Liverpool FC Forum

by **112-1077774096** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 2:40 pm

PhiLFC wrote:we've all got to learn to live together AND learn to laugh at ourselves.

by **afs66** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:23 pm

PhiLFC wrote:But in passing I would say that to kill, threaten to kill and bring fear and panic into people for a "cartoon" is, in my opinion, ridiculous. If you don't know what Mohammed looks like how can you possibly criticize a person for drawing a "cartoon" of Him... it doesn't make sense to me. I mean it could have been a "cartoon" likeness of one of my neighbours who is an elderley Islamic gentleman.

but we've all got to learn to live together AND learn to laugh at ourselves.

OK Phill
We spoke before these, every cultere is different. Maybe your people or culture dont care an act like this, but this is very scathing for a Muslim.
And the most blooded wars in history were all about religion. Every country in the world must be carrefull about religions.Because this very critic issue.
İ am saying again, i dont approve killing or threating to kill or bring fear to people. But i dont approve those cartoons too.
Thousands of Muslims had waited for just an apologize about cartoons from Danmark Goverment. I think that wasnt very hard to say " sorry about cartoons". But Danmark Goverment didnt respect and they invited those events. And i dont approve both .

And i am going out of this thread...

by **afs66** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:24 pm

PhiLFC wrote:But in passing I would say that to kill, threaten to kill and bring fear and panic into people for a "cartoon" is, in my opinion, ridiculous. If you don't know what Mohammed looks like how can you possibly criticize a person for drawing a "cartoon" of Him... it doesn't make sense to me. I mean it could have been a "cartoon" likeness of one of my neighbours who is an elderley Islamic gentleman.

but we've all got to learn to live together AND learn to laugh at ourselves.

OK Phill
We spoke before these, every cultere is different. Maybe your people or culture dont care an act like this, but this is very scathing for a Muslim.
And the most blooded wars in history were all about religion. Every country in the world must be carrefull about religions.Because this is very critic issue.
I am saying again, i dont approve killing or threating to kill or bring fear to people. But i dont approve those cartoons too.
Thousands of Muslims had waited for just an apologize about cartoons from Danmark Goverment. I think that wasnt very hard to say " sorry about cartoons". But Danmark Goverment didnt respect and they invited those events. And i dont approve both .

And i am going out of this thread...

by **112-1077774096** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:27 pm

i know i was going to keep out of this now but

cartoon - burn embassy

do the maths mate, and why should the danish government say sorry for a cartoon that was printed in a newspaper, the danes have freedom of press and can print pretty much what they want, so again i will ask why should the danish government say sorry for what was in a newspaper.

its like asking rafa to say sorry for an everton player making a bad tackle

by **afs66** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:38 pm

i said the reason, didnt i?
affronting to Mohammed by drawings is very SCATHING for a Muslim.
This is the fact that people can be very sensitive and they can be slanted to being provoked when the issue is about their religion.
This is valid for Christians, Muslims,Jewish, Budists...

by **112-1077774096** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:44 pm

but why should the danish government say sorry for something in a newspaper, it was the actions of a private individual and not the danish government.

did saudi arabia say sorry for bin ladens actions?

just give up, you are fighting a losing battle here and every time you try to justify something i will come right back at you and make your argument look foolish

by **afs66** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:10 pm

peewe
My English isnt good enough. I cant not use the words like you. And i dont care whether justify in this argument or not to justify.
Lets name you the winner, if you will be satisfied.

and the answer
If you as Danmark Goverment dont want your embassies burned, you must apologize.
Because that scathing cartoons appeared in your country. And a provoked person can do everything for his religion. A provaked Jewis can do everything for his religion, a provoked Christian can do everything for his religion as Crusades, a provaked Budhist can do everthing for his religion. And he needn't any logical reason to do this, he just do for his religion.
Danmark Goverment should know this and should say sorry.
There is no logical reason, because this is the religious issue .

by **112-1077774096** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:13 pm

afs66 wrote:If you as Danmark Goverment dont want your embassies burned, you must apologize.

i dont put this down to bad english, i put this down to a blinkered, uneducated, brainwashed view about reality.

by **drummerphil** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:17 pm

peewee wrote:
PhiLFC wrote:we've all got to learn to live together AND learn to laugh at ourselves.

i,m laughing at Neverton losing to the toons,can i count that

by **afs66** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:18 pm

peewee wrote:
afs66 wrote:If you as Danmark Goverment dont want your embassies burned, you must apologize.

i dont put this down to bad english, i put this down to a blinkered, uneducated, brainwashed view about reality.

and i put your scarity of understanding down to your low iq level. Read again and try to understand what i meant in 5-6 posts.

by **112-1077774096** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:24 pm

i know perfectly well what you mean, thats why i made the above comment.

this is now the end of the discussion before we get into a slanging match that i dont particuarly want. i think i have made my point intelligently and calmly and its just a shame that you cant see that, but i didnt really expect you to see it as we have differening views.

i believe in an eye for an eye, you believe in an eye, an arm, a leg and a burnt building for an eye.

i gave you the chance to pm me to save you any embarrasment but you didnt take it and its clear what your mentality is.

good night

by **Sabre** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:24 pm

peewe
My English isnt good enough. I cant not use the words like you. And i dont care whether justify in this argument or not to justify.
Lets name you the winner, if you will be satisfied.

and the answer
If you as Danmark Goverment dont want your embassies burned, you must apologize.

Sod off.

We have what's called freedom of expression here, and we won't apologize just because we're afraid some fanatics will kill our religious men/woman , our churches or whatever.

My POPE mentions a medieval text, and churches are burnt in return and religion women/men killed? He apologizes for it, and they say that's not good enough?

And it's not a matter of now. Salman Rushdie was condemned to dead quite a while ago.

Muslims are not terrorists for me, only integrists are, but I'm from a country that was 8 centuries invaded by muslims and I know quite a bit how they're always keen on spotting a little dust in other's eyes and don't see a bus in theirs.

by **112-1077774096** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:25 pm

Sabre wrote:I know quite a bit how they're always keen on spotting a little dust in other's eyes and don't see a bus in theirs.

brilliant comment

by **afs66** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:36 pm

And this is most important point that you also accepted above is people looks different to events in the world.
You accept but unfortunately you cant understand. You cant understand that's not quite as simple as Cartoon problem. You cant understand that people all over the world arent like you. You cant understand their cultures are different from yours.
By the way, good night.One day when i become more demogogic, i'll pm you to argue...

by **Sabre** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:57 pm

Peewee, didn't find the word, and I found a bus handy

And this is most important point that you also accepted above is people looks different to events in the world.
You accept but unfortunately you cant understand. You cant understand that's not quite as simple as Cartoon problem. You cant understand that people all over the world arent like you. You cant understand their cultures are different from yours.
By the way, good night.One day when i become more demogogic, i'll pm you to argue...

Ok, I don't understand.

You tell me. In Saudi Arabia there are still women that are killed with stones in year 2006. Those muslims are from the "Wahabi" interpretation of Coran, and they say it's a tradition. And I ask, well in the tradition they used horses to travel, and now they use private jets, don't they? It's not demagogia, it's that some muslims see what they want!

I ask aswell wether Mahoma said or not if Muslims and Christians should be brothers, as their religions are alike. Yet, many muslims call us infidels, on the contrary of what Mahoma says.

I think you start every of your prayers talking about mercy and compassion, and this is what I see lacking most when you deal with other religions.

I'm not trying to do demagogia. I want to say clear that muslim is a religion I respect most. Mahoma's words are full of wisdom and saintness if you ask me. But as he said (I think) God or Allah doesn't love the agressors. And despite "fatwa"s are done to say that those that murder people are not in Islam, I still think that there's little mercy and autocriticism in the Muslim world.

Same applies for some Christians needless to say. I'm outrageous when the president of a nation says that they go to war with God besides them (Bush) and we catholics have many things to condemn about our attitudes, but as I said, I see to much intolerance in muslim world. I know muslims are attacked, I know that where as if you slate a jew you can have problems in occident, nothing happens if you slate a muslim. But I still have to say what I don't like.

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