Liverpool FC Forum

by **Sabre** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 3:44 pm

I agree with you there way to many squad players only about 6 of are squad could even think about geeting in the Mancs or Chelskis team. We need to sell as many as we can now while we have the money to replace them with top quality players.

Other clubs in the world followed that policy of "I have fresh money, let's buy top class players" before, Real Madrid and their 4 years without winning silverware Galacticos era is a good example, or Chelsea and their I'll waste ridiculous amounts of money for just good players and not winning the CL era.

We can't do the same mistake. And I don't think Rafa will do it, I'm sure he'll buy now what he wants at the moment he wants (or at least it will be easier for him), but I don't see him getting rid of a lot of players this summer, IMHO.

by **club_Levis** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 3:56 pm

Sabre wrote:
I agree with you there way to many squad players only about 6 of are squad could even think about geeting in the Mancs or Chelskis team. We need to sell as many as we can now while we have the money to replace them with top quality players.

Other clubs in the world followed that policy of "I have fresh money, let's buy top class players" before, Real Madrid and their 4 years without winning silverware Galacticos era is a good example, or Chelsea and their I'll waste ridiculous amounts of money for just good players and not winning the CL era.

We can't do the same mistake. And I don't think Rafa will do it, I'm sure he'll buy now what he wants at the moment he wants (or at least it will be easier for him), but I don't see him getting rid of a lot of players this summer, IMHO.

Thats why it will take us a long time to win the EPL Sabre resigning ourselves to squad players. Winning in Europe is sweet but the EPL is more of a challenge & task. It is the one left that we really needs. For that you need quality players not freebies like Veronin etal.Good players like Villa, Quaresma, Alves costs money and an ambitious team should join the race. Yes you need a balance unlike galaticos & Leeds. It should be managed and thats why Rafa is paid a lot of money.

by **grayghost** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 4:06 pm

Sabre wrote:
I agree with you there way to many squad players only about 6 of are squad could even think about geeting in the Mancs or Chelskis team. We need to sell as many as we can now while we have the money to replace them with top quality players.

Other clubs in the world followed that policy of "I have fresh money, let's buy top class players" before, Real Madrid and their 4 years without winning silverware Galacticos era is a good example, or Chelsea and their I'll waste ridiculous amounts of money for just good players and not winning the CL era.

We can't do the same mistake. And I don't think Rafa will do it, I'm sure he'll buy now what he wants at the moment he wants (or at least it will be easier for him), but I don't see him getting rid of a lot of players this summer, IMHO.

I agree with some things you say rafa just wont buy anyone. Who ever he buys they will proberly be analised with a fine pen but i belive they will defo be some players shown the door come the transfer window say
Dudek
Zenden
Crouch
Belamy
Garcia
Pennant
You may not agree with some of them but i belive are team would not miss them and could be replaced with beter players

by **grayghost** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 4:14 pm

Look at the mancs sabre they spent big and are playing some great football
Rooney=25mil
carrick=18mil
ronaldo=16mil
they paid big bucks for thease players with outher additions who did't come cheap aswell
saha
evra
vidic
and it is starting to pay off for them.

by **wrighty (not mark!)** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:58 pm

With Dudek and zenden i agree, but it really gets on my nerves when people say we should get rid of crouch. He was on a prolific streak unlike the preferred pairing until Benitez decided to drop him. His touch, technique and general ability makes him such a threat to the opposition. he also tends to draw other players towards him due to his height as well allowing for space for the strike partner to get a chance on goal. Getting rid of crouch? Big mistake.

Garcia? His flair and vision can unlock the tightest of defences and we dont have any other player like him. Doesn't surprise me that we are struggling in the final 3rd at times without him.

Pennant and bellamy? FFS, it's their first season, give them a chance! You compare those manc players. There is only one who is in their first season at the club. So essentially you have made a valid point that players who don't do particularly well in their first season eg, Vidic, Evra, saha. Can benefit the team immensley if given the chance to settle.

by **club_Levis** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:19 am

No one is saying Crouch is a useless player but he cannot lead the strikeforce of any title aspiring team in the EPL because of his ability/inability, selling him to fund better strikers like Eto'o, Villa, Berbatov etc would be a move forward. He is a squad player, Kuyt is becoming one as well and that explains our position on the log.

by **wrighty (not mark!)** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:51 am

But imagine someone of Eto'os/Villas quality playing off Crouch's knock downs. They would definately benefit from the space that Crouch creates around the box.It's no surprise that someone as mediocre quality as Baros performs so well alongside Jan Koller for the czechs.

by **club_Levis** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 10:11 am

wrighty (not mark!) wrote:But imagine someone of Eto'os/Villas quality playing off Crouch's knock downs. They would definately benefit from the space that Crouch creates around the box.It's no surprise that someone as mediocre quality as Baros performs so well alongside Jan Koller for the czechs.

....and probably Lyon excelled due to Carew's knockdowns, the problem is you are talking about players who in addition to being good on the deck are quicker, stronger and good in the air. Crouch is terrible in the air making us to benefit less from his rare knockdowns.

by **grayghost** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:12 pm

club_Levis wrote:
wrighty (not mark!) wrote:But imagine someone of Eto'os/Villas quality playing off Crouch's knock downs. They would definately benefit from the space that Crouch creates around the box.It's no surprise that someone as mediocre quality as Baros performs so well alongside Jan Koller for the czechs.

....and probably Lyon excelled due to Carew's knockdowns, the problem is you are talking about players who in addition to being good on the deck are quicker, stronger and good in the air. Crouch is terrible in the air making us to benefit less from his rare knockdowns.

But crouch should and should have always have been plan B or even C sell him while he is popular and we may even see a return.

by **club_Levis** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:51 pm

Spot on. The sad thing is I dont see us recuping as much as we paid for him. All teams that were said to interested in him denied that. So maybe he could be the plan C.

by **grayghost** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:55 pm

If we can't sell him then use deal for an outher deal for some one who can make a diffrence in our team

by **Bad Bob** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:38 pm

We'd easily make a tidy profit on Crouch if we were to sell him tomorrow. He's raised his stock since playing for us and there would be plenty of teams that would be more than happy to have him lead their line. He still has a lot of potential use for us, though, so I'm not keen to discard him just yet.

by **Sabre** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:48 pm

He's raised his stock since playing for us and there would be plenty of teams that would be more than happy to have him lead their line

Opinions are opinions. The market is the market, and no player rises his stock if he's not valued outside the club -- Cisse anyone? . As you have said he has raised his stock. He's valued here for instance, he wouldn't have a place in Real Madrid because he's not the eau d' cologne selling guy, but could perfectly be wanted by many important Spanish clubs.

Crouch might not be world class, but he provides things to the team that no one else provides and are difficult to find in the market. A player as tall as him is making an impact in Spain, his name is Zigic. Should Crouch would be available to sell, and you'd have Sevilla and Atletico Madrid (with their super Torres) knocking on our LFC door.

The market doesn't lie. If a player increases his value is because something, they can boo in other grounds whatever they want, they can write whatever cráp they feel like writting about him, but the value of a player is an objective indicator about the validness of a player.

Hell, let's value more our players, FFS. Improve? yes, signing ups? yes, but think of getting rid of the weak links first, rather than the players who're valuable!

by **stmichael** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:00 pm

just going back to sissoko, loyalists will always say "well he's only young". well as much as i hate to say it, i agree with stu the red on this issue. you've either got it or you haven't and as much as i hate to say it, sissoko's technical abilities just aren't up to scratch.

a mate of mine made the point "do you think carragher was as good at 22 as he is now?"

now the answer is obviously no but i would submit that carra's biggest improvements are in his tactical nous, positioning, etc. NOT technical skills. please note...i am NOT saying players can't improve technically AT ALL, of course they can, but MOMO has a long way to go to be a competent ball player and i just don't see it happening.

maybe i am wrong about momo, and i hope i am as i like his overall commitment....but i just think back to my youth...i was not much of a footballer but i could trap the ball and pass it to a pretty good level as a teenager...i can't imagine how you get to be a pro at all without those skills...i just think that at 22 if you can't do that stuff it is too late to learn it, especially at the very highest level.

by **club_Levis** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 2:10 pm

stmichael wrote:just going back to sissoko, loyalists will always say "well he's only young". well as much as i hate to say it, i agree with stu the red on this issue. you've either got it or you haven't and as much as i hate to say it, sissoko's technical abilities just aren't up to scratch.

a mate of mine made the point "do you think carragher was as good at 22 as he is now?"

now the answer is obviously no but i would submit that carra's biggest improvements are in his tactical nous, positioning, etc. NOT technical skills. please note...i am NOT saying players can't improve technically AT ALL, of course they can, but MOMO has a long way to go to be a competent ball player and i just don't see it happening.

maybe i am wrong about momo, and i hope i am as i like his overall commitment....but i just think back to my youth...i was not much of a footballer but i could trap the ball and pass it to a pretty good level as a teenager...i can't imagine how you get to be a pro at all without those skills...i just think that at 22 if you can't do that stuff it is too late to learn it, especially at the very highest level.

Thats why I am always worried when fellows feel hardworking players ala Kuyt, Momo and Crouch shouldnt be criticised.Hardworking alone shouldnt quarantee a player a place in the team. The end result for a striker should be to score goals & for a CDM like momo should be to close down opponents win possesion and pass correctly the ball to a teammate correctly.With a touch of a baby elephant that Momo has it is unlikely that he will be world class. I like his commitment though.

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