Liverpool FC Forum

by **Rafa D** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:27 pm

Am I reading this right?

We are all looking forward to our 2nd Champions League Final in 3 seasons and our 3rd final and possible 3rd major cups in the last 3 seasons and people are questioning Benitez and whether this season is successful or not?

I weren't around to remember the glorious 80's were we was winning on all fronts but I DO remember vividly losing to Celtic, PSG and Strausbourg and getting knocked out off the UEFA Cup!

What he has acheived is such a short amount of time is nothing short of magnificent. Ask a Chelsea fan where he would rather be now, in their position or ours? Ask any other major football club fan where he wants to be on May 23rd and I guarantee you most fans would gladly give up their season performance for a go at the biggest prize of them all.

The league performance has not been good enough, but looking at it, we finished 3rd behind the 2 power houses (money wise) in English football. We could of done better, we think we should of and thats because of the winning mentality that Benitez has installed at the club.

There were times we would lose to Ipswich, Watford and the like at home. Could you see that under Rafa? no fu.cking chance.

The league performance, not good enough, but our season isnt even over yet. Were playing in the biggest game of the season in 9 days and its were every other football club wants to be.

by **yckatbjywtbiastkamb** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:28 pm

i dont think people realise the shell of a club rafa took over, everyone who was half decent wanted out, even players like gerrard and owen who had come through the youth system wanted out and why?
because they thought it virtually impossible they could win any major honours with liverpool in the foreseeable future.
we have not got a god given right to win the league, we are trying to compete with possibly the biggest club in world football and the richest but some on here think by stamping their feet and complaining like spoilt kids somethings going to change.
rafa benitez has performed a miracle at this club, pundits had even stopped mentioning us as a big club on the telly - it was all chelsea, united and arsenal.
speaking of arsenal a few on here always seem to mention them in glowing terms but a minor point that may have escaped your notice is that we have finished above them for the past 2 seasons now.
things dont happen in football overnight, unless you have the type of dough chelsea have and even then raneiri couldnt win it though admittedly he came close.
putting unrealistic targets for benitez is ridiculous because no one on earth could do a better job, do people think if mourinho or ferguson took over the pile of :censored:

houllier left behind they`d get to 2 champions league finals in 3 years and finish above arsenal twice?
looking at the likes of diouf, diao and cheyrou i would have been happy just to qualify for the champions league twice in three years never mind get to 2 finals!
if rafa wins the league once in the next five years he would have done well.
how many people on here know how many league titles bill shankly won in 15 years at anfield? i suspect half of you would have sniped at him because of the stick your getting from your chelsea, arsenal and united mates.
jesus, i just cant believe where the support of this club is going.
rafa benitez is a brilliant manager not a f**king miracle worker, but i must admit he`s doing a good impression of one.

by **Sabre** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:33 pm

One sign of how is your squad is the winter transfer market. And we've been trying to sign up players in winter and we seemed to be in need of that. Rafa did make some comments about him not getting what he wants, and some concerns in summer aswell because the signing ups came later than expected.

At some point in this season, Zenden played in the middle because he was the only available midfielder, our squad wasn't deep enough. Our second goalie wasn't good enough for this club, and we only replaced somehow the gone Kronkamp with Arbeloa in winter. We were lucky that Finnan wasn't injured.

This season could have done better, no doubt, but football are a lot of impredictible factors, and to respond to all of them you need both a deep squad and some luck, as in all games. We didn't have all the luck of the world and we did make many mistakes at the start of the season already mentioned by lots of us. I don't think LFC is more far of winning it than United was yesteryear. Quite simply the lads must keep working, Rafa keep thinking, and the new owners put the necessary money over the table.

I think it's reasonable to ask LFC to be close to win it next year!

by **red37** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:45 pm

Sabre wrote:I think it's reasonable to ask LFC to be close to win it next year!

Its come to the point now where, not only is it reasonable...its nigh on going to be expected

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:45 pm

- Not having our best left sided midfielder available all season, a player who contributed a lot last season to our strong performances.

- Having Zenden as our 4th choice central midfielder opposed to Hamann, Zenden is not a central midfielder.

- Last season we were extremely lucky with injuries after November, this season we have had a normal amount of injuries and it has shown up some frailties in our squad that maybe were hidden last year.

Those 3 factors were out of Rafa’s hands but I still think we should have achieved 80 points this season. Last season we over achieved in the league, this year we have under achieved mainly down to Rafa. I think we are a squad capable of achieving 80 points in the league as well as competing in the Champions League, Rafa needs to bring in a couple of outstanding players to make us a 90 points team who can compete in the Champions League at the same time.

by **Sabre** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:49 pm

But expected is such a strong word, isn't it red37?. There's huge amounts of uncertainty in this game otherwise betting would be easy, so to say you expect it is to think that you're far better than all the opposition, and the difference between the top 3 clubs is minimal (remember, the respect to the rivals and all that :;):

) .

What I do *expect* though, is that we do not do the same mistakes of this years, signing-up wise and line-up selection wise, and preparation-wise in the preseason. If all the work is well done, the chances to win it are a lot more.

by **red37** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:52 pm

Sabre wrote:But expected is such a strong word, isn't it red37?

This club is built on such principles. Long may those days return. Soon.

by **Sabre** » Mon May 14, 2007 9:53 pm

I see where you're coming from

and I agree, I just got it wrong slightly the word (excuse me).

by **Redstavro** » Mon May 14, 2007 10:17 pm

you lot should go and support a team like charlton so you can have something to really whinge about ffs your starting to sound like manure fans to much of a good thing.

by **aCe'** » Mon May 14, 2007 10:21 pm

i wouldnt say disappointing season.... 3rd and champions league finalists is as good as it gets with the players we got to be real...
besides gerrard and -to some extent- alonso, we seem to be short of quality players..
mascherano is a great prospect.. great performances and a player i highly rate but in a perfect world he wouldnt be starting 11 with gerrard and xabi playing in the middle... carra is our player of the season...great defender and finnan is reliable but thats about it...
thats the difference between manutd..chelsea and liverpool... until we can get some quality players in needed positions we'r stuck in that 3rd position.. our attacking options are embarresing in comparison to chelsea and manus and even arsenals ... rafas a great manager but he needs to start making some better buys in the summer !
lucas seems like a good player from what iv heard and seen of him but do we actually need him ? where will he play... there 8mill gone for a player we dont know and seemingly dont need..
i dont see us signing any of the likes of villa, etoo or even tevez much as id love to see any of them play for us... but if rafa keeps pulling out of deals just because -to him- the price 'isnt right'... we'r stuck with players who will work their as.ses off only for us to end up in 3rd place again...
pennant has been brilliant this season... to me was one of the best players... was one of the only players who made a difference when going forward... gerrard on the right side is a waste .... play him in the center and get the most out of him ffs ! we dont need to sign lucas for 8 mill when we have gerrard and alonso and masch and sissoko all playing there already !
kuyt .. bellamy and crouch... seriously ! compare to any of the other top sides... rooney..saha...shevchenko..drogba...henry...vanpersie...

with the players we have... 3rd in the league is wwhat we get...
rafa got us to the champs league final... that he gets credit for !

by **Redstavro** » Mon May 14, 2007 10:36 pm

in a perfect world you wouldnt play mascherano why?

by **Redstavro** » Mon May 14, 2007 10:47 pm

mascherano is going to be up there with souness, molby, kennedy, macmahon, gerrard . very high quality player. when you go the game you can see it

by **redtrader74** » Mon May 14, 2007 10:50 pm

Sabre wrote:I see where you're coming from and I agree, I just got it wrong slightly the word (excuse me).

Hey Sabre don't give up so easily, you were right first time.

Expected is unreasonable. We can only expect achievements in line with the tools we have, If you believe Rafa inadequate then we can't expect to win the league. If you believe the players inadequate again you can't expect to win the league.

We need to objectively assess our Club, then compare it to the rivals and then set a minimum expectation. ATM we are massively behind in funds, we have in the forward line the weakest of the top four. A back line on par, and probably the best, tied midfield. We have imho the better manager.

So what can you expect from that? Imo you can expect that on one off occasions, in shorter formats, that the skill of the manager might be the deciding factor.

I've seen posts saying we should have 80 points or so, wtf, we've been out of contention for the league for a while, and were concentrating on the one trophy we could win. So the performance was bound to drop in the league.

I want the league as much as anyone here, but we need to be closer in the funds to at least the mancs. Also given time, Rafa could start to bring through his own youth players. Wenger has had 11 years to get his youngsters, Rudolph 21 years and Maureen unlimited money.

I agree the early season away form cost us the chance to compete for the title, but to win it this year would really have been miraculous, and Rafa has not started walking on water just yet.

by **aCe'** » Mon May 14, 2007 10:59 pm

Redstavro wrote:in a perfect world you wouldnt play mascherano why?

out of mascherano alonso and gerrard .. pick two..
there you go...
you cant play him based on how good you think he migt become...
im saying... to me... hes better than carrick of manutd and owen harg. of bayern... but not better than xabi and gerrard.

i think gerrard is the best central midfielder in the world... can defend ...can go forward... can hit them from far and close ...
when it comes to the right side... not even in my top10 player list...
i could have understood rafa playing him there last season when we had no other options but this season with pennant here it was uncalled for...
next season i can see rafa throwing him in the right side again and it bothers me quite abit...

an ideal midfield 4 would look something like this in my books...

Pennant Gerrard Alonso NEWLEFTMID

with 1 or 2 new quality strikers and the defenders we got now and maybe one more CB.... we'd be ready for a title challenge imo...

by **Penguins** » Mon May 14, 2007 11:02 pm

yckatbjywtbiastkamb wrote:i dont think people realise the shell of a club rafa took over, everyone who was half decent wanted out, even players like gerrard and owen who had come through the youth system wanted out and why?
because they thought it virtually impossible they could win any major honours with liverpool in the foreseeable future.
we have not got a god given right to win the league, we are trying to compete with possibly the biggest club in world football and the richest but some on here think by stamping their feet and complaining like spoilt kids somethings going to change.
rafa benitez has performed a miracle at this club, pundits had even stopped mentioning us as a big club on the telly - it was all chelsea, united and arsenal.
speaking of arsenal a few on here always seem to mention them in glowing terms but a minor point that may have escaped your notice is that we have finished above them for the past 2 seasons now.
things dont happen in football overnight, unless you have the type of dough chelsea have and even then raneiri couldnt win it though admittedly he came close.
putting unrealistic targets for benitez is ridiculous because no one on earth could do a better job, do people think if mourinho or ferguson took over the pile of houllier left behind they`d get to 2 champions league finals in 3 years and finish above arsenal twice?
looking at the likes of diouf, diao and cheyrou i would have been happy just to qualify for the champions league twice in three years never mind get to 2 finals!
if rafa wins the league once in the next five years he would have done well.
how many people on here know how many league titles bill shankly won in 15 years at anfield? i suspect half of you would have sniped at him because of the stick your getting from your chelsea, arsenal and united mates.
jesus, i just cant believe where the support of this club is going.
rafa benitez is a brilliant manager not a f**king miracle worker, but i must admit he`s doing a good impression of one.

Totally agree.
Can't believe how fast some people have forgotten where we were 3 years ago. On a ship sinking fast that's where.

Benitez has practically never so far been given his first choice players and not one single player has cost above 10 million!!!
And still the league should be in our pocket?
Why? Cause we lack top class players and spend our whole budget on what our rivals spend on one player?

20 out of 25 players have been replaced in 3 years!!
And still rafa is building a team and until he can pick whatever player he wants it will be a work in progress.
Manure has had a well oiled team that has many players with experience playing together for many years on title winning sides.
Chelski has spent 20 times what we have on our starting elven and they might have a league cup to show for it with but not one single showing in the champ league final.
I suspect next season will be tough early on cause more players will join this summer than our rivals cause they have more top quality in their teams.
And since teams just love to haggle with rafa trying to make him pay way over the odds I can see some late signing in August.
And it's not what rafa want or doesn't want. If that were the casr Alves and Simao would already be strutting around in a red uniform. And nobody knows still if he can get exactly all that players he want and with the right quality.

Villa, Eto'o Torres etc will just not come.
I can't see us spending that amount on a player right or wrong.
Remember Cissé is the most expensive player ever at 14 million!
What makes you think all of a sudden we'll buy 2 players for 30-40 million at least. Not happening!
Through patience, hard work and lots of luck we might be successful but not by having better players on paper.

Liverpool FC Forum

A hugely disappointing season....on many fronts - Let not athens distract you....

Who is online