Liverpool FC Forum

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:43 pm

Since conquering the winless Dolphins at Wembley, Giants have not lost a game away from home since, but they will be heavy underdogs against the undefeated new ENGLAND Patriots. The Giants beat the Packers in extra time in one of the greatest semi final games in league history. The temp was -15 C, and Scottish born kicker Lawrence Tynes made a 47 yard field goal to put New York through to the Superbowl.

The two teams met in the last game of the regular season, where New York came closer than any other team in their attempt to hand the Patriots their first loss of the campaign.

Sunday February 3, 23:30 GMT on BBC2 or SkySports HD

by **Big Niall** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:56 pm

I now know nothing about the sport. In 1985 there used to be a one hour highlights show every week and that was good, we all knew "the fridge" , Montana,Rice etc.

Most people in this part of world couldn't spend 4 hours watching the sport. Bring back the highlights shows.

The only player I know now is Michael Vicks and that isn't for football reasons

by **Big Niall** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:58 pm

What way was the sport before the superbowl?

by **woof woof !** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:12 pm

Always amazes me at how the power seems to shift so radically in American football. I remember a time (maybe 10-12 years ago) when the Patriots and Chargers were just cannon fodder for the likes of the Dolphins,49'rs,Bears,Redskins etc.

Is is the draft pick that's responsible for such massive shifts in pre-eminence Joe ? In premier league terms it's like seeing Derby or Birmingham muscling their way to become Englands top premiership sides.

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:23 pm

I am not sure what way was the sport means, but for a while there were two different leagues in America the NFL, which had been around for a while and the new AFL, the AFL grew very quickly and started taking some of the top talent away from the NFL, the first couple of superbowls were one off games between the two different league champions, similar to how the World Series used to be, only there was absolutely no affiliation. in the third superbowl the massively favored Baltimore Colts lost to the flashy New York Jets and it was proven that the two leagues were on equal levels, and the merged the year after.

Today there are 32 teams across the country, and it cannot really expand beyond that, there is a very high level of revenue sharing between the owners to minimize the risk and spending on players is capped to ensure that no one team can become that much better than another, talent wise. All development of talent is done by the schools, and all talent is acquired through either the college draft, bosman signings or player for player trades.

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:33 pm

woof woof ! wrote:Always amazes me at how the power seems to shift so radically in American football. I remember a time (maybe 10-12 years ago) when the Patriots and Chargers were just cannon fodder for the likes of the Dolphins,49'rs,Bears,Redskins etc.

Is is the draft pick that's responsible for such massive shifts in pre-eminence Joe ? In premier league terms it's like seeing Derby or Birmingham muscling their way to become Englands top premiership sides.

Having a top draft pick has a bigger impact in the NBA where the talent is more top heavy and there are only 5 players on the court a time, meaning one very talented player can lead his team.

But most people attribute the cap and free agency to the fluctuations, most players have escalating contracts and normally teams with a bunch of good veterans will have a one or 2 year window to win before all of their contracts get too large and then the team has to dismantle.

Two major exceptions seem to be the Colts and the Patriots. This is because both teams have drafted VERY well in the past 6-8 years. Of the colts 11 starters on offense and 11 starters on defense, ALL 22 of them had ONLY played for the Colts, that stat boggles my mind. To draft that efficiently is almost statistically impossible. the pats had won 3 out of 4 superbowls which is incredible and 3 years later with a lot of different plays (but the same core guys) have created the greatest team in American Sports History. They have a GREAT coach, and they also make a lot of VERY SHREWED moves and they do not get emotionally attached to any player and NEVER pay over the odds for anybody. often then can find talent where everyone else thinks there is none or has been washed up, such as drafting Tom Brady in the second to last round of the draft or trading for Randy Moss for an equivalent pick.

One position that is essential is having an elite QB. It is very hard (but possible) to win without championships without one.

by **Lando_Griffin** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 7:11 pm

I do not understand the sport, mainly because I have never been a*sed to find out the rules.

What EXACTLY happens, apart from a lot of stoppages and sexy birds bouncing around in next-to-nothing?

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 7:58 pm

Lando_Griffin wrote:I do not understand the sport, mainly because I have never been a*sed to find out the rules.

What EXACTLY happens, apart from a lot of stoppages and sexy birds bouncing around in next-to-nothing?

American football is quite similar to rugby league. An offensive team has four "downs" to advance the ball ten yards, if successful, they are granted a new set of downs, if not the other team takes possession. The ultimate goal, like it rugby, would be to advance the ball all the way to the opponents' goal line. Obviously the biggest difference in the two sports is that the forward pass is legal in American football, but only one forward pass per play is permitted, and it must be thrown from behind the "line of scrimmage" (where the play started), and only certain players are "eligible" to receive said forward passes (the 3/4 players in the backfield (the other one being the one throwing the pass) and the player at each end of the line of scrimmage)

american football, like rugby is a game of field position, and typically if a team is not successful after 3 downs will punt the ball further down the field to the other team on its 4th down, rather than risking giving the other team a "short field" to score from. If the team has advanced close to the goaline, they can elect to place the ball on the ground and kick the ball through the uprights for 3 points instead of risking a 4th down or punting.

Thats pretty much the easiest way I can explain it, and the reason for all the stopping and starting is that given a limited amount of trys to gain yards it is essential to have the the best suited "play call" to outwit your opponent on any given situation. Also, since substitutions are unlimited, players are frequently going in and out, and players tire more easily because they are running around with heavy equipment and train to be able to run short distances REALLY fast and to be stronger in all facets than their opponents.

Most of the outwitting in American football comes from moving players around and confusing the other team into getting favourable matchups where a fast player goes up against a not as fast player or a tall player vs. a short player, or unbalancing one side and either using it to your advantage or using the other teams overreaction to what you do to your advantage.

further reading

by **Bad Bob** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 8:13 pm

JoeTerp wrote:Thats pretty much the easiest way I can explain it, and the reason for all the stopping and starting is that given a limited amount of trys to gain yards it is essential to have the the best suited "play call" to outwit your opponent on any given situation. Also, since substitutions are unlimited, players are frequently going in and out, and players tire more easily because they are running around with heavy equipment and train to be able to run short distances REALLY fast and to be stronger in all facets than their opponents.

Most of the outwitting in American football comes from moving players around and confusing the other team into getting favourable matchups where a fast player goes up against a not as fast player or a tall player vs. a short player, or unbalancing one side and either using it to your advantage or using the other teams overreaction to what you do to your advantage.

further reading

It just occured to me that Rafa would make an outstanding NFL head coach!

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 8:18 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:Thats pretty much the easiest way I can explain it, and the reason for all the stopping and starting is that given a limited amount of trys to gain yards it is essential to have the the best suited "play call" to outwit your opponent on any given situation. Also, since substitutions are unlimited, players are frequently going in and out, and players tire more easily because they are running around with heavy equipment and train to be able to run short distances REALLY fast and to be stronger in all facets than their opponents.

Most of the outwitting in American football comes from moving players around and confusing the other team into getting favourable matchups where a fast player goes up against a not as fast player or a tall player vs. a short player, or unbalancing one side and either using it to your advantage or using the other teams overreaction to what you do to your advantage.

further reading

It just occured to me that Rafa would make an outstanding NFL head coach!

I too have thought that he would be a GREAT head coach in the NFL, he could rotate EVERY play, although the rotation of QBs has only been effective in the college ranks. ( two national titles in a row under a dual QB system), but Rafa nows to play Carra, Gerrard, and Reina every game

interesting wiki page comparing American Football to Rugby League

by **ConnO'var** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:58 am

I was in LA a couple of weeks ago and they were showing the Colts losing to the Chargers. Supposed to be some kind of major upset. As there was nothing else on the telly, I watched through the whole game and found it to be strangely compelling. I'd always found NFL to be a bit of a waste of time (sorry Joe..... no offense intended) but that game made me rethink my whole point of view.....

Perhaps because I was in a bar full of half-drunk Yanks in funny outfits and screaming their lungs out had something to do with it. I actually had a pretty good time.....

by **Big Niall** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 10:59 am

I think most people here feel the same way about American football as most americans feel about "proper"

football

Funnily enough, when I talk about football, I often have to call it "soccer" as otherwise people think I am talking about gaelic football (which I'm not really a fan of)

by **woof woof !** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:04 pm

Used to watch a lot of American Football on tv some years ago. Once I got to understand the rules and began to appreciate the "plays" I found it to be a brilliant sport. Became a big 49'rs fan.

Also, since substitutions are unlimited, players are frequently going in and out, and players tire more easily because they are running around with heavy equipment and train to be able to run short distances REALLY fast and to be stronger in all facets than their opponents.

Remember reading somewhere that the times some of the wide receivers can record for 100m would qualify them for the olympics.

by **Keris** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:27 pm

Two questions Joe;

1. How do the players remember all that plays in the playbook?

2. Why does the QB lifts his knee on a shotgun play?

Cheers.

p.s; Micah Richards makes one hell of a running back :laugh:

by **JoeTerp** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:59 pm

Keris wrote:Two questions Joe;

1. How do the players remember all that plays in the playbook?

2. Why does the QB lifts his knee on a shotgun play?

Cheers.

p.s; Micah Richards makes one hell of a running back

As a former captain of my high school team, i had to constantly remind the players to my left and right what to do on certain plays, but it isn't THAT hard because you practice running each play about 30+ times before you would try it in a game. Also there is a code within the name of a play that tells you pretty much what to do, so all you have to do really is remember the code. One really tricky part is for backup lineman who have to learn different players jobs for the same play because they would fill in for either if they got injured.

A QB would lift his knee on a shotgun play to signal to the center that he is ready for the ball to be snapped. Often in NFL stadiums the noise level is so loud that it would be risky for the QB to yell out his cadence (signal to the team when the ball will be snapped) because everybody might not hear it. So in shotgun the center will look through his legs and when the QB signals he is ready he will look forward towards the defense and then snap the ball. Defenders usually can pick up on this if the center gets lazy and goes into a pattern that can be timed. So it is important for the center to change up how long he waits after getting the signal from the QB

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