Liverpool FC Forum

by **JoeTerp** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 7:39 pm

But Kuyt's goals have come from accidentally hitting his knee or penalties

by **destro** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:44 pm

Who knows what goes on in Rafa's mind, but a possibility could be that he is playing him on the wing, which is said to be the hardest position to play, to get him use to the pace of the Premiership with maybe the thought of bringing him in to partner Torres upfront at a later stage. I know that doesn't really help in the past games where we have needed a goal but it is a possible explanation in to why he continues to play him out wide.

I am not sure about the Henry comparison just yet, but just out of interest did Wenger play Henry as a forward from the off ? I know he was a winger at Juventus but I don't really remember much about his first few games for Asenal.

by **saetiakidLFC** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:51 pm

Ive liked lucas since he first played aswell. Looks like one for next season, im not completly convinced with babel and i dont think next season will be his, maybe the year after.

He does look good but his run's with the ball baffle me, he either losses out to the first man or looks like he can run past the whole team abit more of the lat-er and he'll be top notch. Nothing wrong with his technique or mentality for me though!.

by **mart** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 11:42 pm

destro wrote:I am not sure about the Henry comparison just yet, but just out of interest did Wenger play Henry as a forward from the off ? I know he was a winger at Juventus but I don't really remember much about his first few games for Asenal.

He played as a winger for Wenger when he was at Monaco at least.

Wenger often puts strikers on the wing early in their career.

Babel looks like a great prospect but seems to lack awareness or a footballing brain atm. Hopefully he just needs some time to develop.

by **stmichael** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 2:49 pm

destro wrote:Who knows what goes on in Rafa's mind, but a possibility could be that he is playing him on the wing, which is said to be the hardest position to play, to get him use to the pace of the Premiership with maybe the thought of bringing him in to partner Torres upfront at a later stage. I know that doesn't really help in the past games where we have needed a goal but it is a possible explanation in to why he continues to play him out wide.

I am not sure about the Henry comparison just yet, but just out of interest did Wenger play Henry as a forward from the off ? I know he was a winger at Juventus but I don't really remember much about his first few games for Asenal.

How old was Henry when he went to Arsenal? Wasn't he already 23 or something?

Anyway, back to this claim that he looks better in games when he comes on as sub. The main reason for that is when he starts a game, it's on the left of midfield and he's burdened with a massive share of defensive work. He's not a left midfielder, he's a striker, hole player or a winger. When he comes off the bench it's normally up front or wide of a front three where he is much better.

For me, it's much more important how he is utilized than it is what time of the game he comes on or if he starts. A front two of Torres with Babel behind would cause lots of trouble.

by **maguskwt** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 2:58 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:
Ace Ventura wrote:
maguskwt wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:
maguskwt wrote:I've seen enough of him getting to a striker's position (by cutting in) to make this comment... it's not a judgement... it's an opinion... time and time again he gets to a good position to strike because of his pace... but time and time again he misses just wide... don't get me wrong I like his shooting technique alot... the ball is always kept lower than the bar and the shots are always fast and powerful... but he's not calculative enough... he just looks down and shoots wishing for it to go in... how about sidestepping your marker and make a simple well placed shot?... haven't seen this kind of calculativeness from him... in other words he doesn't use his head enough...

About the side stepping his marker comment, did you not see the goal at home to Derby when he sent two players the wrong way with a drop of the shoulder, then finished with a brilliant placed shot ?

Babels finish yesterday was excellent , also his shot that hit the post was really unlucky . He's defo got the ability to score alot of goals, he's proved that already this season .

all very good examples mate... but he doesn't do it often enough is my critique... he probably does it 1 out of 10 attempts he make on goal...

by **Dimshen** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 3:10 pm

I may be exposing some of my ignorence when it comes to the technical side of football, but our wide players get a tough ride i reckon as their natural ability going forward seems to be sacrificed somewhat for the sake of team defending.

Someone like Babel has no obvious natural ability in defense, however he (and the rest of the team) have to maintain a high level of discipline defnsively, which i think is both out gretest strength and our biggest downfall. Those frustrating times when we cant seem to score a goal out of nothing are down to the fact that our creative players dont get license to express themselves.

Even if we buy a high profile attacking midfielder (quaresma, ribery etc) do you think they would perform as well for us as they have done for their clubs?

by **username** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:12 pm

maguskwt wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
Ace Ventura wrote:
maguskwt wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:
maguskwt wrote:I've seen enough of him getting to a striker's position (by cutting in) to make this comment... it's not a judgement... it's an opinion... time and time again he gets to a good position to strike because of his pace... but time and time again he misses just wide... don't get me wrong I like his shooting technique alot... the ball is always kept lower than the bar and the shots are always fast and powerful... but he's not calculative enough... he just looks down and shoots wishing for it to go in... how about sidestepping your marker and make a simple well placed shot?... haven't seen this kind of calculativeness from him... in other words he doesn't use his head enough...

About the side stepping his marker comment, did you not see the goal at home to Derby when he sent two players the wrong way with a drop of the shoulder, then finished with a brilliant placed shot ?

Babels finish yesterday was excellent , also his shot that hit the post was really unlucky . He's defo got the ability to score alot of goals, he's proved that already this season .

all very good examples mate... but he doesn't do it often enough is my critique... he probably does it 1 out of 10 attempts he make on goal...

i wouldnt say that at all, everytime he shoots looks close to me, the problem is he fades out of games, so he gets less chances all together

by **Scottbot** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 1:44 am

Babel is an interesting one and i have still haven't fully made my mind up yet. From what i can see he is still a very raw player but he certainly has something about him doesn't he? He quick, his passing at times is good, he strikes a ball as well as anyone i've ever seen, he's direct, he's got a few tricks up his sleeve and isn't afraid to take it on and he's also a selfish bugger. On the downside, he still blows hot and cold, runs down blind alleys with the ball, his first touch lets him down sometimes, his passing can be inconsistent, while his shooting looks great he does have a knack of putting his shots a foot either side of the post or above the bar (of course Ronaldo hit the woodwork 12 times a couple of seasons back and now look at him!) and (as has already been pointed out) he does drift in and out of games. The last point isn't always his fault mind, sometimes on the wing your teamates simply don't get the ball to you.

definately deserves a run in the team for the time being although i would like to see him play on the right hand side where defenders can't be so certain he will cut inside all of the time. In contrast to the majority of his teamates he is playing with a lot of confidence right now and i'm certain he offers more of a threat on that right hand side than either Pennant or Bennayoun can muster just now. Still not sure he is the answer to partner Torres. I know a lot of you think that it is the dream ticket but i wander would they be treading on eachothers toes all the time? Of course the only way to find out is to try it however, I don't really see Benitez playing them together, it doesn't really fit into his usual tactical set-up. I personally think that Torres and Crouch is still our best option for a front pairing.

by **stmichael** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 3:06 pm

Other than Gerrard and Torres, Babel is the only other player scoring goals at the minute so it makes sense to start him when he's high in confidence. He's young, probably very fit and chomping at the bit to get games. I say it's time to give him a proper run in the side. Villa are a stubborn side, lethal at set-pieces off late. Ashley Young has 12 assists this term which is pretty incredible. We need our dangerous players on the pitch as often as possible from now until the end of the season to try and salvage as much from this disappointing league campaign as possible.

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:22 pm

Ace Ventura wrote:
maguskwt wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:
maguskwt wrote:I've seen enough of him getting to a striker's position (by cutting in) to make this comment... it's not a judgement... it's an opinion... time and time again he gets to a good position to strike because of his pace... but time and time again he misses just wide... don't get me wrong I like his shooting technique alot... the ball is always kept lower than the bar and the shots are always fast and powerful... but he's not calculative enough... he just looks down and shoots wishing for it to go in... how about sidestepping your marker and make a simple well placed shot?... haven't seen this kind of calculativeness from him... in other words he doesn't use his head enough...

About the side stepping his marker comment, did you not see the goal at home to Derby when he sent two players the wrong way with a drop of the shoulder, then finished with a brilliant placed shot ?

thanks for reminding me , and don't forget he;s been always asked to play as a winger

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:26 pm

maguskwt wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:
maguskwt wrote:I know lucas has potential to become a world class midfielder.... I don't know about babel mate... he seems to have potential but I'm starting to doubt this potential... he's definitely not a winger but at the same time he needs to be deadlier as a forward IMO... right now he doesn't have a striker's instinct...

because he's playing as a winger , keep ur judgement's on whether he's a good striker when he is ACTUALLY ALLOWED TO PLAY THERE!!!

I've seen enough of him getting to a striker's position (by cutting in) to make this comment... it's not a judgement... it's an opinion... time and time again he gets to a good position to strike because of his pace... but time and time again he misses just wide... don't get me wrong I like his shooting technique alot... the ball is always kept lower than the bar and the shots are always fast and powerful... but he's not calculative enough... he just looks down and shoots wishing for it to go in... how about sidestepping your marker and make a simple well placed shot?... haven't seen this kind of calculativeness from him... in other words he doesn't use his head enough...

yes mate i agree with u abt his shooting and accuracy , i even said that he needs to work on it over the summer and if he can master it , i am sure that he will be a great player for us but rafa has got to stop playing him on the wings and give him a chance , same for lucas , introduce them more often instead of just letting them rot on the bench , i am sure rafa cud play them against less capable clubs and babel has already got what 7 goals to his name? most from a sub apperance , and its his first season , shud be deffo a starter for next season if we do not buy a new striker

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:28 pm

username wrote:
maguskwt wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
Ace Ventura wrote:
maguskwt wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:
maguskwt wrote:I've seen enough of him getting to a striker's position (by cutting in) to make this comment... it's not a judgement... it's an opinion... time and time again he gets to a good position to strike because of his pace... but time and time again he misses just wide... don't get me wrong I like his shooting technique alot... the ball is always kept lower than the bar and the shots are always fast and powerful... but he's not calculative enough... he just looks down and shoots wishing for it to go in... how about sidestepping your marker and make a simple well placed shot?... haven't seen this kind of calculativeness from him... in other words he doesn't use his head enough...

About the side stepping his marker comment, did you not see the goal at home to Derby when he sent two players the wrong way with a drop of the shoulder, then finished with a brilliant placed shot ?

Babels finish yesterday was excellent , also his shot that hit the post was really unlucky . He's defo got the ability to score alot of goals, he's proved that already this season .

all very good examples mate... but he doesn't do it often enough is my critique... he probably does it 1 out of 10 attempts he make on goal...

i wouldnt say that at all, everytime he shoots looks close to me, the problem is he fades out of games, so he gets less chances all together

Like i said play him more often and maguswat give the kid a break , its only his first season , he has not done too much wrong and like some of us have mentioned , he's looks like the only other player to score

by **Toffeehater** » Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:30 pm

saetiakidLFC wrote:Ive liked lucas since he first played aswell. Looks like one for next season, im not completly convinced with babel and i dont think next season will be his, maybe the year after.

He does look good but his run's with the ball baffle me, he either losses out to the first man or looks like he can run past the whole team abit more of the lat-er and he'll be top notch. Nothing wrong with his technique or mentality for me though!.

Its his shot accuracy that's gonna kill him , he always seems to be marginally close , really hope babel emphasizes on this more in the summer

by **JamCar05** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 1:52 pm

Here's a bit from .tv on how Rafa sees Babel:

Ryan Babel has been impressing recently, are you considering to play him up-front with Torres?

He prefers to play as a striker but we have four very good strikers. Ryan is Dutch and like Bergkamp and Van Persie he will need one or two years to settle down. He will need time and we have time to support him. In the future he could be a striker, but at the moment we need him to play on the left side.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N158491080119-0942.htm

----------------------------------------------------------
So those getting their hopes up on him playing up front (which I myself would actually like to se tried out) shouldn't expect to see that happen in the near future. And probably not the ones asking for him to be played on the right wing either by the look of it. I wonder if this "need" for Babel to be utilized on the left for the moment means Rafa doesn't rate Harry as highly anymore (or maybe it's just the fact, that he can't play all the games due to his fitness, and he will instead be rotated with Babel)?

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Particularly Lucas but also Ryan Babel, - I know it's early but ..........

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