. But he wouldn't be as effective as Gerrard I don't think.

Assuming we still play a fair bit of 4-2-3-1 next season (and i hope we do) I'd imagine his best position will be behind Torres with Stevie taking Kuyt's slot on the right (my preference) or dropping back into mid-field at the expense of Xabi or Mash. It also wouldn't  surprise me to see him play as the lone front-man in the same system should (perish the thought) Torres get injured or rested/rotated. Of course he doesn't bring the same skill-set as Torres but he has the mobility, touch and game intelligence to play the role if needed.

I think he'll be an excellent foil for Torres, he's a classic partnership player for my mind, very clever and adaptable. Torres is an absolute monster for opposing defences to mark, he pulls players all over the show but our problem has been (Gerrard aside) there is no-one to take advantage of the soft spots created by our number 9. Hopefully Keane can be that player.

Scott, I tend to agree.

Keane behind Torres and Gerrard in Kuyt's position could be a tremendous combination.
Would Gerrard be happy playing that role? Hard to say. But, it IS the position (more or less) that Ronaldo plays
so it could be sold to him on that basis.

bigmick wrote:Sometimes some of us could start a row in an empty house

what do you mean start a row in an empty house ? what wrong with bungalows or apartments. bungalows and apartments are cheaper than houses. houses are so over rated look at the stats. more people live in apartments and flats and bungalows than live in houses so your argument is flawed 

redrover wrote:

bigmick wrote:Sometimes some of us could start a row in an empty house

what do you mean start a row in an empty house ? what wrong with bungalows or apartments. bungalows and apartments are cheaper than houses. houses are so over rated look at the stats. more people live in apartments and flats and bungalows than live in houses so your argument is flawed 

Scottbot wrote:I still reckon reckon we would both have gone for Arshavin ahead of Keane though?

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:Im wondering what will be Rafa's preferred formation now that we've got Keane.

I think the 4-2-3-1 worked really well last year, so not sure I want us to go 4-4-2.

Where does anyone reckon he is best deployed in the 4-2-3-1?

He could certainly do a job in Gerrard's role behind Torres, I'd prefer him there than
in Kuyt's position. But he wouldn't be as effective as Gerrard I don't think.

Assuming we still play a fair bit of 4-2-3-1 next season (and i hope we do) I'd imagine his best position will be behind Torres with Stevie taking Kuyt's slot on the right (my preference) or dropping back into mid-field at the expense of Xabi or Mash. It also wouldn't  surprise me to see him play as the lone front-man in the same system should (perish the thought) Torres get injured or rested/rotated. Of course he doesn't bring the same skill-set as Torres but he has the mobility, touch and game intelligence to play the role if needed.

I think he'll be an excellent foil for Torres, he's a classic partnership player for my mind, very clever and adaptable. Torres is an absolute monster for opposing defences to mark, he pulls players all over the show but our problem has been (Gerrard aside) there is no-one to take advantage of the soft spots created by our number 9. Hopefully Keane can be that player.

Scott, I tend to agree.

Keane behind Torres and Gerrard in Kuyt's position could be a tremendous combination.
Would Gerrard be happy playing that role? Hard to say. But, it IS the position (more or less) that Ronaldo plays
so it could be sold to him on that basis.

I guess that's the only prblem with Stevie isn't it, you shouldn't really have to worry about whether he WANTS to play there should you? I'd be quite happy to see Gerrard playing a mixture of centre-mid, behind Torres in the 4-2-3-1 and also out out on the right. He's a very difficult player to prepare for when the opposition KNOW where he's going to play let alone when they don't!

I still reckon reckon we would both have gone for Arshavin ahead of Keane though? I'm pretty sure we started singing his praises at exactly the same time! Still, nevermind, I think Keane will do well for us.

Effes wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:Im wondering what will be Rafa's preferred formation now that we've got Keane.

I think the 4-2-3-1 worked really well last year, so not sure I want us to go 4-4-2.

Where does anyone reckon he is best deployed in the 4-2-3-1?

He could certainly do a job in Gerrard's role behind Torres, I'd prefer him there than
in Kuyt's position. But he wouldn't be as effective as Gerrard I don't think.

Assuming we still play a fair bit of 4-2-3-1 next season (and i hope we do) I'd imagine his best position will be behind Torres with Stevie taking Kuyt's slot on the right (my preference) or dropping back into mid-field at the expense of Xabi or Mash. It also wouldn't  surprise me to see him play as the lone front-man in the same system should (perish the thought) Torres get injured or rested/rotated. Of course he doesn't bring the same skill-set as Torres but he has the mobility, touch and game intelligence to play the role if needed.

I think he'll be an excellent foil for Torres, he's a classic partnership player for my mind, very clever and adaptable. Torres is an absolute monster for opposing defences to mark, he pulls players all over the show but our problem has been (Gerrard aside) there is no-one to take advantage of the soft spots created by our number 9. Hopefully Keane can be that player.

Scott, I tend to agree.

Keane behind Torres and Gerrard in Kuyt's position could be a tremendous combination.
Would Gerrard be happy playing that role? Hard to say. But, it IS the position (more or less) that Ronaldo plays
so it could be sold to him on that basis.

s@int wrote:TBH I can't see Gerrard getting a look in at CM next season UNLESS we go 4-4-2. In a 4-2-3-1 formation he will surely be one of the 3 with Keane and (?). Either the support striker with Keane playing on the right of the three, or if Keane takes a more central second striker role Gerrard on the right.

I think Masch and Barry or Alonso(whoever is here) will button down the CM pairing.

I don't really see that Gerrard has a lot of problems playing on the right. I think he just gets a little frustrated at times when he doesn't see as much of the ball out there, rather than he's just being soft about it.

Rush Job wrote:

Effes wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:Im wondering what will be Rafa's preferred formation now that we've got Keane.

I think the 4-2-3-1 worked really well last year, so not sure I want us to go 4-4-2.

Where does anyone reckon he is best deployed in the 4-2-3-1?

He could certainly do a job in Gerrard's role behind Torres, I'd prefer him there than
in Kuyt's position. But he wouldn't be as effective as Gerrard I don't think.

Assuming we still play a fair bit of 4-2-3-1 next season (and i hope we do) I'd imagine his best position will be behind Torres with Stevie taking Kuyt's slot on the right (my preference) or dropping back into mid-field at the expense of Xabi or Mash. It also wouldn't  surprise me to see him play as the lone front-man in the same system should (perish the thought) Torres get injured or rested/rotated. Of course he doesn't bring the same skill-set as Torres but he has the mobility, touch and game intelligence to play the role if needed.

I think he'll be an excellent foil for Torres, he's a classic partnership player for my mind, very clever and adaptable. Torres is an absolute monster for opposing defences to mark, he pulls players all over the show but our problem has been (Gerrard aside) there is no-one to take advantage of the soft spots created by our number 9. Hopefully Keane can be that player.

Scott, I tend to agree.

Keane behind Torres and Gerrard in Kuyt's position could be a tremendous combination.
Would Gerrard be happy playing that role? Hard to say. But, it IS the position (more or less) that Ronaldo plays
so it could be sold to him on that basis.

Sell the idea to SG on the basis that ronaldo plays there for the scum?? WTF are you on? Gerrard is an employee he'll play where he's told to irrispective of where fkin ronaldo might or might not be playing. Get a fkin grip.

Effes wrote:

Rush Job wrote:

Effes wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:Im wondering what will be Rafa's preferred formation now that we've got Keane.

I think the 4-2-3-1 worked really well last year, so not sure I want us to go 4-4-2.

Where does anyone reckon he is best deployed in the 4-2-3-1?

He could certainly do a job in Gerrard's role behind Torres, I'd prefer him there than
in Kuyt's position. But he wouldn't be as effective as Gerrard I don't think.

Assuming we still play a fair bit of 4-2-3-1 next season (and i hope we do) I'd imagine his best position will be behind Torres with Stevie taking Kuyt's slot on the right (my preference) or dropping back into mid-field at the expense of Xabi or Mash. It also wouldn't  surprise me to see him play as the lone front-man in the same system should (perish the thought) Torres get injured or rested/rotated. Of course he doesn't bring the same skill-set as Torres but he has the mobility, touch and game intelligence to play the role if needed.

I think he'll be an excellent foil for Torres, he's a classic partnership player for my mind, very clever and adaptable. Torres is an absolute monster for opposing defences to mark, he pulls players all over the show but our problem has been (Gerrard aside) there is no-one to take advantage of the soft spots created by our number 9. Hopefully Keane can be that player.

Scott, I tend to agree.

Keane behind Torres and Gerrard in Kuyt's position could be a tremendous combination.
Would Gerrard be happy playing that role? Hard to say. But, it IS the position (more or less) that Ronaldo plays
so it could be sold to him on that basis.

Sell the idea to SG on the basis that ronaldo plays there for the scum?? WTF are you on? Gerrard is an employee he'll play where he's told to irrispective of where fkin ronaldo might or might not be playing. Get a fkin grip.

Bit over the top.....

Let's say, it can be seen as a challenge to him to see if he can
be as prolfic as Ronaldo.

s@int wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:

Scottbot wrote:

Effes wrote:Im wondering what will be Rafa's preferred formation now that we've got Keane.

I think the 4-2-3-1 worked really well last year, so not sure I want us to go 4-4-2.

Where does anyone reckon he is best deployed in the 4-2-3-1?

He could certainly do a job in Gerrard's role behind Torres, I'd prefer him there than
in Kuyt's position. But he wouldn't be as effective as Gerrard I don't think.

Assuming we still play a fair bit of 4-2-3-1 next season (and i hope we do) I'd imagine his best position will be behind Torres with Stevie taking Kuyt's slot on the right (my preference) or dropping back into mid-field at the expense of Xabi or Mash. It also wouldn't  surprise me to see him play as the lone front-man in the same system should (perish the thought) Torres get injured or rested/rotated. Of course he doesn't bring the same skill-set as Torres but he has the mobility, touch and game intelligence to play the role if needed.

I think he'll be an excellent foil for Torres, he's a classic partnership player for my mind, very clever and adaptable. Torres is an absolute monster for opposing defences to mark, he pulls players all over the show but our problem has been (Gerrard aside) there is no-one to take advantage of the soft spots created by our number 9. Hopefully Keane can be that player.

Scott, I tend to agree.

Keane behind Torres and Gerrard in Kuyt's position could be a tremendous combination.
Would Gerrard be happy playing that role? Hard to say. But, it IS the position (more or less) that Ronaldo plays
so it could be sold to him on that basis.

I guess that's the only prblem with Stevie isn't it, you shouldn't really have to worry about whether he WANTS to play there should you? I'd be quite happy to see Gerrard playing a mixture of centre-mid, behind Torres in the 4-2-3-1 and also out out on the right. He's a very difficult player to prepare for when the opposition KNOW where he's going to play let alone when they don't!

I still reckon reckon we would both have gone for Arshavin ahead of Keane though? I'm pretty sure we started singing his praises at exactly the same time! Still, nevermind, I think Keane will do well for us.

TBH I can't see Gerrard getting a look in at CM next season UNLESS we go 4-4-2. In a 4-2-3-1 formation he will surely be one of the 3 with Keane and (?). Either the support striker with Keane playing on the right of the three, or if Keane takes a more central second striker role Gerrard on the right.

Rafa quote in the Times:

“Managers and defenders will try to do things, but the presence of people like Keane will be another problem for them,” Benítez said. “It will be important for Torres to have another player who can score goals. I could play 4-4-2 with Keane and Torres up front, or 4-2-3-1 with Keane on the right or the left [of the three].

So he'll do that til the New Year - then play Keane behind Torres and Gerrard on the right of
the three when we are out the league