Liverpool FC Forum

by **Big Niall** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 11:34 am

If the team is out of shape under a manger who has been there nearly four years, with a nearly fully fit squad that is apparantly worth well over a hundred million - it is the managers fault.

The owners own the club - if you have the money then you can buy it but if you own the club you can appoint whatever manager you want. Especially if the current one is massively underachieving in the league nearly every year - 1 good league season in four.

by **heimdall** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 11:40 am

ruskiy playmaker wrote:
puroresu wrote:
ruskiy playmaker wrote:
bigmick wrote:Nah you didn't offend me or anyone else mate. It's probably one of those occasions where you can count yourself a bit unlucky for getting pinged. There's been numerous head high over reactions since the game which have gone unnoticed, it's your first foul and the boring old ref wants to have a word in your shell-like .

Okay, promise I'll behave.

But, I just don't understand how people can blame Rafa for the results when it's pretty obvious that the owners caused all of this. I don't remember anyone complaining about his managing abilities when we were getting decent results at the beginning of the season. What do people expect Rafa to do with the players who are so low on confidence?

I think that in the end it all comes down to the lack of funds. So many times we fail to finish teams off not because of Rafa's tactics but because we don't have enough quality players. I will not blame Rafa until I see him fail with a proper budget, like they have at Man U and Chelsea.

Its not just lack of funds. Rafa has spent money. His bought certain players that are just not good enough. Believe it or not u can find good players for less than £10 million. Our side should be good enough to beat the teams like Wigan, Birmingham, Spurs and Villa at home. Rafa has made mistakes with team selections and is not infallible.

So Rafa has made a some mistakes, but show me a manager who hasn't. Fergie and especially Mourinho have made some pretty horrible signings and with much bigger budgets (some examples Veron,Forlan,Schevchenko...). Mourinho has made a lot of tactical mistakes too but he could correct them because he had a great squad to work with. But Rafa can't do that because the quality of the squad is not good enough.

As I said before don't be quick to judge Rafa, wait and see what he can do with proper funds first. That is the only way to know if he's good enough to win us the league.

How can you defend Rafa, that I find baffling, it must be blind devotion, certainly not based on football.

Please explain to me why Rafa plays Kuyt instead of Crouch, becuase I along with most people on here don't get it. Rafa is far too slow to make substitutions, again he hesitated yesterday and it cost us, we were lucky to get a draw at the end.

BTW I've been criticising Rafa for most of the season, only difference is that now more and more people are starting to agree with me, it's time to take the rose tinted glasses off mate, Rafa has had plenty of money but just isn't good enough to win the Premiership, he is good in Europe though.

by **puroresu** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 11:45 am

So we just keep with rafa until his given £100 million to spend in one summer. Thats absurd. Its not about winning the league, we all expected us to be in the race this year and nobody was saying in the summer "the squad aint strong enough and we will be out of the race come January". Rafa was happy with his squad and the majority of fans believed this team would push Man Utd and Chelsea all the way this season. I really dont see how expecting the side to be at least in the race is to much to ask. This is Rafa's 4th season and this is his side.

by **kunilson** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:01 pm

i thought we went about the match in the right way after a nervous start. the RTK message was heard and it was a different kind of atmosphere from what i could tell....

Kuyt i thought actually did well, in terms of everything but the final shot on goal.....Torres and Gerrard weren't on fire so Benayoun did well to help out but i felt he should have been taken off on the 60 minute mark.
we started off the 2nd half positively. its just that 2nd goal problem!!!!!

Hyypia did very well and aurelio too for the most part, but we seem to panic way too much when we are not completely controlling a game, which is why days like yesterday happen. and we are only seeing flashes of the players potential during these matches. no consistancy again.....apart from the spine of the team. mascha was my man of the match......

thats it from me, no the topic can go on back to the rafa vs hillete vs gicks :;):

(and no im not dyslexic)

by **red_guy** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:06 pm

Rafa brought us our 5th European Cup. We cheered and worshipped him. Right now, he's in the worst position ever since he was appointed as Liverpool manager. Now, many LFC supporters want him out , most of em want Jose Mourinho as a replacement. Back then you all want to kick Jose in the a$$ and keep comparing Rafa to Jose, saying Rafa's the best manager in the world. It's weird though...for me at least.
Yes, he's (Rafa)a very stubborn man, made a lot of mistakes like many of us do. Same as the most of you, i got angry with Rafa everytime he made a mistake. If you think Rafa should go, then fine. You all want Jose Mourinho as the next manager, fine. I won't object. But at least show the gaffer the respect he deserves. Support him in his darkest moments as a Liverpool manager. With all the commotions with the the stupid owners and sh1t, we should back him up.

Anyway...come next season, if we still struggling in the league..then i think he should go. But for now, he needs our support.

by **ruskiy playmaker** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:31 pm

Don't you guys see that this is not the team that Rafa wants. How could you believe that we could make a challenge for title with such mediocre players in the wide positions. We are absolutely outclassed in those areas by Man U, Chelsea, and Arsenal. If this is his ideal side than why does he insist on more funds? Why is it that we are always linked with players like Malouda, Alves and Simao? That's because those are the ideal players that Rafa wants, but instead he is only given enough funds for players like Benayoun and Pennant. Sure he says that they are good enough, but I don't believe for a second that he believes that. I just want to see what Rafa would do with a proper budget. If he still decides to keep players like Kuyt and Voronin then I would not support him anymore.

by **Big Niall** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:31 pm

red_guy wrote:If you think Rafa should go, then fine. You all want Jose Mourinho as the next manager, fine. I won't object. But at least show the gaffer the respect he deserves. Support him in his darkest moments as a Liverpool manager. With all the commotions with the the stupid owners and sh1t, we should back him up.

What do you mean?

If you think Rafa should go then why would you want him to stay?

by **jono** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:31 pm

if we get new owners were still left with Rafa and all the problems we have on the pitch were poor at home, the team is not improving i bet a few of the players would love a new manager

Rafa is responsible for the team not the owners he is not gettin the best out of the team everyone just feels sorry for themselves and with the cr!p goin on behind the scenes for some this has become an excuse for playin below par, not good enough

i hope some of the players are not deliberately playin at a lower level, with the chance a new owner or manager that will come and rescue them

by **Bad Bob** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:31 pm

Kinell, it's like May Day in Red Square circa 1982 in here with all the weapons on display.

Bottom line: the team's unsettled big style and has been for weeks now. Hopefully we'll get shut of the Yanks soon and allow the focus to return to matters on the pitch. If not, we'll continue to struggle.

by **shadowman** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:59 pm

its the same pattern every time.

we get 1 stinking goal and thats enough for the players to relax and think thats all we need.
somebody equalize and suddenly you see a the team busting a gut to regain the lead.

HOW ABOUT SCORING A FEW BEFORE RELAXING YOU LAZY BUNCH SHOE HEADS.

how thick are these players how many times do they have to go through this to remember what will happen.its like the guy from heroes has wiped their memories or something.

by **puroresu** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:01 pm

ruskiy playmaker wrote:Don't you guys see that this is not the team that Rafa wants. How could you believe that we could make a challenge for title with such mediocre players in the wide positions. We are absolutely outclassed in those areas by Man U, Chelsea, and Arsenal. If this is his ideal side than why does he insist on more funds? Why is it that we are always linked with players like Malouda, Alves and Simao? That's because those are the ideal players that Rafa wants, but instead he is only given enough funds for players like Benayoun and Pennant. Sure he says that they are good enough, but I don't believe for a second that he believes that. I just want to see what Rafa would do with a proper budget. If he still decides to keep players like Kuyt and Voronin then I would not support him anymore.

Nobody forced him to sign pennant or Benayoun. If he cant find better players within the same budget thats his problem. When Pennant was signed I thought from day 1 we had paid to much for an arsenal reject.

by **Big Niall** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:08 pm

We were poor in the league before the yanks came here. The reason for our poor performance over the last four years is Benitez.

by **puroresu** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:12 pm

People should not let this Yanks situation deflect away from the poor performances on the pitch. Its easy to just lay the blame at the Americans but that aint fair. 4 seasons in and still no title challenge.

by **ruskiy playmaker** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:26 pm

puroresu wrote:
ruskiy playmaker wrote:Don't you guys see that this is not the team that Rafa wants. How could you believe that we could make a challenge for title with such mediocre players in the wide positions. We are absolutely outclassed in those areas by Man U, Chelsea, and Arsenal. If this is his ideal side than why does he insist on more funds? Why is it that we are always linked with players like Malouda, Alves and Simao? That's because those are the ideal players that Rafa wants, but instead he is only given enough funds for players like Benayoun and Pennant. Sure he says that they are good enough, but I don't believe for a second that he believes that. I just want to see what Rafa would do with a proper budget. If he still decides to keep players like Kuyt and Voronin then I would not support him anymore.

Nobody forced him to sign pennant or Benayoun. If he cant find better players within the same budget thats his problem. When Pennant was signed I thought from day 1 we had paid to much for an arsenal reject.

So who'd win us the league with this type of budget? I can't possibly think of anyone except for Wenger, but where would you find someone like him?

by **puroresu** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:32 pm

ruskiy playmaker wrote:
puroresu wrote:
ruskiy playmaker wrote:Don't you guys see that this is not the team that Rafa wants. How could you believe that we could make a challenge for title with such mediocre players in the wide positions. We are absolutely outclassed in those areas by Man U, Chelsea, and Arsenal. If this is his ideal side than why does he insist on more funds? Why is it that we are always linked with players like Malouda, Alves and Simao? That's because those are the ideal players that Rafa wants, but instead he is only given enough funds for players like Benayoun and Pennant. Sure he says that they are good enough, but I don't believe for a second that he believes that. I just want to see what Rafa would do with a proper budget. If he still decides to keep players like Kuyt and Voronin then I would not support him anymore.

Nobody forced him to sign pennant or Benayoun. If he cant find better players within the same budget thats his problem. When Pennant was signed I thought from day 1 we had paid to much for an arsenal reject.

So who'd win us the league with this type of budget? I can't possibly think of anyone except for Wenger, but where would you find someone like him?

Like I said its not just about winning the league. I expected us to at least challenge for the title and not fighting for 4th. If we can say "give us the budget of Utd or chelsea and we would win the league" then surely a Blackburn fan could say "give us the budget of Liverpool and we would be in the race for the title". This is Rafa's 4th season and we lie 14 points of the top, are below everton and have won less home games than Bolton. If I owned the club I would be asking serious questions about the results on the pitch.

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