Liverpool FC Forum

by **Leonmc0708** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:18 pm

shadowman wrote:we finished 3rd above arsenal last season
but we have only just scraped past them via goal difference despite arsenal being out of form .

this meant to be amazing progress from benitez,yet the moment arsenal find some form we are back scrapping for fourth place.

to me this clearly shows he has not actually improved liverpool,its just that arsenal has been way out of form for 2 seasons.

can a rafa team live with a arsenal,manu and chelsea all in form at the same time.
not to mention teams from below with new money making a charge.

Look at the teams we put out in the wake of or days before Champions LEague games mate, once we had secured qualification no on played.

by **heimdall** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:31 pm

Leonmc0708 wrote:
heimdall wrote:OK Here are some names of managers who would do better in the league than Rafa:

Ferguson
Wenger
Mouriniho
O'Neill
Ramos
Erikson

Just to name managers from the Prem league.

How you guys still have faith in Rafa is beyond comprehension. How you can you defend a manager who never promotes youth players to the squad despite the fact that they have won the youth cup twice and who also keeps playing Kuyt??

You post some absolute shi.te lad, but this is up there with the best.

Furgeson has been at United for twenty years and was given 7 I think until he won the Premiership. He is simply not available as a replacement end of.

Wenger has been backed to the hilt by the club to the extent that he is expected to becone the Director when he finishes managing. He made decisions on the training ground, stadium and youth set up that have come to fruition, HOWEVER - if Arsenal dont win the league or FA Cup this seson, a strong possiblity then it will be FOUR YEARS without winning FU.CK ALL. He is also not available as a replacement.

Mourinho - absolute c.unt of a man, but its possible (not guaranteed) that he would improve our chance of winning hte league. He is available.

O'Neill - Get a grip, Villa have won a few games and he is the right man for the job ? Fickle must be your middle name.

Ramos - For Fu.cks sake, if you think that Ramos (2 UEFA CUPS and 1 COPA DEL REY) has more chance of winning us the league than Rafa (2 SPANISH LEAGUE TITLES, 1 UEFA CUP, 1 CHAMPIONS LEAGUE and 1 FA CUP) then you are even more stupid than you look. He has managed to get Spurs to a league Cup Final in this country to date, Rafa did this in his first season.

Ericksonn - I just did a wee wee in my pants.

------------------------------------------------------------

How we have faith in Rafa, we dont know eaither, he has won nothing and proven completely useless as a manager, all he has done is get us a Champions LEague win, FA Cup win, most Premiership points we have ever had (AND that would have won hte league 3 out of 6 years before) and got us to the final of the Champions LEague again last season.

Never promotes Youth players even though they have won the kids FA Cup ? FU.CK ME YOU ARE A FU.CKING IDIOT. - take a look at the players in the last ten years of winning the FA Youth Cup and see how many play top class football now.

How did you become a mod because you have to be the rudest and most vulgar sh1t I have ever come across Leon, there is absolutely no need to use language like that, you and Lando are an absolute disgrace in that respect!!

For the record I wasn't suggesting that we get these managers I was listing managers who I think would do a better job and I stick by every single one of them.

How many youth players has Rafa brought through the ranks in 4 years, the answer is none. If you compare that to Wenger and Ferguson and many other Prem mangers then you start to see a worrying picture. Rafa would rather play Voronin than bring one of our youngsters through the ranks, hmm that must really instil belief in the youngsters!!!

I still haven't had a single person defend Rafa for continually picking Kuyt, come on you "true" fans please explain it to me.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:43 pm

This discussion should be left for the end of the season surely. There is no good reason to change managers half way through a season unless the manager has "lost the dressing room" and I don't think anyone believes that.

Once the season is over and all the sh!t has hopefully settled with our owners THEN we can argue the pro's and cons. We can see what Rafa has achieved and decide if we think he's taking us forward or not. Until then we should just continue to support the team and the manager.

by **Bammo** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:46 pm

heimdall wrote:How many youth players has Rafa brought through the ranks in 4 years, the answer is none. If you compare that to Wenger and Ferguson and many other Prem mangers then you start to see a worrying picture.

And who are the players Ferguson has promoted from the youth ranks in the past 4 years exactly?

Well there's the world-class Fletcher and then....erm...well...

That's it. 1 average player. The rest of his youth players? He bought them. Ronaldo for £12m+, Nani and Anderson for £34m, Rooney for £27m.

You say any decent Premiership manager could do better than Rafa. Well Allardyce was considered one of the best last summer. Still think he's great after Newcastle? Would you be happy with him in charge at Anfield? Or Curbishley? Maybe Sammy Lee?

------------

Personally, provided he was backed in the transfer market (and by this I mean top quality players we need are bought, not just giving Rafa a huge budget to spend on loads of players) Rafa should be given another season with an assistant alongside him. I think he should get John Aldridge in. He loves the club and knows about the players.

by **shadowman** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:54 pm

i think he has improved the squad but that was not exactly hard to do.
rafa is definately a top 4 manager but so is houlier.

i am anti rafa but only because i know he will always rotate,even in the face of being sacked he continues.there is no way we will win the league with all this rotation going on.

the only way for us to win the league is for rafa to improve as a manager,but he seems to think he knows it all and don't need to get better.

look at all the managers who have openly come out and had a pop at his management skills.

by **Bammo** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:56 pm

shadowman wrote:i think he has improved the squad but that was not exactly hard to do.
rafa is definately a top 4 manager but so is houlier.

i am anti rafa but only because i know he will always rotate,even in the face of being sacked he continues.there is no way we will win the league with all this rotation going on.

the only way for us to win the league is for rafa to improve as a manager,but he seems to think he knows it all and don't need to get better.

look at all the managers who have openly come out and had a pop at his management skills.

You do realise that Rafa has cut down on his rotation a lot recently. Maybe it's temporary but maybe he's learning as a manager.

The only players he seems to rotate are the ones even everyone on here can't agree upon. (see the "your best XI" thread)

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 6:58 pm

look at all the managers who have openly come out and had a pop at his management skills.

Yes mate, good point. Fat sam did but he's just been sacked! Warnock did...... where is he again?

by **Bad Bob** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:00 pm

shadowman wrote:look at all the managers who have openly come out and had a pop at his management skills.

Yer, Allardyce sure cut Rafa down to size with his incisive criticisms, sage footballing guru that he is!

by **Lando_Griffin** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:01 pm

heimdall wrote:
Leonmc0708 wrote:
heimdall wrote:OK Here are some names of managers who would do better in the league than Rafa:

Ferguson
Wenger
Mouriniho
O'Neill
Ramos
Erikson

Just to name managers from the Prem league.

How you guys still have faith in Rafa is beyond comprehension. How you can you defend a manager who never promotes youth players to the squad despite the fact that they have won the youth cup twice and who also keeps playing Kuyt??

You post some absolute shi.te lad, but this is up there with the best.

Furgeson has been at United for twenty years and was given 7 I think until he won the Premiership. He is simply not available as a replacement end of.

Wenger has been backed to the hilt by the club to the extent that he is expected to becone the Director when he finishes managing. He made decisions on the training ground, stadium and youth set up that have come to fruition, HOWEVER - if Arsenal dont win the league or FA Cup this seson, a strong possiblity then it will be FOUR YEARS without winning FU.CK ALL. He is also not available as a replacement.

Mourinho - absolute c.unt of a man, but its possible (not guaranteed) that he would improve our chance of winning hte league. He is available.

O'Neill - Get a grip, Villa have won a few games and he is the right man for the job ? Fickle must be your middle name.

Ramos - For Fu.cks sake, if you think that Ramos (2 UEFA CUPS and 1 COPA DEL REY) has more chance of winning us the league than Rafa (2 SPANISH LEAGUE TITLES, 1 UEFA CUP, 1 CHAMPIONS LEAGUE and 1 FA CUP) then you are even more stupid than you look. He has managed to get Spurs to a league Cup Final in this country to date, Rafa did this in his first season.

Ericksonn - I just did a wee wee in my pants.

------------------------------------------------------------

How we have faith in Rafa, we dont know eaither, he has won nothing and proven completely useless as a manager, all he has done is get us a Champions LEague win, FA Cup win, most Premiership points we have ever had (AND that would have won hte league 3 out of 6 years before) and got us to the final of the Champions LEague again last season.

Never promotes Youth players even though they have won the kids FA Cup ? FU.CK ME YOU ARE A FU.CKING IDIOT. - take a look at the players in the last ten years of winning the FA Youth Cup and see how many play top class football now.

How did you become a mod because you have to be the rudest and most vulgar sh1t I have ever come across Leon, there is absolutely no need to use language like that, you and Lando are an absolute disgrace in that respect!!

For the record I wasn't suggesting that we get these managers I was listing managers who I think would do a better job and I stick by every single one of them.

How many youth players has Rafa brought through the ranks in 4 years, the answer is none. If you compare that to Wenger and Ferguson and many other Prem mangers then you start to see a worrying picture. Rafa would rather play Voronin than bring one of our youngsters through the ranks, hmm that must really instil belief in the youngsters!!!

I still haven't had a single person defend Rafa for continually picking Kuyt, come on you "true" fans please explain it to me.

Bring me into this again, you f*cking p*ssant, and I'll hound every post you ever make, you arrogant little WUM c*nt.

The day you stop posting sh*te is the day I stop insulting you.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND, PR*CK?

You sit yourself down on some metaphoric pedestal, believing yours to be an opinion of weight and credence. You constantly wind people up the wrong way with your backward views, and chat more sh*t than a motorised muck-spreader.
THEN, having belittled those who oppose you, you bleat, p*ss and whine about the big, bad bullies who "so unfairly" picked on you, "purely for expressing your opinion".

Well get f*cked, you grotty little w*nker.

As the saying goes - "Opinions are like a*seholes - everybody's got one."

Sadly, yours come straight FROM your a*sehole. :no

by **shadowman** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:07 pm

thats my point exactly

nobodies like sam and jorge valdano have no problem having a pop at benitez management skills.
you would not hear them say these things about fergie,wenger or jose.

i get the impression rafa is not that respect as we like to think.
where was the respect from wenger when we won the champions league.he made out we were lucky
and achieved nothing much because the prem is more harder than the champions league.
if he truly had respect for benitez he would not have said them things. yet when his team get to the final,suddenly the champions league is harder than the world cup.

by **Emerald Red** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:10 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
shadowman wrote:look at all the managers who have openly come out and had a pop at his management skills.

Yer, Allardyce sure cut Rafa down to size with his incisive criticisms, sage footballing guru that he is!

At the end of every year, Newkit should have a 'best of' and 'worst of' quotes from it's posters. I'd say his would be right up there with the best of section just for pure comedy.

by **Emerald Red** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:13 pm

shadowman wrote:thats my point exactly

nobodies like sam and jorge valdano have no problem having a pop at benitez management skills.
you would not hear them say these things about fergie,wenger or jose.

i get the impression rafa is not that respect as we like to think.
where was the respect from wenger when we won the champions league.he made out we were lucky
and achieved nothing much because the prem is more harder than the champions league.
if he truly had respect for benitez he would not have said them things. yet when his team get to the final,suddenly the champions league is harder than the world cup.

So you worry more about what rival managers think? I think you need to get a grip of your priorities, mate.

In all fairness to them, who honestly gives a flying f*ck what they think about us. If you ask me, it's all sour grapes, especially from Wenger and Fergie after we won the CL. For all their years in it, what the f*ck have they ever done? Rafa comes in, and in his first year, shows them all how it's done.

by **Bad Bob** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:15 pm

shadowman wrote:thats my point exactly

nobodies like sam and jorge valdano have no problem having a pop at benitez management skills.
you would not hear them say these things about fergie,wenger or jose.

i get the impression rafa is not that respect as we like to think.
where was the respect from wenger when we won the champions league.he made out we were lucky
and achieved nothing much because the prem is more harder than the champions league.
if he truly had respect for benitez he would not have said them things. yet when his team get to the final,suddenly the champions league is harder than the world cup.

I think you misinterpret the way it works, mate. If managers don't respect someone, they don't talk about them. It's like they don't exist. If, however, another manager worries them, they talk sh!te about them constantly. Mourinho, for instance, didn't have one civil word to say about us or Rafa during his time at Chelsea. Why? Because we were a threat (at least in the cups, at any rate).

----
But, seeing as you are the WUM Jeff Capes I don't expect you'll take any of this on board. Tara.

by **Stev1eran** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:56 pm

OK so if Rafa does end up leaving in the summer - what candidates are available to take over the managers job ?

managers out of work at present:

Mourinho - no thanks, I dont think he would be very popular and I couldn't see many of our Spanish players staying.
Alladyce, Souness, Houllier - i think that would be a step backwards
Hoddle - Strange with weird ideas
Martin Joll - jury's out..... I dont know but I wouldnt be convinced

Managers in work:

Curbishly - Yes why ? young, ambitious, concerns about handling players (he didnt get the best out of Masch) but could be promissing with a fans favourite ie ex red someone like Aldo, Rushie, Gary Mac, Phil Neal
Gus Hiddink - possibly be tempted away from Russia after Euro - yes, great pedigree, well respected and might be able to get the best out of Kuyt

other Prem managers - only Wenger would be worthy to serve at our club

So what about looking outside the box - what are your thoughts on a Director of Football, an up and coming manager and someone who has or is about to embark on their coaching badges also more emphasis put on the scouting side of the club.

My suggestions would be ;
Director - Kenny Dalglish
Manager - Steve Heighway
Coach - Sammy Lee

Others to consider : Director : Roy Evans, Manager : Mike Newell, Paul Jewell, Sammy Lee, Coach, Gary Mac, Aldo, Rushie or even Robbie

Just my thoughts..... what do you think?

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 8:26 pm

If the worst came to the worst and Rafa goes, it would have to be Maureen for me. I know it would probably upset a lot of supporters but I think he would certainly be the pick of the bunch. So if Rafa fks up and we don't qualify for next seasons CL and don't reach a cup final and dont sign Mascherano.....Maureen will get my vote.

Liverpool FC Forum

Same story, same manager, new day

Who is online