Liverpool FC Forum

by **peterc1992** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 12:39 am

Liverpool4Life wrote:Rafa isnt that bad. But he's not that good either. So maybe its time for him to go. I dont know.

u serious,hes not good???

the best tactical manager in the league

by **red37** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 12:52 am

Effes wrote:Lawrenson is a cunt - even worse after yesterday.

Liverpool great he may well have been...though you would not believe that to be the case, listening to him.

I had the picture of him in my minds eye during the outstanding 6 minutes protest, sniffing and shrugging his shoulders in his 'gay' manner, with a face like a slapped ar5e in an abbattoir - the cnut! I take no hesitancy in offering my opinion of Mark Lawrenson as being of the lowest, direst value...even accounting for his decorations. This is what i meant prior to the game of growing some bollox and making 'some' effort towards commenting both honestly and favourably for the worthy cause of this mighty clubs name that made him what he is today...Even Motson, to his credit initiated the conversation. Lawrenson, disgracefully declined. Im afraid he fell sadly short on that score. As, im dismayed to say i expected he might do, given the chance to add something positive about Liverpool Football Club. Thats right, you snake - the place where its people idolised you and all the rest of 'em.....The balance was never going to be redressed in one sitting...Hell 17 years on, it still has a long way to go; but YOU as a human being, therefore in possession of a conscience and DESPITE the impartial voice you may well be employed to advocate, had a fantastically simple opportunity to add your weight behind the campaign and at least acknowledge its fight. You did nothing of the sort....Shame on you. In my estimation, you are nothing to LFC from this day forward. Because had you of been, you could have substantiated the myth that Liverpool FC makes men out of boys....quite clearly, and in your case it didnt work.

by **destro** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:18 am

Spartakus wrote:3-1!!! How sweet was that? Almost as sweet as May 1989. Every time we come to Anfield and shut the Kop up is simply brilliant. Can't wait to humiliate Poo again on tuesday!

It always makes me laugh how other teams "fans" feel the need to post on here after they beat us.How sweet was that, almost as sweet as May 1989 ? you are comparing knocking us out of the F.A cup in the 3rd round to winning a league title !!. Not once have i ever even visited nevermind took the time to register a name ( guest post to difficult was it ? ) on another teams forum. The better team on the day won, no question ( regardless of all the "he should of played ,he shouldnt posters ). Accept the win gracefully and celebrate with your own fans on your own forum. Show a bit of class

by **heimdall** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:32 am

peterc1992 wrote:
Liverpool4Life wrote:Rafa isnt that bad. But he's not that good either. So maybe its time for him to go. I dont know.

u serious,hes not good???

the best tactical manager in the league

What the f are you basing that on, do you seriously think he is better than Ferguson,Wenger and Mourinio. If you do I'd like to know what you are basing this on. It seems to me that Rafa has no ability in adapting within a game, if everything goes to his original plan then great otherwise we are screwed, this is why we so seldom come back to win a game if the opposition score first.
Look don't get me wrong he's not an awful manager just not good enough to get us the league and that is all I care about, sure winning some cups is nice but it is the very least we can expect, it is the league we should be aiming for and I really can't see Rafa getting it for us.
My other problem is that I never feel excited or confident when the Reds play these days. Compare our play to Chelsea, ManU or Arsenal and honestly tell me we play more attractive and/or better tactical football.
Bottom line I love this club and I want the league as do DIC and hopefully they will see that that isn't going to happen without a major overhaul, maybe Rafa just needs a kick up the :censored:

himself but more probably we need someone who understands the English game better.

by **destro** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 2:07 am

heimdall wrote:
peterc1992 wrote:
Liverpool4Life wrote:Rafa isnt that bad. But he's not that good either. So maybe its time for him to go. I dont know.

u serious,hes not good???

the best tactical manager in the league

What the f are you basing that on, do you seriously think he is better than Ferguson,Wenger and Mourinio. If you do I'd like to know what you are basing this on. It seems to me that Rafa has no ability in adapting within a game, if everything goes to his original plan then great otherwise we are screwed, this is why we so seldom come back to win a game if the opposition score first.
Look don't get me wrong he's not an awful manager just not good enough to get us the league and that is all I care about, sure winning some cups is nice but it is the very least we can expect, it is the league we should be aiming for and I really can't see Rafa getting it for us.
My other problem is that I never feel excited or confident when the Reds play these days. Compare our play to Chelsea, ManU or Arsenal and honestly tell me we play more attractive and/or better tactical football.
Bottom line I love this club and I want the league as do DIC and hopefully they will see that that isn't going to happen without a major overhaul, maybe Rafa just needs a kick up the himself but more probably we need someone who understands the English game better.

So the tactical change at half time in the champions league with didi was luck ? as was winning it. how long did it take fergie ? And the league, it was 1992 by the time he won it, where was his tactical genius in the previous 7 years ? And without the money maureen would still be without a trophy at chelsea.Yes he may of won the league and cup with porto but its hardly like...oooh i dont know breaking the stranglehold of barca and real in spain is it ( more luck ).

Do better tactical managers tell their players to fall over at the slightest touch is that what seperates them from the rest of the managers ?

So he played dudek and crouch instead of reina and bellamy...get over it, that doesnt make him any less of a manager than fergie or maureen. Had we won against arsenal would he be a tactical genius.

Dont get me wrong ferguson is a great manager, but tactically better than rafa why ? beacause his team can come from a goal down ? That has just as much to do with a winning mentality within the players and being able to call on better players than we currently have on the bench. It doesnt make him tactically more astute to say " its not working with fletcher get giggs on or ronaldo ".

We all want to see LIVERPOOL win the league and i have no doubt that rafa is the man to lead us to it. Hopefully when the takeover is complete he will be able to improve the current squad and have the luxury of match winners on the bench aswell as on the pitch, i cant see him going silly and paying over the odds like chelsea do but he wont have to settle for second choice players or stop gaps

by **A.B.** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:52 am

heimdall wrote:
peterc1992 wrote:
Liverpool4Life wrote:Rafa isnt that bad. But he's not that good either. So maybe its time for him to go. I dont know.

u serious,hes not good???

the best tactical manager in the league

What the f are you basing that on, do you seriously think he is better than Ferguson,Wenger and Mourinio. If you do I'd like to know what you are basing this on. It seems to me that Rafa has no ability in adapting within a game, if everything goes to his original plan then great otherwise we are screwed, this is why we so seldom come back to win a game if the opposition score first.
Look don't get me wrong he's not an awful manager just not good enough to get us the league and that is all I care about, sure winning some cups is nice but it is the very least we can expect, it is the league we should be aiming for and I really can't see Rafa getting it for us.
My other problem is that I never feel excited or confident when the Reds play these days. Compare our play to Chelsea, ManU or Arsenal and honestly tell me we play more attractive and/or better tactical football.
Bottom line I love this club and I want the league as do DIC and hopefully they will see that that isn't going to happen without a major overhaul, maybe Rafa just needs a kick up the himself but more probably we need someone who understands the English game better.

2 La Liga Titles
1 UEFA Champions League Cup
1 UEFA Cup
1 FA Cup
1 Community Shield
1 UEFA Super Cup

He doesn't understand the English game? :laugh:

How does someone who doesn't understand the English game lead a team to finish with 82 points which is the highest point total we've had in the last 17 years.

Go read the text in my graphic, I'll give you a hint it starts with ''Shut the ......''

:laugh:

by **crazyhorse** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 4:06 am

Well Red wrote:After watching the 'Pool be dumped out of the FA Cup at the first hurdle I don't want to pick anyone to blame, simply because we were shown up by a team which I have to say (however much it pains me to admit it) are about 3 years ahead of us at the moment in how they play their football. Arsenal were fast and clinical, and their positioning and awareness when counter attacking our goal was scary to watch.

Everytime they tore away gaping holes suddenly appeared in our defence and you got the feeling, as Henry and Van Persie and Gilberto suddenly appeared in our box out of nowhere, that they were going to score. I may well just speak for myself here, but everytime we got into the Arsenal half I just didn't get the feeling we were going to have a shot on goal, let alone score.

Peter Crouch wasn't fast enough to cause the Arsenal defenders any problems at all and I'm getting sick of his lack of an aerial threat. Everytime we get into an attacking position the ball is knocked out wide for one of the wide men to cross in and they're all aimed for Crouchie who, let's face it, is one of our worst headerers of the ball. If Garcia had his height and got his service, we'd have won against Arsenal and against Blackburn, and more convincingly against Spurs. I'm sure of it.

Predictable crosses and long balls up to Crouch just are not working and don't suit Liverpool's style of play. There's such an air of hit and hope about every ball we float into the box. Arsenal in contrast whip the ball in from all angles, pinging fast, low crosses right into the heart of penalty areas. The huge gulf between the teams can be summed up thus: we build up an attack for 20 minutes without a shot on target, then they break away with 3 quick passes and suddenly Henry's through one on one with our keeper and its 1-0. At the moment Newcastle's £15million valuation of Peter Crouch looks like a really tempting one to accept.

I could go on but my heart breaks as I write this. We will never win the league playing the way we do until we change our tactics so that we can break teams down. If we can't adapt to the fast paced quick passing game which the likes of Arsenal play then we need a player like Ronaldo (much as I loathe him) or Rooney who is actually going to run at defenders and test them. We had far too many players lurking around outside Arsenals area some 25 yards out content to just pass the buck (pardon me, 'ball') to each other in the hope that Arsenal would fall out of position - which clearly wasn't going to happen.

Finally, there has to be a fall guy. Dudek has to go, simple as that. He's not good enough for a team like Liverpool - I know he's considered a legend because of what he did against AC Milan and the wonder double-save he pulled off, however he's cost us the game tonight. He had 4 saves to make all game and let three goals in - the last two of which he should definately have saved. Rosicky's second bobbled past him and Henry's scuffed shot just rolled calmly under him á-la-Westerveld. The only save he did make was a parry from a weak Van Persie shot which he turned round the post, unnecessarily giving a corner away after a long spell of Liverpool possession. It is time to move on, Instanbul was two years ago...

I conclude by stressing that this should not be taken as an attack on Rafa. The guy's a genius, and of course knows far more about the working of football than possibly this whole forum community put together. I have faith he'll turn things around - but in order to do so it's painfully clear that a change in tactics is going to be necessary. That, and some very careful attacking signings.

Intelligent, informed and constructive comments.

I agree with most if not all of what you are saying here.. :bowdown

by **The Manhattan Project** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 6:46 am

3-1!!! How sweet was that? Almost as sweet as May 1989. Every time we come to Anfield and shut the Kop up is simply brilliant. Can't wait to humiliate Poo again on tuesday!

It's just a shame your club can't win even one European Cup.

I mean, just ONE.

Even Aston Villa could manage that.

by **Lando_Griffin** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 6:56 am

The Manhattan Project wrote:
3-1!!! How sweet was that? Almost as sweet as May 1989. Every time we come to Anfield and shut the Kop up is simply brilliant. Can't wait to humiliate Poo again on tuesday!

It's just a shame your club can't win even one European Cup.

I mean, just ONE.

Even Aston Villa could manage that.

Notts Forest managed TWO!!!!!

And they're funking sh*te!

by **The Manhattan Project** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 7:08 am

Well, if you look back at those two Forest wins, you'll notice they were wearing all red, instead of their usual "red shirts, white shorts, red socks" combo.

Now, under Manhattan's logic, this means that they were actually Liverpool Football Club when they played those games.

Therefore we are now seven-time European Cup winners.

by **Liverpool4Life** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:03 am

I agree with him:D

by **puroresu** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:59 am

I think there is no genuine pace in the side. You look at the team on Saturday and ask how much pace was in that side?

Carragher, Agger, Riise, Finnan are all good players but neither have extreme pace. Gerrard, Alonso, Pennant, Garcia. Again some very talented players in that midfield but other than pennant no real pace in that midfield. Crouch and Kuyt. No pace at all. Now even if you add Gonzalez and Bellamy to that list we still dont have pace all over the side.

I would like to see 2 very quick full backs on the side. full backs which are more or less wingers as thats what the modern game requires now. If your not going to have pace at CB you need pace at Full back.

by **Effes** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 10:22 am

A.B. wrote:
heimdall wrote:
peterc1992 wrote:
Liverpool4Life wrote:Rafa isnt that bad. But he's not that good either. So maybe its time for him to go. I dont know.

u serious,hes not good???

the best tactical manager in the league

What the f are you basing that on, do you seriously think he is better than Ferguson,Wenger and Mourinio. If you do I'd like to know what you are basing this on. It seems to me that Rafa has no ability in adapting within a game, if everything goes to his original plan then great otherwise we are screwed, this is why we so seldom come back to win a game if the opposition score first.
Look don't get me wrong he's not an awful manager just not good enough to get us the league and that is all I care about, sure winning some cups is nice but it is the very least we can expect, it is the league we should be aiming for and I really can't see Rafa getting it for us.
My other problem is that I never feel excited or confident when the Reds play these days. Compare our play to Chelsea, ManU or Arsenal and honestly tell me we play more attractive and/or better tactical football.
Bottom line I love this club and I want the league as do DIC and hopefully they will see that that isn't going to happen without a major overhaul, maybe Rafa just needs a kick up the himself but more probably we need someone who understands the English game better.

2 La Liga Titles
1 UEFA Champions League Cup
1 UEFA Cup
1 FA Cup
1 Community Shield
1 UEFA Super Cup

He doesn't understand the English game? How does someone who doesn't understand the English game lead a team to finish with 82 points which is the highest point total we've had in the last 17 years.

Go read the text in my graphic, I'll give you a hint it starts with ''Shut the ......''

Just my two-pennieth worth:

I would tend to agree (in a way) that maybe Rafa doesn't understand the English mentality ?

i.e. Play your best team (including goalie!) when you are defending the FA Cup at home to one of your oldest rivals Ars.enal.

The Cup in Spain is as coveted as much as the FA Cup in England.

I though he learnt after Burnley - and fair play to him he DID get us the cup last year.

We cant complain can we? Euro then FA Cup - both 3-3?
We are spoilt sometimes.

by **puroresu** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 10:57 am

One thing about Rafa is he never really gambles. He never really changes things when we are behind to 3 up fron for instance. Usually his subs are like for like.

I agree we dont play in a expansive way like Arsenal for instance but i dont think we really have the players to do so. That sort of game where players interchange positions requires pace all over the side and we dont have that.

by **Big Niall** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:52 am

I don't think Rafa is one of the best tactical managers around as stated above, I don't even think he knows who his best 11 is which is a disgrace after 3 years. Dudek was terrible.

We have only beaten Arsenal twice in 18 games, FACT.
We have LOST every game this season against Manu,Chelsea,Arsenal FACT.

The above shows we are nowhere near good enough to win the league. WE have at least 6 players who are not good enough to win a league and all we seem to have creativity wise is long balls. Watch Arsenal week in/week out and you will see the football they play is so much better.

Feeling really down as I don't think we have progressed at all this season.

Liverpool FC Forum

Some painful home truths after arsenal - Istanbul was 2 years ago...

Who is online