Liverpool FC Forum

by **Owzat** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:42 pm

HacksawJimDuggin wrote:
Richj wrote:I just feel sorry for Crouch, what has he done so wrong ?, especially having to watch Kuyt get picked every game on the bad form he is in.

I can't see Crouch hanging about for long. He must be seriously p*ssed seeing Voronin go on before him on Wed night.

I don't think we can really argue the Kuyt v Crouch issue as Kuyt is no longer playing as a striker and more of an attacking midfielder/winger/striker and this is a position Crouch is not suitable in!

Perhaps the fact that Voronin got the nod first shows the limitiations of Crouch. We've tried this long ball up to Crouch who theoretically holds it up but doesn't. He doesn't score enough, we need to be moving forward WITH the ball, not hoofing it up the field and hoping the giraffe keeps it long enough to link up play. If he were more mobile it might be something, if he scored more it might be something, if he could head it might be something......................

Crouch has done nothing with the chances he's been given, people talk like he's hardly played, but he has 130 appearances to his name and 84 full games worth of minutes on the pitch. Neither he nor Kuyt have scored enough goals as strikers, Kuyt can play the role he's been given and Crouch can't. THAT's why Crouch isn't getting a look in, Rafa has identified the system that works best and fitted the most suited players into it.

Maybe Crouch will start in the league against Arsenal and score a hat-trick, give Rafa a selection headache and secure his future. Chances are Crouch will start, do nothing and maybe get 90 mins total time on the pitch from now until he leaves in the summer. Maybe he'll even be a hit at his next club, doesn't mean much since he's been a miss here

by **mikopool** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:37 pm

we have a dutchman on the left who runs for the first 10 minutes, then provides a solid attacking outlet from the left edge of the box, after that he gets lazy and gives us no option. The dutchman on the right is a liability when attacking at speed but provides an outlet kind of similar to Babel but will always run down any ball that could be considered his.

When you look at it from a general perspective, I think our attacking issues are with Babel AND Kuyt, if we had a solid attacking option on the left, the fact that we have a workhorse winning balls and putting in decent crosses on the right would not be such an issue. Poor first touch, lack of confidence aside, Kuyt is a valuable asset to the club.

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:43 pm

Owzat wrote:
Penguins wrote:Kuyt has 4 assists in the league and no more.
Sure, Kuyt put in a good shift today but just cause he scores every 10th game and gets and assists every 10th game, how quick does people seem to forget?

People don't 'forget', they mostly make it up as they go along like you have. You have cited two verifiable facts and not even checked them. And there was me thinking April Fools was the 1st.......

According to FPL Kuyt has three goals and seven assists in the Premiership. So you're wrong on the first point.

And Kuyt has scored three in his last eleven games so again you're way off the mark. If you're going to talk utter rubbish please consider yourself a manc fan or a bitter. Yes Kuyt is not prolific, bit difficult to be in his new role, but he's not scoring every 10th game and only a complete tool would suggest he is.

And the fact that Liverpool have lost once and won eight of the last ten suggests that the team is performing and he's been in it. He may have done little in some of those games and I bet he's not the only one considering few Liverpool players have shown title class this season

And thats coming from what of kuyt's biggiest critics this season .
Kuyt has given this formation shape and unless u are suggesting that pennant and yossi track backa s much as he does then u're a idiot also , without kuyt against arsenal we would have lost by god knows how many , he made life difficult for the arsenal players and got the all important away goal , people like u are just fecking ungrateful and here just to direct you to the right place

www.toffeetalk.com
www.redcafe.net

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:46 pm

Richj wrote:I just feel sorry for Crouch, what has he done so wrong ?, especially having to watch Kuyt get picked every game on the bad form he is in.

another wum , can crouch play on the right and put in the amount of effort that kuyt does? Crouch only misses chances so many of them and also the last time crouch played on the right we lost 3-1 , he's so clumsy on the ball and does not take his chances

by **Owzat** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 7:56 am

Toffeehater wrote:
Owzat wrote:
Penguins wrote:Kuyt has 4 assists in the league and no more.
Sure, Kuyt put in a good shift today but just cause he scores every 10th game and gets and assists every 10th game, how quick does people seem to forget?

People don't 'forget', they mostly make it up as they go along like you have. You have cited two verifiable facts and not even checked them. And there was me thinking April Fools was the 1st.......

According to FPL Kuyt has three goals and seven assists in the Premiership. So you're wrong on the first point.

And Kuyt has scored three in his last eleven games so again you're way off the mark. If you're going to talk utter rubbish please consider yourself a manc fan or a bitter. Yes Kuyt is not prolific, bit difficult to be in his new role, but he's not scoring every 10th game and only a complete tool would suggest he is.

And the fact that Liverpool have lost once and won eight of the last ten suggests that the team is performing and he's been in it. He may have done little in some of those games and I bet he's not the only one considering few Liverpool players have shown title class this season

And thats coming from what of kuyt's biggiest critics this season .
Kuyt has given this formation shape and unless u are suggesting that pennant and yossi track backa s much as he does then u're a idiot also , without kuyt against arsenal we would have lost by god knows how many , he made life difficult for the arsenal players and got the all important away goal , people like u are just fecking ungrateful and here just to direct you to the right place

www.toffeetalk.com
www.redcafe.net

I suggest you go check your facts, maybe you can find me criticising Crouch all season. I am far from "one of his biggest critics this season". Get a clue, you don't half talk rubbish sometimes

I've been criticial of Crouch, Pennant, Kewell, Riise and, Hyypia in particular this season. I've said Kuyt hasn't scored enough goals, but that's stating facts and I've been fairly sympathetic towards him.

by **Bad Bob** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 11:48 am

I think a fair few of us have been expecting Kuyt to be sold come the summer. But, based on Rafa's comments yesterday on .tv (excerpt below), I'd be very surprised if the Dutchman were cut loose--Rafa seems to have great faith in him:

-------------------------
Dirk Kuyt has come in for a lot of criticism from some supporters this season but he was a real hero for you on Wednesday wasn't he?

Yes. I think he showed in the derby and in this game that he has a fantastic team spirit. He's a player who works really hard for the team. He's not selfish and I think he is the kind of player you want in the squad.

It's very unusual for you to single out players for specific praise but that shows how delighted you must have been with his performance...

He is a striker who was scoring a lot of goals in Holland. Playing as a right winger, he defends, attacks and runs 40/50 metres all of the time and he doesn't complain. He always tries to do his best for the team. I think he's amazing and I think everybody needs to know he is a player of the team.

He has settled well into this position on the right side of the attacking three, hasn't he?

Yes. He played in this position in Holland sometimes but they were playing a 4-3-3 formation so he was playing as a winger like Babel for example. Working as hard as he does for us in attack and defence shows the mentality and the character of this player.

He's got six goals in the Champions League this season. That shows he can deliver the goods in the biggest competition...

I think he's a winner. He's very competitive so in the big games he is working and ready for everything.

by **Sabre** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 11:59 am

It's not the first time that happens. Zenden had to hear a lot of stick in this forum, while Rafa didn't hesitate to use him in the latter stages of the CL, which is a sign of confidence in the player.

In that case aswell, he praised the professionalism. In neither cases Rafa has said they're key players, though, and he makes clear that they're squad players.

Rafa's been very specific when he has used the word "key" to describe players and he hasn't used it with Kuyt. Rafa will be happy to have him a squad player, and it will be the player who decide whether he wants to stay under that status (Sissoko didn't want to for instance).

All that makes me think Rafa will be buying more weapons upfront next summer (if he's not sacked) to find the so expected now perfect partnership with Torres. Because if a not key player is playing regularly, it must mean Crouch and Voronin won't be part of our future .

by **Bad Bob** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:02 pm

Sabre wrote:It's not the first time that happens. Zenden had to hear a lot of stick in this forum, while Rafa didn't hesitate to use him in the latter stages of the CL, which is a sign of confidence in the player.

In that case aswell, he praised the professionalism. In neither cases Rafa has said they're key players, though, and he makes clear that they're squad players.

Rafa's been very specific when he has used the word "key" to describe players and he hasn't used it with Kuyt.

All that makes me think Rafa will be buying more weapons upfront next summer (if he's not sacked) to find the so expected now perfect partnership with Torres. Because if a not key player is playing regularly, it must mean Crouch and Voronin won't be part of our future .

That's a good read, I think, mate. I think we'll be keeping Kuyt but he won't get as much action once the summer transfers are in--kind of like Sissoko after Masch arrived. Crouch and Voronin will almost certainly be out the door.

by **mart** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 3:27 pm

Bad Bob wrote:That's a good read, I think, mate. I think we'll be keeping Kuyt but he won't get as much action once the summer transfers are in--kind of like Sissoko after Masch arrived. Crouch and Voronin will almost certainly be out the door.

Not so sure about that really. I can see us going for primarily wingers and fullbacks in the summer. So depending on what crouch can accept i can see him beeing in the squad as a substitute for Torres. But that assumes Crouch can accept the role as a substitute.

Kuyt will probably be backup for a new right winger, and play about as much as Crouch has this year.

And then hopefully at least Voronin and Pennant will be sold if we get any offers.

by **Penguins** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 5:45 pm

The interview with Rafa today still says alot.

Please read through these qoutes by him:

"Crouch was good," Benitez told Sky Sports 1. "He played really well. We offered him a new contract so we are waiting.

"Sometimes we will play with TWO (strikers) so we want to keep Crouch."

If that isn't telling then nothing is. He is saying more or less that he has given up on our 9 million striker as a striker from now on and if we are to play with 2 strikers we need Crouch.

For me that say it all when we as a top club pay lots of money for a striker and then come to the conclusion he can't be played there.
That being said, it seems Rafa is prepared to use any kind of formation to give Kuyt an excuse to play.
I just know Rafa has to come to the same conclusion before we'll win the league.

by **Rush Job** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 12:55 am

Sabre wrote:All that makes me think Rafa will be buying more weapons upfront next summer (if he's not sacked) to find the so expected now perfect partnership with Torres. Because if a not key player is playing regularly, it must mean Crouch and Voronin won't be part of our future .

Yes but he`s playing on the right not upfront, i dont think he`s beating of presure from Crouch for the right wing spot.
Think about what your saying mate.

by **Owzat** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:00 am

Penguins wrote:The interview with Rafa today still says alot.

Please read through these qoutes by him:

"Crouch was good," Benitez told Sky Sports 1. "He played really well. We offered him a new contract so we are waiting.

"Sometimes we will play with TWO (strikers) so we want to keep Crouch."

If that isn't telling then nothing is. He is saying more or less that he has given up on our 9 million striker as a striker from now on and if we are to play with 2 strikers we need Crouch.

For me that say it all when we as a top club pay lots of money for a striker and then come to the conclusion he can't be played there.
That being said, it seems Rafa is prepared to use any kind of formation to give Kuyt an excuse to play.
I just know Rafa has to come to the same conclusion before we'll win the league.

Says to me Rafa wants Crouch to play a role until replaced, I can't imagine we won't sign a striker in the summer and he should be better than Crouch, so talking about two up front as if Crouch will be certain of being one of the two is comical at this stage.

And the harsh reality is that Crouch may need to be sold to raise funds for another striker/player, whether he or Kuyt would fetch more is debatable, but Crouch may not even decide to hang around. I'm sure there will be offers for him in the summer, let's not get ahead of ourselves in assuming something Rafa says in an interview is gospel

by **Seano Kop** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 11:05 am

Rush Job wrote:
Sabre wrote:All that makes me think Rafa will be buying more weapons upfront next summer (if he's not sacked) to find the so expected now perfect partnership with Torres. Because if a not key player is playing regularly, it must mean Crouch and Voronin won't be part of our future .

Yes but he`s playing on the right not upfront, i dont think he`s beating of presure from Crouch for the right wing spot.
Think about what your saying mate.

I couldn't help but laugh at the thought of Crouch playing on the right. :laugh:

by **Rush Job** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 9:54 pm

Seano Kop wrote:
Rush Job wrote:
Sabre wrote:All that makes me think Rafa will be buying more weapons upfront next summer (if he's not sacked) to find the so expected now perfect partnership with Torres. Because if a not key player is playing regularly, it must mean Crouch and Voronin won't be part of our future .

Yes but he`s playing on the right not upfront, i dont think he`s beating of presure from Crouch for the right wing spot.
Think about what your saying mate.

I couldn't help but laugh at the thought of Crouch playing on the right.

I`d buy a ticket,

by **NANNY RED** » Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:20 am

Dirk will play on Sat then jog down to London and run the Marathon on Sunday.

Rolls Royce of an engine he must have three lungs :laugh:

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