Liverpool FC Forum

by **ken_job** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:19 pm

sh@te example though...and 'whylongball' seems to be keen so wasnt neccessarily directed at you

by **dawson99** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:27 pm

ok, my turn:

get out:

fowler - too old, wont play (love the guy but he has to go)
zenden - needs explaining?
Crouch - Sorry, i just think newcastle will offer silly money for him
Dudek - He wants to go, and we dont really want him

maybes:
gonzales - i wouldnt sell myself
pennant - wouldnt sell myself
Garcia/Alonso - just a feeling one may leave

Who id get:

Etoo - over Villa 8 days a week
Joaquin

by **Stu.Murph** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:30 pm

dawson99 wrote:ok, my turn:

get out:

fowler - too old, wont play (love the guy but he has to go)
zenden - needs explaining?
Crouch - Sorry, i just think newcastle will offer silly money for him
Dudek - He wants to go, and we dont really want him

maybes:
gonzales - i wouldnt sell myself
pennant - wouldnt sell myself
Garcia/Alonso - just a feeling one may leave

Who id get:

Etoo - over Villa 8 days a week
Joaquin

Fowler's too old? He's 32 ya.... pffft.

You then go on by saying Gonzalez would be kept?

Thank christ you aren't the manager.

Mind you looks like Benitez is planning that himself doesn't it... :no

by **dawson99** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:33 pm

Fowler is past it for us, rafa knows it, we all know it. and hes 32 in 4 days.

Id give Gonzales a chance but football nowadays is fast moving.
Youd keep fowler? I bet you still want rush up front, lets get mcateer back... yawn!
time moves on. If fowler was producing in training hed be on the pitch come match time.
Id snap up woodgate if given the chance as well!

by **wrighty (not mark!)** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:36 pm

Fowler.............5 years younger than when Bergkamp called it a day at Arsenal. The mind boggles

by **dawson99** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:39 pm

yeah but rafa wont play him as much, and he wants to go you can tell. i cant believe peoploe are crying over this. there is a reason he doesnt start. injuries? too much money? its not a passion issue. would u rather he sat on abench all season or played football?

by **Stu.Murph** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:41 pm

dawson99 wrote:Fowler is past it for us, rafa knows it, we all know it. and hes 32 in 4 days.

Id give Gonzales a chance but football nowadays is fast moving.
Youd keep fowler? I bet you still want rush up front, lets get mcateer back... yawn!
time moves on. If fowler was producing in training hed be on the pitch come match time.
Id snap up woodgate if given the chance as well!

Yes Dawson I still want McAteer and Rush to be playing in Liverpool's first team... :laugh:

Fowler's a class act and a damn site better than Kuyt who seems undroppable no matter how :censored:

he plays.

You don't lose what Fowler has. He's lost a yard, he's not as mobile as he was and he's not as fit. He's not in the same league as when he came through but alot of his strengths are still there and alot of his quality is still there.

Only the clueless idiots can't see he improved our team when he signed and only the clueless idiots can't see how pathetic we've looked at times upfront without him playing this season.

Rafa doesn't play Robbie due him not offering a big physical pressence or great deal or pace or work rate.

He's not playing one of his best footballers due to picking the wrong system. Simple as that. You should always have you're best players on the pitch. Robbie is one of our best players.

by **wrighty (not mark!)** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:41 pm

dawson99 wrote:yeah but rafa wont play him as much, and he wants to go you can tell. i cant believe peoploe are crying over this. there is a reason he doesnt start. injuries? too much money? its not a passion issue. would u rather he sat on abench all season or played football?

It seems to me that he surely needs to play more. Look at his record for this season. He's still prolific. Given the right service he can still cause damage. I'm really surprised that he hasn't been used more. Would allow for Kuyt to have a rest.

by **Stu.Murph** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:43 pm

The point is he should bloody be playing. This is just getting stupid.

He's one of the main reason this team had a great finish to last season. His goals, intelligence and quality. If you can't see that then am wasting me time talking to you....

Mind you after some of the comments you've made over the years... :no

@ Dawson not Wrighty

by **dawson99** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:45 pm

Stu.Murph wrote:
dawson99 wrote:Fowler is past it for us, rafa knows it, we all know it. and hes 32 in 4 days.

Id give Gonzales a chance but football nowadays is fast moving.
Youd keep fowler? I bet you still want rush up front, lets get mcateer back... yawn!
time moves on. If fowler was producing in training hed be on the pitch come match time.
Id snap up woodgate if given the chance as well!

Yes Dawson I still want McAteer and Rush to be playing in Liverpool's first team...

Fowler's a class act and a damn site better than Kuyt who seems undroppable no matter how he plays.

You don't lose what Fowler has. He's lost a yard, he's not as mobile as he was and he's not as fit. He's not in the same league as when he came through but alot of his strengths are still there and alot of his quality is still there.

Only the clueless idiots can't see he improved our team when he signed and only the clueless idiots can't see how pathetic we've looked at times upfront without him playing this season.

Rafa doesn't play Robbie due him not offering a big physical pressence or great deal or pace or work rate.

He's not playing one of his best footballers due to picking the wrong system. Simple as that. You should always have you're best players on the pitch. Robbie is one of our best players.

so im a clueless idiot? more insults dude?

all im saying is that no matter how good fowler is (and yes, i do love the guy) why is it that crouch bellamy and kuyt play ahead of him?

Kuyt you continuallly slag off but he has improved our team so much.

You seem to live in a world where fowler can do no wrong but you have to realise that rafa sees him train more than you (yes, he does, he might even know more than you!!!!) and only a complete loser would suggest to know more than rafa.

qote: Rafa doesn't play Robbie due him not offering a big physical pressence or great deal or pace or work rate.

so he has no presence, no work rate, no pace... that kinda means quite a bit in 21st century football. you;ve argued my point brilliantly.

cheers

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:55 pm

Lets get rid of Kewell because he injury prone, and sign Woodgate ?

Out

Dudek
Zenden
Bellamy
Garcia (maybe 12 months time)
Pennant

Hopefully staying for one more season

Fowler
Hyypia

In

Kaka (I wish

)
Alves
left winger (no idea who)

by **Ace Ventura** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:16 pm

dawson99 wrote:all im saying is that no matter how good fowler is (and yes, i do love the guy) why is it that crouch bellamy and kuyt play ahead of him?

Because they are players that do more for the team than score goals, all three run all day long and all have there qualities.
Rafa seems to like his strikers to offer more than an attacking threat, he wants them to defend and drop deep or pull out wide, Robbie cant do that at this stage of his career-and nor should he.
BUT stick him in the final third and put the ball into him and watch a true footballer at work, not only is he an out and out predator, he is also the most intelligent footballer we have, and spots things that the other strikers wouldnt if it was drawn on a picture and handed to them.
The fact that Robbie has hardly played this season, after making such a major impact last season is shocking, the lads been shafted-and the only people who are suffering are us.
We would be far better off, if he had played more.

Rafa is a stubborn manager, sometimes thats great, but he has this one well wrong imo.

by **Sabre** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:08 pm

Only the clueless idiots can't see he improved our team when he signed and only the clueless idiots can't see how pathetic we've looked at times upfront without him playing this season.

Rafa doesn't play Robbie due him not offering a big physical pressence or great deal or pace or work rate.

He's not playing one of his best footballers due to picking the wrong system. Simple as that. You should always have you're best players on the pitch. Robbie is one of our best players.

Due to picking the wrong system, for Fowler you mean. And for that matter Crouch, or Morientes. Right or Wrong is very relative. It's obvious that Rafa has a Spanish book of training. If he plays 2 strikers he'll make them work a lot, and he'll keep them out of the box often. Morientes would also have enjoyed a game of a team playing for him like Crouch enjoyed the other day.

Playing with two strikers the chances of seeing a goal poacher are less with Rafa. I like Fowler, but quite simply doesn't fit too much in Rafa's plans. But anyway I think he should have played more minutes to be honest.

by **Bad Bob** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:16 pm

Ace Ventura wrote:BUT stick him in the final third and put the ball into him and watch a true footballer at work, not only is he an out and out predator, he is also the most intelligent footballer we have

Spot on. Some people are quick to write him off despite the still impressive goals to minutes ratio he has this season. More frustratingly, others are prepared to downplay or ignore the contributions he made last year when we would not have had the points tally we had without his crucial goals. Were Rafa prepared to (or had the wingers to) play a system that generated consistent service into the box from the flanks, Robbie would still be a massive asset for us.

and spots things that the other strikers wouldnt if it was drawn on a picture and handed to them.

Interestingly, I would have totally agreed with the second part of your statement until watching Crouchy's performance against Arsenal. Those were three clinical finishes in the box from the big man--three finishes that Robbie himself would have been proud of. Now, I'm not saying that Crouch is as predatory as Robbie in his pomp. Nor am I saying that Robbie's surplus to requirements since we have Crouch. What I am saying is that I didn't expect Crouch to have that kind of finishing in his locker and its a relief to know that, if Robbie's not playing, at least one of our other strikers has the ability to put those kinds of chances away (at least some of the time).

by **bigmick** » Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:25 pm

Whether or not Fowler retains some, most, all or none of his ability is acedemic in my opinion. The simple fact is that the manager isn't going to play him unless forced and therefore he has to go. To compare him to Bergkamp as one poster earlier did is with the greatest respect like comparing chalk and cheese. Bergkamp has probably never had a sip of beer in his life, never mind abused his body int he same way that Robbie has. Nor has he had to suffer the same crippling injuries as the wee man.

No, Robbie will move on at the end of the season. I'm glad he came back though because he showed in flashes just what a fantastic player he still is. Unfortunately, these days you get flickers of magic as opposed to flashing light, neon sign, siren screaming obvious World-class talent. It matters not. Those younger fans who know the game will have seen enough in his cameo appearances of the last two seasons to appreciate just what a superb player he was in his heyday. Robbie Fowler owes the fans nothing at all and he will remain in the legends section of the memories forever.

As for Kuyt, I'm a little surprised that some knowledgeable posters are sharpening the knives so early. I haven't seen a lot of football over the last couple of months but I saw enough at the start of the season to convince me that he is a good player. I posted then that he had it within him to become a legend at Liverpool and I literally, have not seen anything to change my mind. He will be a top player.

One last point. I've noticed one or two posters commenting on Crouch's two headed goals in the last two games and alluding to the theory that he has been doing stregthening exercises. I don't buy into this opinion at all. For me the oproblem with Crouch as a header has always been that he fills the spaces too early. He tends to get into the heading zone a fraction of a second early which means he has to head either from a standing jump, or worse from a slightly backwrds jump. It's probably a legacy of his lower league career whereby the simple fact that he was tall meant he could be successfull, despite poor technique.

Both of the goals in the last two games have been fine headers and have been the result of him not filling the space quite so early. He's waited just that fraction of a second and then stepped into the jump giving the header much more snap.

It's a bit like trying to hit a punchbag from two feet away with your feet side by side. You can bet your life if you go back a pace and then walk into it, one foot in front of the other before letting rip you'll take the thing off its mounting. Theres a really big difference.

Funnily enough Fowler does this skill absolutely brilliantly still, (probably because he's short and therefore has to have brilliant technique to succeed). If he could teach the big fella that before he goes, he would improve Crouch immeasureably as a footballer.

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