Liverpool FC Forum

by **The Red Baron** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 2:58 pm

Some shops in Liverpool now display signs "NO HATS OR HOODS ". perfectly acceptable its their buisness after all.These same shops wouldnt dare put a sign up saying no veils.

by **112-1077774096** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 3:16 pm

The Red Baron wrote:Some shops in Liverpool now display signs "NO HATS OR HOODS ". perfectly acceptable its their buisness after all.These same shops wouldnt dare put a sign up saying no veils.

mate a few years ago when i was university in preston there was a petrol shortage, one petrol station owned by a muslim actually put up a sign saying 'muslims only'.

nothing was done about it. its things like this which will bring matters to a head, one rule for one group of people and another rule for others.

its a sad state of affairs

in relation to your post baron, last week a muslim woman in preston was asked to remove her veil when she went to the post office for security reasons. i read this in the paper. ask yourself how did the press find out, do you think the post office highlighted it? i am sure it was the woamn who highlighted it. but how many times have you seen a headline stating a man was asked to remove his crash helmet when he enters a post office

by **taff** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 4:17 pm

Peewee the thing is I tend to agree with you.

Travelling is something I recommend for all as you realise we are all humans and some are beautiful and some are complete *****

My issues are not with the idiots representing Islam and in the name of Allah there are some right idiots in that category. My issues are with the politicians.

A few years ago it was taboo to criticise muslims and you were almost accused of racism if you dared say anything, of course this inevitably lead to a backlash and the murmurings of white majority not being at all happy with the way things were. Fast forward to today and it seems to be a very discreet but potent open season on our muslim minority, justified by focusing on the minority within the minority who dominate our papers.

Now this to me is either incompetent leadership from the government or a sly twist to proportion blame. We need strong leadership in uncertain times and we are not having it from either party.

A comparison is that of English fans in the world cup. The majority are decent and law abiding but there is a media ballyhoo surrounding them being a disgrace etc. Now at the same time the press and Govt are up in arms about this they make countless programmes and references to hooliganism. Now the leaders of the fair England fans always complain about lack of positive press and are driven underground to publications that give them attention. The mainstream however condemn hooliganism while giving it huge exposure. At the world cup we saw the emergence of the new chav lads who are not on databases or were subject to banning orders, they have emerged from the ridiculous way the problem has been vilified and portrayed in the press and by the govt.. You can draw parallels here with the muslim thing with their "nutters" hogging the limelight then alienating the majority who's youngsters feeling rejected and villified gradually act the part, the self fullfilling prophecy.

You are educated and experienced peewee and are culturally educated more than most, to me the emergence of tidy boxes to put people in is dangerous and again the horrific minority destroy it fro the majority.

by **66-1120597113** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 4:21 pm

peewee wrote:i think you are wrong on the integration front taff. its the muslims in the UK who choose to live in densly populated muslim areas and then complain that they are not accepted in society.

i am not anti islam, far from it, i am however anti extremist and i am also against people who use their religion, race, gender, political preference and sexuality to influence decisions.

personally i am happy that things are now being highlighted when before people were afraid to speak because of the "sensitivity" of the subject matter and the fear of being labled racist for just voicing an opinion.

at least when everything is out in the open and every thing comes to a head, we will truly find out how much muslims want to intigrate into british society. let us see how many defend the rights and freedom that the UK gives them and how many prefer to still see themselves as alien to british culure.

as you know i live in thailand, i intigrate, nothing is changed to suit me, i never scream racism when there is a problem, we still have whiteboards out here, i dont complain about it. i dont force my opinions on anyone else.

as i have said earlier in this thread, i know a lot of muslims from my time in malaysia, they are great, open people, very friendly and forthcoming. i never encounterd racism against me because i intigrate and live my life within the conventions of the country i live in (of course i dont follow their religious beliefs), living this way gains respect and allows me to be welome in any company.

however the problem in the UK (i must stress here that i am not talking about all muslims, but i am talking about a very high percentage) is that muslims tend to stick together, they live in heavily populated muslim areas, they have conventions that are strange to our freedoms, they choose to speak in a language foreign to the UK. they dont criticise when a problem occurs caused by the muslim coommunity, they just point the finger at others. they dont folow islam as it should be followed, they drink, they smoke, they have sex out of marriage but when you offend one of them they suddenly try to make you believe they are good clean living muslims because this will bolster their argument. this causes problems.

its very true that at the moment things are being highlighted in the press and there are problems, can you seriously say these problems are caused by racism, are people in the UK so stupid that they will cause problems for no reason? i say they are not stupid, they are merely reacting at last and standing up for their own culture instead of being railroaded into a culture they have no knowledge of, or the only knowledge tey have of the culture is to once again pick up the paper or switch on the news to see muslims complaining about something else.

Well said fella!! :nod

by **112-1077774096** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 4:32 pm

taff wrote:Peewee the thing is I tend to agree with you.

Travelling is something I recommend for all as you realise we are all humans and some are beautiful and some are complete *****

My issues are not with the idiots representing Islam and in the name of Allah there are some right idiots in that category. My issues are with the politicians.

A few years ago it was taboo to criticise muslims and you were almost accused of racism if you dared say anything, of course this inevitably lead to a backlash and the murmurings of white majority not being at all happy with the way things were. Fast forward to today and it seems to be a very discreet but potent open season on our muslim minority, justified by focusing on the minority within the minority who dominate our papers.

Now this to me is either incompetent leadership from the government or a sly twist to proportion blame. We need strong leadership in uncertain times and we are not having it from either party.

A comparison is that of English fans in the world cup. The majority are decent and law abiding but there is a media ballyhoo surrounding them being a disgrace etc. Now at the same time the press and Govt are up in arms about this they make countless programmes and references to hooliganism. Now the leaders of the fair England fans always complain about lack of positive press and are driven underground to publications that give them attention. The mainstream however condemn hooliganism while giving it huge exposure. At the world cup we saw the emergence of the new chav lads who are not on databases or were subject to banning orders, they have emerged from the ridiculous way the problem has been vilified and portrayed in the press and by the govt.. You can draw parallels here with the muslim thing with their "nutters" hogging the limelight then alienating the majority who's youngsters feeling rejected and villified gradually act the part, the self fullfilling prophecy.

You are educated and experienced peewee and are culturally educated more than most, to me the emergence of tidy boxes to put people in is dangerous and again the horrific minority destroy it fro the majority.

taff you are right on the whole with what you say, and the murmerings will continue until something gives.

the tidy boxes you mention are a symptom of the muslim mentality of sticking together, while this happens they will always be pidgeon holed together. once more muslims start to speak out and say how ludicrous some of the decisions made in their favour are then i am sure that they will be less and less pidgeon holed and seen more as individuals, rather than the peception that they follow the crowd, as long as its a muslim crowd.

a muslim MP came out the other day and defended the school in suspending the teacher who refuse to remove her veil, he has received criticism from muslim groups but he has earned my respect for putting common sense before his religion. when more people do this i am sure there will be les suspicion about islam.

there is always a tendency to lump people together mate, as a scouser i am a thief, as an englishman i am a football hooligan, thats just human nature so more effort should be made to remove the stereotypical image

by **taff** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 1:15 pm

Again I agree with you dude. On that supply teacher by the way I have no sympathy as she was interviewed without a veil. But again the minority making their points will not get my attention, I am more concerned with the majority who are British and Muslim and get on with their lives.

by **Big Niall** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 1:28 pm

I didn't know she didn't wear her veil in the interview or that Jack Straw asked that they'd consider, as opposed to demand that they would remove their veils.

I hate the media :angry:

by **112-1077774096** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 4:15 pm

niall always read deeper then the sensational headline, the truth is in there somewhere (unless your reading the s*n).

too many reporters like to stir things up by being vague with the truth, i suppose by doing this it creates problems therefore creating more news to keep the hacks happy and in beer tokens. the best news in televised so you can actually see and hear the person saying what they have to say.

taff i read that i think a couple of days ago about her being interviewed without her veil, one again someone trying to twist things in order to make a few quid, thats what it all about now mate, its not about the veil anymore

by **dilbertsbanana** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:09 pm

Some of the things i have read on here are complete madness. Yes, Bush is one crazy sob but the war on terror is a right one.

Muslims wearing veils: Yes they can...they should be allowed, but not in certain places, schools being one of those places. If i ride my motorbike and go into a bank i have to take off my helmut...where is the difference?

Bin Laden: he hasnt been found. he needs to be found. when he is found someone will just take over.

Korea testing nuclear: yes it is wrong compared to us or usa doing the same. We are a more evolved country. As the saying goes, dont be scared of the person with a thousand nuclear bombs, be scared of the guy with one. The korean guy is a nutter.

PC gone mad: politcial corectness i mean. Where i live there are asian only bars, asian only streets, shops, butchers etc etc. I have been reading on this site for a while and the racial tension has changed so much in recent months...civil war coming up?

So, in conclusion. We live in the uk, and we need to get a government that isnt a complete pu$$y. We are so scared of getting sued that we wont do anything now. Police dogs being muzzled? Give me a break.
Im all for multi-culturalness. And like the fonz said: id rather know a cool black person than an uncoll white person (is it pc to say black?)

people are people, white, black, pink, green. some are cool, some are complete n0bjockeys. it just happens that at the moment the muslim community are the idiots.

If there is a chance that there is a terrorist, police need to inform the muslim cleric of the area first.

That one handed bloke has brought a house whilst in jail and whilst on benefits.

The so called innocent muslim family whose house was invaded had hundreds of thousands of cash buried in there garden.

And finally, if you catch a suicide bomber, whats the point of an execution?

by **woof woof !** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:28 am

With regard to some of the comments about Muslims failure to intergrate . If we are to be even handed about this discussion we should acknowledge that virtually all ethnic miorities tend to cluster together. In London for example there are areas that are recognised as Jewish ,Sikh, Irish , Korean, Portugese, Russian etc etc I live in Brixton which is 80% black (caribbean and west african) and in the last couple of years a steadily growing South American community (mainly Colombian) . How many cities throughout the world have "chinatowns" or "little Tokyo's" ,it wasn't that long ago that Earls Court (in London) had more Australians than all other nationalities put together, they have been replaced in recent years by South Africans.

Minorities set up "ghetto's" for all sorts of reasons ,primarily ,familiarity and self protection . We can say they should intergrate but I remember a time when "Paki bashing" was considered some kind of weekend sport by some members of our not so welcoming british society.

Certainly all sections of society should abide by the laws of the land and the Muslims do themselves no favours with their apparent determination to live by their own codes .However living in an apparently isolated group is not just a question of geography and it is an issue that affects all of us.

by **account deleted by request** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 2:29 am

Police to avoid Ramadan arrests

The holy month of Ramadan is due to end next week
Police in Manchester have been told not to arrest Muslims wanted on warrants at prayer times during Ramadan.
Greater Manchester Police confirmed it had asked detectives not to make planned arrests during those periods for reasons of religious sensitivity.

The advice was emailed out to officers working in Moss Side, Hulme, Whalley Range, Rusholme, Fallowfield, Ardwick, Longsight, Gorton and Levenshulme.

Are the police now going to stop arresting Christians at Easter and Christmas..... I didnt think so

by **66-1112520797** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:36 am

With regard to some of the comments about Muslims failure to intergrate . If we are to be even handed about this discussion we should acknowledge that virtually all ethnic miorities tend to cluster together. In London for example there are areas that are recognised as Jewish ,Sikh, Irish , Korean, Portugese, Russian etc etc I live in Brixton which is 80% black (caribbean and west african) and in the last couple of years a steadily growing South American community (mainly Colombian) . How many cities throughout the world have "chinatowns" or "little Tokyo's" ,it wasn't that long ago that Earls Court (in London) had more Australians than all other nationalities put together, they have been replaced in recent years by South Africans.

Minorities set up "ghetto's" for all sorts of reasons ,primarily ,familiarity and self protection . We can say they should intergrate but I remember a time when "Paki bashing" was considered some kind of weekend sport by some members of our not so welcoming british society.

Certainly all sections of society should abide by the laws of the land and the Muslims do themselves no favours with their apparent determination to live by their own codes .However living in an apparently isolated group is not just a question of geography and it is an issue that affects all of us.

Thats fair enough, and I'd understand that if the Muslim population were a small pocket tucked away in Southall or somewhere. But there not, I dont even know if its correct calling Muslims an ethnic minoritie as they seem to be heavily populated accross England.
Also on the topic of "Paki bashing" my mates uncle lived in Berry park, Luton a Heavily populated Muslim community and one that didnt take to well to a white man walking down. He lived there, the countless times his house got broken into, him being beaten up while walikng home, his daughter would get the same treatment too and she was around four years old.
So yes you can say that "Paki bashing" was some kind of weekend sport, wrongly so infact that was utter disgusting. But especially nowadays its not all one way traffic like, (with my mates uncle for example). But back in the eighties I reckon Muslims got "bashed" because they did look different, speak different and were a minority (thats not an excuse BTW) coupled with the fact people werent as educated about other cultures back then and the football hooligan culture was in full flow. The Muslim community were a minority back then and got picked on, so therefore they congregated, I understand that. But its 2006 and the tables have turned, interms of numbers and IMO the Muslim race is not a minority race anymore, and they are just as guilty as the White man, for not helping them intergrate, or being racist towards one another or whatever, there's two sides to this story.
But at the end of the day the Muslims are living in what was a prodominantly white christian country, its the Muslim people who have to adapt and change there ways to live in our country, by learning English or whatever, if I went to Pakistan to live, I'd have to abide by there laws and out of respect I'd learn there tongue to help my intergration.

Just one other point, Muslims have seem to be at the brunt of racial tension for years, and this war on terror has hightened the tension. The Carribeans, Africans and Chinese in Britain never got such a stigma attached to them, so why is it that Muslims have?

by **woof woof !** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 9:04 am

Bamaga man wrote:Just one other point, Muslims have seem to be at the brunt of racial tension for years, and this war on terror has hightened the tension. The Carribeans, Africans and Chinese in Britain never got such a stigma attached to them, so why is it that Muslims have?

As I mentioned earlier

"Certainly all sections of society should abide by the laws of the land and the Muslims do themselves no favours with their apparent determination to live by their own codes".

Whilst we're on the seperate communities issue. PeeWee , are the Thai's still issuing Black passports to some of their citizens ? I seem to recall that Thai nationals of Chinese descent were given a black passport whilst "pure" Thai's received a maroon (?) one . Also in Phuket ,there are villages that are entirely muslim . When I spoke to some about this I was told that the Gov't oblige them to live seperate from the Bhuddist Thai's (this was in the mid '70's) . I was never able to get this confirmed , have you heard anything about it ?

by **Woollyback** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 9:20 am

s@int wrote:Are the police now going to stop arresting Christians at Easter and Christmas.....

or atheists all year round

by **woof woof !** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 9:22 am

Woollyback wrote:
s@int wrote:Are the police now going to stop arresting Christians at Easter and Christmas.....

or atheists all year round

or Boy Scouts during "Bob a Job" week .

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