Liverpool FC Forum

by **metalhead** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:31 pm

Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims and their attention seeking, for the past six years, it's been Muslim this and Muslim that and I am sick of it. Muslims don't like this so they attention seek by blowing themselves up, it's pathetic. I dislike the attention, yet I don't blow myself up, so what's Muslims excuse?

Well,if you read my post to these threads thouroghly, you would understand that im sick of it too! you need to read the two sides of the story, your being very one sided here.

Like LFC 2007 said most muslims are against radicals and extremist's muslims point of view.

saying that you dont care israel bomb the sh!t out of us, is indeed a sick view, because it affects me and affects non-muslims FACT in the country that is getting bombed (i.e lebanon last year).

by **LFC2007** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:31 pm

Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims

You are seriously misinformed

by **puroresu** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:32 pm

shanks72 wrote:
Ciggy wrote:I would like to know why there is no protests or flag burning or condemnation for the muslims getting killed every day in Iraq by muslims
Or is a cartoon picture worst than driving cars loaded with explosives into busy markets and mosques etc causing mass carnage ok?

Taliban where kunts of the highest order killing kids and hanging women in that old football stadium with a huge crowd of supporters.

Where was the demonstrations and death threats for the torture they put them people through?
Or is stoning and hanging women and kids to death not that important.

Just wanna say i agree with ciggy here.

The Taliban had to be ousted....and the Afghan locals were grateful it was done.

Banning girls from school and forcing the women to wear burkas is outrageous....some women only continue to wear the burka because they've heard the Taliban may come back and they would be beaten if it was reported they'd discarded it.

Anyways, the Taliban are regrouping as people know...so the foreign troups must stay.

On the other hand, I think the Iraq war was totally unjustified...and although Sadamn was a tyrant...things seemed better when he was in control...

The Taliban were far from angels yet u have to wonder why there are people in afghanistan that would actually prefer the taliban to be in power? At the moment they have a puppet leader who has no control outside Kabul. There is no security, the poppy trade is booming again and the occupation doesnt look like ending anytime soon. Oh and do u honestly believe some women still wear a burka due to being scared of taliban. Cant u accept that there are women that wear it out of choice. Lets not forget after the taliban were ousted there was than American/Afghan women that entered miss World representing Afghanistan. The reaction in Afghanistan even from women was one of disgust and that women is not welcome in Afghanistan or a representative of Afghanistan.

by **Garcia10** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:33 pm

puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims and their attention seeking, for the past six years, it's been Muslim this and Muslim that and I am sick of it. Muslims don't like this so they attention seek by blowing themselves up, it's pathetic. I dislike the attention, yet I don't blow myself up, so what's Muslims excuse?

Have you ever wondered why Islam is so widespread in the media? Maybe if western nations stop invading muslim lands u may see less of the attention seeking in muslims.

Valid point, take your complaints and your bombs to the White House and Dowing Street. Secondly if Muslims dislike the West, f.uck off back to the Middle East and thirdly, this sucide cult has been going on for decades and the intolerance of Muslims in the UK when Salman released his book spoke wonders for this so called tolerant religion. When Muslims show tolerance to people, is when I'll show tolerance to Muslims, until then I shall keep my views, Good day, good night and God Bless Rushdie, he's earnt his Knighthood.

by **metalhead** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:38 pm

Garcia10 wrote:
puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims and their attention seeking, for the past six years, it's been Muslim this and Muslim that and I am sick of it. Muslims don't like this so they attention seek by blowing themselves up, it's pathetic. I dislike the attention, yet I don't blow myself up, so what's Muslims excuse?

Have you ever wondered why Islam is so widespread in the media? Maybe if western nations stop invading muslim lands u may see less of the attention seeking in muslims.

Valid point, take your complaints and your bombs to the White House and Dowing Street. Secondly if Muslims dislike the West, f.uck off back to the Middle East and thirdly, this sucide cult has been going on for decades and the intolerance of Muslims in the UK when Salman released his book spoke wonders for this so called tolerant religion. When Muslims show tolerance to people, is when I'll show tolerance to Muslims, until then I shall keep my views, Good day, good night and God Bless Rushdie, he's earnt his Knighthood.

*sigh*

really misinformed

by **puroresu** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:40 pm

Garcia10 wrote:
puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims and their attention seeking, for the past six years, it's been Muslim this and Muslim that and I am sick of it. Muslims don't like this so they attention seek by blowing themselves up, it's pathetic. I dislike the attention, yet I don't blow myself up, so what's Muslims excuse?

Have you ever wondered why Islam is so widespread in the media? Maybe if western nations stop invading muslim lands u may see less of the attention seeking in muslims.

Valid point, take your complaints and your bombs to the White House and Dowing Street. Secondly if Muslims dislike the West, f.uck off back to the Middle East and thirdly, this sucide cult has been going on for decades and the intolerance of Muslims in the UK when Salman released his book spoke wonders for this so called tolerant religion. When Muslims show tolerance to people, is when I'll show tolerance to Muslims, until then I shall keep my views, Good day, good night and God Bless Rushdie, he's earnt his Knighthood.

Tolerance. There is enough in Islamic history that shows plenty of tolerance. Islam could of easily wiped out the christians and jews in the Arab world Africa and Spain yet didn't as our religion doesn't tell us to kill non muslims.

Its not about disliking the west. Its about the Western leaders propping up despotic, tyrannical regimes in the Islamic World. On the one hand u shout "democracy, freedom, moderation etc" while on the other hand the west continues to support the oppressors in Muslim lands. Wouldnt u agree its hard to preach about the wests great values while they contradict this same values at the same time.

Oh and believe it or not the West have been causing chaos and havoc all over the world for decades. Supporting terrorists when they want, dropping bombs when they want, invading nations when they want, causing coups when they want. But I guess thats ok as they are not muslims.

by **puroresu** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:48 pm

Metalhead whats your views on whats going on in Lebanon at the moment? Who do u feel is the reason behind the conflict?

by **LFC2007** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:58 pm

puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:
puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims and their attention seeking, for the past six years, it's been Muslim this and Muslim that and I am sick of it. Muslims don't like this so they attention seek by blowing themselves up, it's pathetic. I dislike the attention, yet I don't blow myself up, so what's Muslims excuse?

Have you ever wondered why Islam is so widespread in the media? Maybe if western nations stop invading muslim lands u may see less of the attention seeking in muslims.

Valid point, take your complaints and your bombs to the White House and Dowing Street. Secondly if Muslims dislike the West, f.uck off back to the Middle East and thirdly, this sucide cult has been going on for decades and the intolerance of Muslims in the UK when Salman released his book spoke wonders for this so called tolerant religion. When Muslims show tolerance to people, is when I'll show tolerance to Muslims, until then I shall keep my views, Good day, good night and God Bless Rushdie, he's earnt his Knighthood.

Tolerance. There is enough in Islamic history that shows plenty of tolerance. Islam could of easily wiped out the christians and jews in the Arab world Africa and Spain yet didn't as our religion doesn't tell us to kill non muslims.

Its not about disliking the west. Its about the Western leaders propping up despotic, tyrannical regimes in the Islamic World. On the one hand u shout "democracy, freedom, moderation etc" while on the other hand the west continues to support the oppressors in Muslim lands. Wouldnt u agree its hard to preach about the wests great values while they contradict this same values at the same time.

Oh and believe it or not the West have been causing chaos and havoc all over the world for decades. Supporting terrorists when they want, dropping bombs when they want, invading nations when they want, causing coups when they want. But I guess thats ok as they are not muslims.

You generalise the "west" just like that numpty is generalising "Muslims".

If you're going to criticise the west, be specific, there were 1 million people in the streets of London protesting against the war in Iraq, are you also including them in your assessment?

We don't contradict any values whatsoever, "we" do not even necessarily support the intervention in the middle east.

This anti-muslim bloke is being matched by your anti-western rant but to a lesser degree.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:39 pm

puroresu wrote:The Taliban were far from angels yet u have to wonder why there are people in afghanistan that would actually prefer the taliban to be in power? At the moment they have a puppet leader who has no control outside Kabul. There is no security, the poppy trade is booming again and the occupation doesnt look like ending anytime soon. Oh and do u honestly believe some women still wear a burka due to being scared of taliban. Cant u accept that there are women that wear it out of choice. Lets not forget after the taliban were ousted there was than American/Afghan women that entered miss World representing Afghanistan. The reaction in Afghanistan even from women was one of disgust and that women is not welcome in Afghanistan or a representative of Afghanistan.

There are those who preferred life under the Taliban but I read a report the other day and it seemed pretty clear that most people wanted to live without the Taliban.

The Taliban were ruthless, human rights did not exist, the number of activities they banned is unbelievable, they undertook public executions, public hangings etc. - it's not up for debate.

What is up for debate is what is the alternative?

Let it continue as a training ground for Al qaeda?

It's a difficult question, but I'd like to know what you would have suggested, people are quick to denigrate the occupying force, yet they never come up with an alternative way of getting rid of the Taliban.

by **puroresu** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:57 pm

LFC2007 wrote:
puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:
puroresu wrote:
Garcia10 wrote:I'm not against Muslims, I am just sick of Muslims and their attention seeking, for the past six years, it's been Muslim this and Muslim that and I am sick of it. Muslims don't like this so they attention seek by blowing themselves up, it's pathetic. I dislike the attention, yet I don't blow myself up, so what's Muslims excuse?

Have you ever wondered why Islam is so widespread in the media? Maybe if western nations stop invading muslim lands u may see less of the attention seeking in muslims.

Valid point, take your complaints and your bombs to the White House and Dowing Street. Secondly if Muslims dislike the West, f.uck off back to the Middle East and thirdly, this sucide cult has been going on for decades and the intolerance of Muslims in the UK when Salman released his book spoke wonders for this so called tolerant religion. When Muslims show tolerance to people, is when I'll show tolerance to Muslims, until then I shall keep my views, Good day, good night and God Bless Rushdie, he's earnt his Knighthood.

Tolerance. There is enough in Islamic history that shows plenty of tolerance. Islam could of easily wiped out the christians and jews in the Arab world Africa and Spain yet didn't as our religion doesn't tell us to kill non muslims.

Its not about disliking the west. Its about the Western leaders propping up despotic, tyrannical regimes in the Islamic World. On the one hand u shout "democracy, freedom, moderation etc" while on the other hand the west continues to support the oppressors in Muslim lands. Wouldnt u agree its hard to preach about the wests great values while they contradict this same values at the same time.

Oh and believe it or not the West have been causing chaos and havoc all over the world for decades. Supporting terrorists when they want, dropping bombs when they want, invading nations when they want, causing coups when they want. But I guess thats ok as they are not muslims.

You generalise the "west" just like that numpty is generalising "Muslims".

If you're going to criticise the west, be specific, there were 1 million people in the streets of London protesting against the war in Iraq, are you also including them in your assessment?

We don't contradict any values whatsoever, "we" do not even necessarily support the intervention in the middle east.

This anti-muslim bloke is being matched by your anti-western rant but to a lesser degree.

When I say 'West' I mean western governments not population.

The only way to get rid of illegitimate regimes is through internal means. The Taliban were awful yet there are plenty of tyrants in this world but the answer is not to use outside force to get rid of the awful regimes.

If 9/11 wouldn't of happened would the West of cared about the Taliban? Western governments only choose to moan about regimes when it benefits there interests.

Another example being Gaddafi of Libya. He was a tryant not to long ago. Now his a friend of the west as he has done what they asked. The people of Libya still have to live under his draconian policies but thats ok as Gadaffi is now a 'moderate'.

I wish all the despots, kings, tyrants in the Muslim world were removed but if I was told a US/Western invasion could make it happen I would decline that option.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:28 pm

puroresu wrote:When I say 'West' I mean western governments not population.

The only way to get rid of illegitimate regimes is through internal means. The Taliban were awful yet there are plenty of tyrants in this world but the answer is not to use outside force to get rid of the awful regimes.

If 9/11 wouldn't of happened would the West of cared about the Taliban? Western governments only choose to moan about regimes when it benefits there interests.

Another example being Gaddafi of Libya. He was a tryant not to long ago. Now his a friend of the west as he has done what they asked. The people of Libya still have to live under his draconian policies but thats ok as Gadaffi is now a 'moderate'.

I wish all the despots, kings, tyrants in the Muslim world were removed but if I was told a US/Western invasion could make it happen I would decline that option.

The reason given for invading Afghanistan was because it was used as a training ground for terrorists, that is where the distinction lies. Al qaeda were training terrorists there to attack not only America, but many many countries throughout the world - Bali, Morocco, Spain, Egypt, Somalia, Pakistan, Algeria and so on.....

The Afghanistan situation is very different from Iraq, there was a global terror threat. I don't see how you can eradicate that threat without cutting off the basis of it which was in Afghanistan.

How do you remove such a radical teror group internally? Diplomacy doens't work with these people, they see justification in purposely killing people by gratuitous acts of mass violence.

If you can suggest another way they could have been removed, go ahead.

by **Ciggy** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:37 pm

The other day people all over the world set off balloons for Maddy Mc Cann, in Afghanistan they had a kite display to my horror the fella on the news said they are flying kites something that was banned when the Taliban was in power.

Now forgive me if I am being naive but what the feckinell is that supposed to be?
Not letting people & kids fly kites?
That is not in the koran but what harm could that possibly do to anyone Im lost I just dont understand it.
:no

by **shanks72** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:49 pm

puroresu wrote:
shanks72 wrote:
Ciggy wrote:I would like to know why there is no protests or flag burning or condemnation for the muslims getting killed every day in Iraq by muslims
Or is a cartoon picture worst than driving cars loaded with explosives into busy markets and mosques etc causing mass carnage ok?

Taliban where kunts of the highest order killing kids and hanging women in that old football stadium with a huge crowd of supporters.

Where was the demonstrations and death threats for the torture they put them people through?
Or is stoning and hanging women and kids to death not that important.

Just wanna say i agree with ciggy here.

The Taliban had to be ousted....and the Afghan locals were grateful it was done.

Banning girls from school and forcing the women to wear burkas is outrageous....some women only continue to wear the burka because they've heard the Taliban may come back and they would be beaten if it was reported they'd discarded it.

Anyways, the Taliban are regrouping as people know...so the foreign troups must stay.

On the other hand, I think the Iraq war was totally unjustified...and although Sadamn was a tyrant...things seemed better when he was in control...

The Taliban were far from angels yet u have to wonder why there are people in afghanistan that would actually prefer the taliban to be in power? At the moment they have a puppet leader who has no control outside Kabul. There is no security, the poppy trade is booming again and the occupation doesnt look like ending anytime soon. Oh and do u honestly believe some women still wear a burka due to being scared of taliban. Cant u accept that there are women that wear it out of choice. Lets not forget after the taliban were ousted there was than American/Afghan women that entered miss World representing Afghanistan. The reaction in Afghanistan even from women was one of disgust and that women is not welcome in Afghanistan or a representative of Afghanistan.

I can only assume that you do not watch any documentaries on the people of Afghanistan....

The other eve I watched a brilliant 'Dispatches' docu called 'Afghanistan Unveiled'...

The reporter talked to women who ran schools for girls....which were banned under the Taliban.
She talked to the girls themselves who were very keen to get an education...

Their schools would go if the Taliban returned and they would be forced to go underground which would result in severe punishment for the women teachers if they were discovered.

Marriages are still being arranged for child-brides. One girl was married off when she was 7 years old.
(Her father sold her which is why the marriage was arranged). I realise there is extreme poverty in some places, but surely there is another way to survive without selling your daughter.

The girl in question was interviewed...she tried to commit suicide when she was 11 by setting herself alight...which apparently more women are doing who are forced into arranged marriages.

Fortunately she survived...but her legs were badly scarred, so she said she had to stay in the marriage as she had nowhere else to go. She regretted burning herself....but was too young to know better really, when she did it.

Another woman, who was not expected to survive, had burned herself to escape the beatings inflicted on her by her husband's family.

I believe women are treated as second class citizens in muslim countries. I have heard that simetimes they are treated worse than animals.

In answer to your q. Of course I realise there are women who want to wear the burka. But I would question whether this was out of fear.
I have seen muslim men interviewed who've said they wouldn't be able to control themselves if the women weren't covered!

I have seen docu's where women have said they were beaten by the Taliban for not wearing the burka and I've seen women being beaten by the Taliban just because they were women.

The Taliban are dispicable and I pray they don't get back in power...for the sake of the women if nothing else.

The burka was demonstrated by one woman who said it was very uncomfortable and made them feel hot and sticky.

I know that muslim women like to cover their heads because of what they believe...but it should be up to them.
They shouldn't be forced to do anything they don't want to. And they should only wear the burka through choice.

The Taliban also executed women for minor offences.
I saw a prog. which showed a woman who was in prison for leaving her husband. She had twins that she was still breastfeeding....but when they were weaned...the Taliban took her to the football ground that Ciggy mentioned and shot her in the head. Thus depriving her children of a mother. And a woman of her free choice.

The Taliban also banned music and players and men were forced to grow beards. Of course there will be men who wear beards anyway...but men wear interviewed who would rather have a choice.

The Taliban are totally screwed up...

I think our troups are doing a wonderful job out there...
and I think most Afghans would agree.

by **redtrader74** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:16 pm

It seems to me the muslim world only look outside and see western oppression and can't see that of their own. Palestinian lands,(there actually wasn't a country) are also under occupation from the neighbouring egypt, syria, jordan and lebanon. The palestinian people were spread all over the region, but the only people that get sh!t for any apparent occupation is Israel. That part of the world is as much jewish,christian and muslim, all three could claim it to be theirs.

The Taliban were also an occupational oppressor, they were the remnants of mercenaries forces, the mujahadeen, and these mercenaries were from Saudi, Egypt, pakistan etc.etc, yet no muslim countries had a problem with this occupation and oppression, no muslims were marching the streets of London saying get the taliban out.

Can anyone explain what western occupation of muslim lands were their before 9/11? what instigated that?

Oh and Puroresu, the poppy trade (heroine) was at its peak during the talibans reign, they didn't mind that being cultivated, very Islamic, but i suppose it didn't matter because the vast majority was bound for the infidels in the west.

I suppose the mass killings in gaza, between fata and hamas are down to the west aswell? I have not heard a thing about these deaths, do only deaths by non muslims hurt?

Moderate muslims need to hold their hands up and admit what is wrong with the radicalism in their midst, without saying BUT, you need to be the whistle blowers in your community, before you blame anyone.

by **112-1077774096** » Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:58 am

i suppose when muslim countries get their own houses in order then they can preach to us, but preaching while attrocities are going on in the name of islam is just laughable.

as i have said before more moderate muslims need to speak up against the extremists or they are getting tarred with the same brush by the s*n reading knuckle draggers who believe everything they read in the press.

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