Liverpool FC Forum

by **Dundalk** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 2:57 am

Why isnt he playing from the start of every game, what has the guy to do?

Okay he is tall and lanky and he isnt everyones cup of tea but when he plays he scores GOALS which is what we have a real problem with at the moment.

He needs a good run in the team and let Kuyt amd Craig fight it out to partner him, he can do it for England and he can do it for us....

Give him a run, he is different and causes everyone trouble

Your thoughts please...

by **Lando_Griffin** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:02 am

Dundalk wrote:Why isnt he playing from the start of every game, what has the guy to do?

Okay he is tall and lanky and he isnt everyones cup of tea but when he plays he scores GOALS which is what we have a real problem with at the moment.

He needs a good run in the team and let Kuyt amd Craig fight it out to partner him, he can do it for England and he can do it for us....

Give him a run, he is different and causes everyone trouble

Your thoughts please...

I bet he starts on Wednesday.

Rafa tends to play people through their bad form, which is why Bellamy is on so regularly.

He afforded the same thing to Crouch last season.

by **account deleted by request** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:08 am

I was very surprised he didn't get a start against Boro', infact I have been very surprised at how few starts hes had all season. Only reasons I can think of are that maybe Rafa thinks we take the easy way out to much with the long ball when he plays, or that hes got a bit big for his boots, and Rafa's bringing him back down to earth.

To be fair to Bellamy he had a good game for Wales and maybe Rafa was hoping he could take that form into the Boro' game. Having said all that, When we bought Crouch Rafa said it was to help Liverpool in tough away games, so why hes not played much in the league this season is anyones guess really.

by **red37** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:51 am

you dont drop a striker who is both 'on form' and has built up a 'confidence' in the past 12 months, that suggests him to be worthy of inclusion for up to 75-80% of our games. He and Kuyt look to have started to form some kind of effective partnership that may yield results ultimately. and at the moment that is our best pairing. (btw id love to see a Kuyt/Fowler combo though...i reckon Robbies intelligence would be more than compensated by the industry of Kuyt, just an idea) but with Crouch being the focus of our attacking play, id expect him to be selected on merit because of his decent goals ratio at least. For me at the moment anyway, it needs to be Crouch/one of three.

by **Bad Bob** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:57 am

Kuyt's clearly Rafa's number one striker, leaving Crouchy, Bellamy and, to a lesser extent Robbie, battling to partner him. Crouch and Kuyt have formed a decent partnership in the past while but we're still very goal shy and Rafa was clearly hoping that Bellamy's form for Wales would carry over on Saturday and help kick start both the team and his own game.

FWIW, I still think Rafa rates Crouch very highly and is just looking to give Bellamy a chance to gain some confidence and form after a brief injury lay-off.

by **66-1112520797** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 6:39 am

I'd agree with Crouch and Kuyt starting as the number one forward pairing, I feel sorry for Peter a bit (not just because he's ugly & skinny

), but because the guy was in pretty much in hot form for us a while back and it seemed as though Rafa rotated him out of form. To me its simple, if Crouch is on form its upto the next striker to step in (Bellamy) and fight for the place, not just be given it. He could use Bellamy as a sub and if he does enough after a few games from the bench then maybe it could warrant a start from Rafa.
Thats my opinion.

by **red37** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 6:46 am

We need to be careful in over labouring the point though. As effective (proven) as he is...it easily becomes 'old' hat for opposing defences and as a result his services can become negated through the simple judicious use of doubling up on him, or the usual-knocking him off balance in the jump... But for the moment, stick with him for me. Where Crouchy seems to have an additional edge, is in his acceptance of this so called 'rotation' malarky, and the positive attitude he maintains throughout. Even when he's been benched, the lad usually comes on and has an impact. Look at satdy- he almost came up with another vital goal. Heres to tomorrow night as well...

by **66-1112520797** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:00 am

We need to be careful in over labouring the point though. As effective (proven) as he is...it easily becomes 'old' hat for opposing defences and as a result his services can become negated through the simple judicious use of doubling up on him, or the usual-knocking him off balance in the jump

Mate thats part and parcel of being a striker and out of all the other fourty who play week in week out in the Prem, each opposing team will have their own idea on how to nulify their opposing strikers, thats nothing new.

by **red37** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:27 am

Bamaga man wrote:
We need to be careful in over labouring the point though. As effective (proven) as he is...it easily becomes 'old' hat for opposing defences and as a result his services can become negated through the simple judicious use of doubling up on him, or the usual-knocking him off balance in the jump

Mate thats part and parcel of being a striker and out of all the other fourty who play week in week out in the Prem, each opposing team will have their own idea on how to nulify their opposing strikers, thats nothing new.

The point im making is, where he does lose possession the space between him and any striker supporting him is so open/exposed and often 'read' in anticipation by the defence that you may as well from the off, give them the ball straightaway... Whether its Kuyt/Bellamy or Fowler as his partner. Crouch is there for one purpose alone:- feed through the supply to a finisher. He does weigh in with his fair share of goals regardless, it has to be said. But to get the best out of Peter Crouch, he needs someone running off his end-product, or latching onto balls from his knock-downs etc... Thats what i meant by saying it becomes 'familiar' territory when he ends up stuck in no-mans land up on his own- lack of pace is the major factor and he easily can become swamped. (the opposite can also happen, where he's come far too deep 'looking' for the ball - he's then too far from goal to have any real effect. Particularly where the full backs arent supporting play). Hence the use of Kuyt for example around his feet can avoid that same thing, providing the opposition with plenty more than the 'same old Crouch' to concern themselves with. Purely due to his lack of pace, he demands an industrious, sharp-witted team mate with which to bounce off. - thats what i was meaning to say mate.

by **66-1112520797** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:47 am

red37 wrote:
Bamaga man wrote:
We need to be careful in over labouring the point though. As effective (proven) as he is...it easily becomes 'old' hat for opposing defences and as a result his services can become negated through the simple judicious use of doubling up on him, or the usual-knocking him off balance in the jump

Mate thats part and parcel of being a striker and out of all the other fourty who play week in week out in the Prem, each opposing team will have their own idea on how to nulify their opposing strikers, thats nothing new.

The point im making is, where he does lose possession the space between him and any striker supporting him is so open/exposed and often 'read' in anticipation by the defence that you may as well from the off, give them the ball straightaway... Whether its Kuyt/Bellamy or Fowler as his partner. Crouch is there for one purpose alone:- feed through the supply to a finisher. He does weigh in with his fair share of goals regardless, it has to be said. But to get the best out of Peter Crouch, he needs someone running off his end-product, or latching onto balls from his knock-downs etc... Thats what i meant by saying it becomes 'familiar' territory when he ends up stuck in no-mans land up on his own- lack of pace is the major factor and he easily can become swamped. (the opposite can also happen, where he's come far too deep 'looking' for the ball - he's then too far from goal to have any real effect. Particularly where the full backs arent supporting play). Hence the use of Kuyt for example around his feet can avoid that same thing, providing the opposition with plenty more than the 'same old Crouch' to concern themselves with. Purely due to his lack of pace, he demands an industrious, sharp-witted team mate with which to bounce off. - thats what i was meaning to say mate.

Agreed Red37.

On another point to Crouch's game which is well known and highlighted, is that for a lanky fella he has extremely good feet. That coupled with the fact he can hold the ball up and draw one or two defenders out of position is ideal for any of his strike partners, to break free and exploit space. Or lay it off to a midfielder joining the attack, he can then head for the box and look to get on the end of something himself. I dont think the players should be looking to use him as an high ball outlet all the time. He's that comfortable with the ball at his feet he should be looking for the ball on the deck 70% of the time.

by **alxy** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:58 am

I just want to know why Rafa waited until the 80th minute to put him on against Boro. I would have thought he be given a chance to change things around at max 60th minute or so. After he came on, we looked more dangerous. I daresay we might have had a breakthrough if he had been on much earlier.

by **mattylfc** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 9:37 am

I was surprised at that too mate.

I do see why he started with Bellamy. As people have allready mentioned, he had a good game for Wales and maybe Rafa was hoping his form would carry into staurdays game. Also Rafa made a point about how dominant Middlesborough's defense would be in the air, meaning that maybe Crouch wouldnt get much joy.

What didnt help is that Middlesborough played much deeper than anticipated and Bellamy had no room to get round the back and was therefore inaffective. Crouch then came on and looked dangerous in the air but it was perhaps a bit too late as you have mentioned.
Maybe he thought that even if we had Crouch in there to win headers, there is no point because Pennant and Gonzo will never pick him out. Both chnaces came from Riises crosses i think.

by **Ola Mr Benitez** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 10:21 am

What was the point in giving Robbie another contract? Does anyone here really beleive he is going to get a fair crack of the whip?

I think we are playing pretty good football at the moment except, and to be fair it is a big except, we can't score any goals.

Who is our best striker?
Who is most likely to score?

I think Bellamy couldn't hit a barn door from 2ft at the moment and its down to confidence. I think Pennant is playing without confidence as well. If I was Rafa I would send them both into the reserves for a couple of games where Craig can get a few goals and Pennant can skin a few right backs... like in the good old days

by **alxy** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 10:28 am

All players go through bad spells. Bellamy is obviously having one right now, but I think it's worth it to have him plugging on until his form comes back. Same for Pennant. He was the only decent player giving us problems when we trashed Birmingham 7-0 last year in the FA Cup. But then, problem is the whole team, not just a few players.

by **jkop** » Tue Nov 21, 2006 10:39 am

I do feel for Peter he was scoring for both club and country and hes on the bench, i understand the strikers need a chance to prove themselves especially away from home which they are not doing. Crouchy was scoring so come on Rafa bring him on.

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