Liverpool FC Forum

Stu.Murph wrote:He has a world class shot, is a world class tackler and has world class leadership qualities.

After that I would say none of his other attributes are world class. I'd say everything is very to excellent, but not world class. Hence the reason he should never be deployed in an "attacking" role or a "defensive" role. But one he should be forced into doing everything in.

bigmick wrote:Theres no real science as such to my theories on the make up of a football team and I must apologize in advance if I've given the impression that there is any kind of mystic status to my ramblings.

  Just to expand slightly though on the question of balance and where Gerrard fits best into a given system against Chelsea, people ought to beware I should think of believing that sticking Gerrard central is the nailed on certain way of giving us more oomph going forward on Tuesday night. There is a very distinct danger that shoving Gerrard inside will make the thing worse, as the formentioned triangle contains another one of our best players. Gerrards record FWIW in head to heads against Makeleli is not good and the little Frenchman has kept him quiet many times in the past.

All that said though, on balance I should think it's worth a try. At the very least, playing Gerrard as the furthest forward of a central three would relieve him of any defensive responsibilities whatsoever and enable him to concentrate his efforts on making something happen up top. The central midfield pairing of Alonso and Mascherano worries me though, and I think there is yet a possibility that Rafa will choose to leave the Argentinian out and play Gerrard as one of a central two.

It may well be a game which is won or lost by a shrewd tactical substitution. Watch carefully if Gerrard is getting smothered in that triangle centrally for him being switched back out to the right or even heaven forbid out to the left. It's vital that we get our best player on the ball this time as much as possible. Similarly, if Alonso and Masherano decide to play within five yards of each other again we could be in a position where we permanently have six men behind the ball. In this instance I would think he'll pull the Argentine and go back to two up top, leaving gerrard as one of a central two. As for who plays up top I'd defenately go for crouch. The inclusion of the big fella will ensure Chelsea defend high up and I have a hunch that we might just be able to get in behind.

The last fly in the ointment could just be Sissoko. As I've said many times, if he was anywhere near his best he would be a definate starter almost every week for me. Don't be surprised if Rafa opts to start with him on Tuesday, or at the very least introduce him as a sub. If he does get on, don't look for World-Class passes or vision, or a goal threat but do watch for destructive running, ball winning and system breaking which is unparallelled in the Premiership. Notice how all of a sudden balls which go into the Bermuda triangle quite often come out with a red shirt in posession, how occasionally a blue shirt has his pocket picked deep behind enemy lines causing panic in the ranks and creaks in the system. It wouldn't be pretty, but a Sissoko anywhere near his best might just be the factor which gets us through on the night.

All that said, I don't think he'll play.    It'll be a five man midfield, and I think Rafa will go with Kuyt on his own up front. And I think we'll win 1-0 and it will go to extra time where from then on it's a lottery.

Sabre wrote:

The Specialist wrote:

Sabre wrote:

Bamaga man wrote:

Well sorry, mate, but if you can't be bothered I guess I can't be bothered taking your assessment seriously.  I mean, if the stray passes weren't memorable enough to discuss they clearly didn't hurt us that badly.  And, let's be fair, our lads were producing stray passes all over the park.  Were any of Alonso's seriously worse than the nightmare back pass from Riise or the Mascherano gift to Drogba?  Gerrard had several passes cut out by Carvalho and Zenden passed it straight to Makelele on at least two occasions.  I'd be willing to bet that Alonso completed a lot more passes as a percentage than most of his teammates. 

Alonso tinted glasses !

Scarce live football in many posters, and poor understanding of the game if you ask me. Too much TV and youtube, and resistance to admit one is wrong -- when you reach to argue with questions and you admit you can't get into facts, it's the time to drop it.

Good thread.

I think that patronising comment was aimed at me, not you Bamaga Man...

I will never admit I am wrong, because I don't think I am. As I said, I don't watch games and remember every single play. I only tend to remember the important/match changing ones. It's my overall assesment that Alonso had a poor game.

Again, if anyone wants to dismiss me - they can. It's fair to do so, as I don't want to/can't remember enough to get into a well thought out argument on the matter. To sit and post something like Sabre has is a bit much, though. I mean, Sabre, you act like you were at the game? You get your coverage off TV...

I have a lot  to read in this thread, but first things first.

yes it was aimed to you, and yes I saw the game in TV. But I count my live games of a top league (spanish) by houndreds, and my criticism was aimed to those who are too harsh with some players without actually knowing well the game

That said, don't take it too personally, I don't recall a pattern of bad posts in you, I was a bit angry  because I felt that Alonso was being unfairly criticised, and the previous posts stated that we had some sort of red tinted glasses with Alonso, and since I  *try* to be impartial I overreacted a bit.

That's why I answered that way, but it was unfair, because I can't say your posts are bad at all so far.

Sorry for that mate, honestly. I'd just PM you to do this, but I wanted the others saw I was wrong saying that aswell.

Sabre wrote:

The Specialist wrote:

Sabre wrote:

Bamaga man wrote:

Well sorry, mate, but if you can't be bothered I guess I can't be bothered taking your assessment seriously.  I mean, if the stray passes weren't memorable enough to discuss they clearly didn't hurt us that badly.  And, let's be fair, our lads were producing stray passes all over the park.  Were any of Alonso's seriously worse than the nightmare back pass from Riise or the Mascherano gift to Drogba?  Gerrard had several passes cut out by Carvalho and Zenden passed it straight to Makelele on at least two occasions.  I'd be willing to bet that Alonso completed a lot more passes as a percentage than most of his teammates. 

Alonso tinted glasses !

Scarce live football in many posters, and poor understanding of the game if you ask me. Too much TV and youtube, and resistance to admit one is wrong -- when you reach to argue with questions and you admit you can't get into facts, it's the time to drop it.

Good thread.

I think that patronising comment was aimed at me, not you Bamaga Man...

I will never admit I am wrong, because I don't think I am. As I said, I don't watch games and remember every single play. I only tend to remember the important/match changing ones. It's my overall assesment that Alonso had a poor game.

Again, if anyone wants to dismiss me - they can. It's fair to do so, as I don't want to/can't remember enough to get into a well thought out argument on the matter. To sit and post something like Sabre has is a bit much, though. I mean, Sabre, you act like you were at the game? You get your coverage off TV...

I have a lot  to read in this thread, but first things first.

yes it was aimed to you, and yes I saw the game in TV. But I count my live games of a top league (spanish) by houndreds, and my criticism was aimed to those who are too harsh with some players without actually knowing well the game

That said, don't take it too personally, I don't recall a pattern of bad posts in you, I was a bit angry  because I felt that Alonso was being unfairly criticised, and the previous posts stated that we had some sort of red tinted glasses with Alonso, and since I  *try* to be impartial I overreacted a bit.

That's why I answered that way, but it was unfair, because I can't say your posts are bad at all so far.

Sorry for that mate, honestly. I'd just PM you to do this, but I wanted the others saw I was wrong saying that aswell.

I don't want to fire up any arguments, but it was a disgracefully arrogant and patronising post, and the apology unfortunately wasnt much better. 

duk wrote:Pennant was discarded by Wenger doesn't mean he's not good enough for us

He had great CB's in front of him at Arsenal thats why he left