Liverpool FC Forum

by **account deleted by request** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:15 pm

daxy1 wrote:
Effes wrote:This is not racist - but fact.

Why are there not many black Olympic swimmers?

mate there is only room for ERIC THE EEL that man can swim (just) ...

Eric the eel was to swimming, what that English bloke (I forget his name)was to ski- jumping.

by **Pedro O'Maradona** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:24 pm

s@int wrote:
daxy1 wrote:
Effes wrote:This is not racist - but fact.

Why are there not many black Olympic swimmers?

mate there is only room for ERIC THE EEL that man can swim (just) ...

Eric the eel was to swimming, what that English bloke (I forget his name)was to ski- jumping.

Eddy the Eagle Edwards!

by **JBG** » Wed Nov 08, 2006 9:42 pm

Jean Tigana managed in the Premiership.

by **The Ace1983** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:00 am

Racism will unfortunately always exist. There are far too many @rseholes in this world. But I don't believe English football is as bad as many on the continent. Look what the Spanish fans did to Shaun Wright-Phillips, or the Macedonians' taunts at Heskey. That's disgusting and I'm glad it's all but wiped out of our leagues. Overt racism in the English game is thankfully, in the majority, something of the past.

As for a culture of covert racism existing within the clubs themselves, this, imho, seems to be a bit of a conspiracy theory. There are a growing number of asian board members and fans which should encourage younger anglo-asians to take part and I'm sure that eventually we will see a rise in numbers. Remember that it took many years for black players to enter the game en-mass, and even then, managers like Graham Taylor and, ironicly, Ron Atkinson had to actively search them out of the lower leagues. I doubt racism is a factor, though the sterotyped football hooligan probably does go some way to deter fans from different cultures to attend games and take part. And, though a sterotype itself, young asians appear to be far more interested in cricket which is fair enough.

But to end, I'd like to address the idea of human beings having different physical attributes according to their race. This does exist. People of African extraction are known to be more susceptible to blood diseases than others. I'm sure I read somewhere that the reason that there will never be a white 100 metre sprint champion is becuase the tendons in black people's knees are stronger and more developed. There are differences, but the idea that this should make someone unable to participate in a sport or develop into a top class player is ludicrus. Is Sami Hyypia the same sort of player as Craig Bellemy? One is very strong in the upper body, tall, heavy and slow, whereas the other is short, fast and light. Players have their own attributes and if taught correctly, they can all be taught to use their physicallity to their advantage. It wasn't so long ago that oriental players were considered too light and weak to play in the premiership and now we have a small, but growing contingent of players like Park, Nakata, Toda, Sun, Inamoto and more.

Perhaps blame should infact be placed with the immigration policy this country has adopted over the last fifty years. Multiculturalism does not work. If the time had been taken to intergrate people of differnet colours and religions, rather than isolate them, it would not just be football that would see the benefits. Isolation breeds contempt, contempt breeds hatred and this is a path to the darkside (sorry, watching Empire at the mo). When your community is made up of one group of people, you, as a child, can only emulate those around you.

Racism is a problem and we must all keep working to completely remove it from the stands. If this comitment to kicking it out remains, then soon enough, young Asian players will join their European, African and Oriental cousins in playing the beautiful game at a top level.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:07 am

Perhaps blame should infact be placed with the immigration policy this country has adopted over the last fifty years. Multiculturalism does not work. If the time had been taken to intergrate people of differnet colours and religions, rather than isolate them, it would not just be football that would see the benefits. Isolation breeds contempt, contempt breeds hatred and this is a path to the darkside (sorry, watching Empire at the mo). When your community is made up of one group of people, you, as a child, can only emulate those around you.

Great point well put, multiculturalism is a bane on society and does more to isolate people than anything the NF try to do.

by **112-1077774096** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:11 am

i have never read such tripe as some of the comments in this thread,

integration blah blah blah, there are no asian players because of racism blah blah blah, no black managers blah blah blah, to blame this on racism is absurd, by that argument then there would also be no black players at these clubs.

come on guys think before you raise a point.

taff i agree with you about reverse racism, just like the fire brigade have to employ a certain percentage of minority races even if they are not good enough they have to be employed.

when i joined the police in 1988 they even lowered the acceptance score in the entry test for minoriities to give them a chance, this is fact so when people say we dont do enough for minorites that is tripe.

minorities have the same chances we do, its all about taking those chances. come on guys there are enough white wasters out there, is that because of race or by choice.

people have options and its up to them to take them

by **Hebz** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:14 am

there are black managers though, Paul Ince now manages macclesfield (I think thats how you spell it?)... if that helps?

by **67-1161385641** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:23 am

There are less black managers in the game, because there aren't enough coming forward, not because of institutional racism, I think racism is a card often over used. I'm sure there is racism that goes on to all colours of people (including white people) I know it's hard to believe, but it does happen. If no Asian kiddo's are being scouted it's because the ones that look to be scouted simply aren't good enough or the Asian community are not interested in playing football.

You cannot blame everything on racism, it's ridiculous, it's just another example of political correctness gone bonkers.

by **The Ace1983** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:29 am

peewee wrote:i have never read such tripe as some of the comments in this thread,

integration blah blah blah, there are no asian players because of racism blah blah blah, no black managers blah blah blah, to blame this on racism is absurd, by that argument then there would also be no black players at these clubs.

come on guys think before you raise a point.

taff i agree with you about reverse racism, just like the fire brigade have to employ a certain percentage of minority races even if they are not good enough they have to be employed.

when i joined the police in 1988 they even lowered the acceptance score in the entry test for minoriities to give them a chance, this is fact so when people say we dont do enough for minorites that is tripe.

minorities have the same chances we do, its all about taking those chances. come on guys there are enough white wasters out there, is that because of race or by choice.

people have options and its up to them to take them

I see where you're coming from, but I don't quite agree.

By saying "we need x amount of black/asian/women/disabled/over-60s people" people you are instantly identifying them as something different to the young, white, male "normlity". I certainly on't agree with lowering test scores to allow different people into the police or any other emergancy service, but this smacks of the negative effects of multiculturalism. If communities had been intergrated, this sort of thing just would not have happened. People would be people, not defined by anything but their character.

And you're forgeting that because of multiculturalism, people were effectively stuck in ghettos were they were given few oppertunities, subject to racism and race influenced violence, weaker education systems and limited contact to the world outside their isolated community. Even now, our government thinks this is the best policy despite the fact that this isolation is obviously in some part responsible for terrorism, allowing communities to be badgered and harrassed by fanatics who, in these places, go undetected by the regular police authorities.

This wider issue of racism always comes down to multiculturalism.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:47 am

peewee wrote:i have never read such tripe as some of the comments in this thread,

integration blah blah blah, there are no asian players because of racism blah blah blah, no black managers blah blah blah, to blame this on racism is absurd, by that argument then there would also be no black players at these clubs.

come on guys think before you raise a point.

taff i agree with you about reverse racism, just like the fire brigade have to employ a certain percentage of minority races even if they are not good enough they have to be employed.

when i joined the police in 1988 they even lowered the acceptance score in the entry test for minoriities to give them a chance, this is fact so when people say we dont do enough for minorites that is tripe.

minorities have the same chances we do, its all about taking those chances. come on guys there are enough white wasters out there, is that because of race or by choice.

people have options and its up to them to take them

If you think racism doesnt play a part in football I think your sadly mistaken. Thats like saying that the anglo-scots wernt discriminated against in the 60's 70's and 80's by the Scottish selectors because Law and Daglish played lots of times for Scotland.

They were exceptional talents who got the recognition they deserved but are you going to say that Ron Yeats only deserved 3 caps Stjohn 17 or Hansen 23caps?

If you are outstanding in any sport you will of course be accepted just as Tiger Woods was at golf. The problem is not for the extraordinarily talented but for the rest.

Are you saying that no black players from England have ever wanted to, or had the ability to be top managers ? Because so far we have only managed to name 2 and both Gullitt and Tigana played and made their names abroad not in England.

Barnes made his name in England but was a head coach in Scotland.

As for reverse racism this just makes things worse, people should be judged on merit and nothing else. In the USA they call it positive discrimination. I dont see anything positive in discriminating in favour of one person because hes from a minority against another whos not ,except on the grounds of ability.

by **red37** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:07 am

an inspired topic Saint. and one that took a fair degree of balls to open up in truth. and a perfectly reasonable point to it as well. however, my fear is that discussions on this subject can and do only end up going one way in the end...its got to the stage where you dont know what to say at all for fear of treading on someones toes anymore. ill timed jokes and innocent banter that should only be considered as such, no longer hold any merit under its ugly spell....instead, the label of Racism- while distinctly evil in its many forms that manifest their way into day to day life...is, it also has to be said, something of a 'safety net' where the convenience of it is required to seek shade under...

in the 21st century i for one would like to believe that not to be the case however, on a sporting level. though im not as confident as some, in denying its prevalence.

by **Leonmc0708** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:19 am

s@int wrote:When I was young I was often told that the reason black professional footballers were rare, is that they had strong heads but weak legs and couldn't standup to the hard physical tackles. While we all appreciate that that was a load of bull**** now, there are still plenty that believe that black people have mental weaknesses etc even after all these years.

There is a similar excuse used for the almost total lack of Asians in the professional ranks. They are too thin and weak to stand up to the riguers of the game etc. One look at the Pakistani fast bowlers should be enough to convince people that this is a fallacy. So is it just a culture thing, that they dont like or want to play football?

The almost total lack of Black, coloured or asian MANAGERS seems to indicate that racism still plays a part in football. Paul Ince has just become manager of a lower league club , would he have received better offers if he wasnt black?

The only black manager of a top English club I can think of is Gullitt and he was Dutch so it somehow doesnt seem to count . Surely by now after 35 years of black players in the top division we should have more.

Is English football just hiding its inherent racism?

Would he fuc.k as like its his first appointment after doing his badges.

I hate the way people blow racism out of all proportion.

Its not just white people who are racist against non white people FFS !!

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:24 am

Its not just white people who are racist against non white people FFS !!

What the f.uck has that got to do with anything ?

by **112-1077774096** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:28 am

so now saint you are saying there should be a certain percentage of balck managers by law, it seems thats what you are getting at, the only way to make sure there are black manager will be to make a law, but then which clubs will be the ones who employ them?

or maybe a club as a business have the right to choose who they want to work for them, they have the right to choose the most qualified person to lead them, if that person is white then so be it, does that make them racist?

saint is your girlfriend white? if the answer is yes why dont you give an asian girl a chance to go out with you? is it because she chooses not to or are you racist?

im tired of all this rubbish about race being an issue, ace, how many asian, black, chinese doctors and dentists do we have, how many ethnic scientists, how many teachers, how many business owners (both small and large)? the answer is a lot, is it because they were margianalised in their ghettos and therefore didnt get the same chance as all us whites (haha thats a joke, how many white people also live in slums with no prospects, is that because of race). its because the worked for what they have, they respected our life style, they embraced it and they made something of themselves through hard work instead of complaining and having a gimme atttitude.

people mention race now as a byeword and by doing that they miss the bigger issue, that some people are lazy feckers who dont want to work, some people choose their lifestyle, everything to do with minorities is not racial guys, there may be other reasons but the easiest avenue to go down is to scream racism and then try and justify it.

by **112-1077774096** » Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:31 am

s@int wrote:
Its not just white people who are racist against non white people FFS !!

What the f.uck has that got to do with anything ?

i think what he is getting at is that the pakistanis and the indians hate each other, the sikhs hate the pakistanis etc etc etc.

people sometimes forget this and this racism is a white mans disease

Liverpool FC Forum

Racist thoughts?

Who is online