Liverpool FC Forum

by **choopong** » Sun May 16, 2004 7:14 am

I'm a Liverpool fan from Bangkok and was disgusted by Thaksin's attempt to buy Liverpool shares. First of all he can not do this on behalf of Thai government. Secondly even if he does this on his own, it is still Thai people's money to be invested overseas, while we are still a poor country and have a long lists of much more urgent needs.

Following is an opinion in a Thai newspaper today (The Nation) :

SIDELINES: Liverpool – worth its weight in publicity

Published on May 16, 2004

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra chalked up more points for employing successful diversionary tactics when he focused public attention on his desire to buy a 30-per-cent stake in Liverpool, a famous team in the English Premier League. No doubt this is just another public-relations stunt show, though it has sent the much less imaginative Democrat Party into disarray in its own intra-party turf battle.

The people of Thailand currently face several pressing problems, particularly the crisis in the three southernmost provinces and rising oil prices, which are putting pressure on the cost of living and dampening hopes for robust economic growth. So Thaksin’s temporary hogging of the limelight comes at just the right time.

What good will part ownership do the country? Our CEO has talked about setting up a soccer training school, using Liverpool as a launching pad to help Thai soccer-players become world class. The real goal, shall we say, is to use bookies involved in soccer betting as a new source of government revenue, in addition to the casinos that are now in the planning stage.

Our CEO has gained a lot from just a week’s worth of news reports. Not only was he able to capture newspaper headlines and time on prime-time news hours, but he also managed to make people lose their sense of reality, if for just a while. The gullible and naive, of course, were pleased by our CEO’s success in making the bid for Liverpool part of the national agenda.

Government House became the venue for the first round of formal negotiations. Thus Thaksin became the first national leader to consider the purchase of a foreign soccer club as a crowning political achievement.

Never mind that the Bt.4.6 billion slated for the purchase would come from various sources, including a state-owned body. Our CEO has demonstrated an inexplicable sense of priority and a fair amount of gall by resorting to such marketing gimmicks, underscoring his instinct for survival.

What amazes the people who are familiar with his marketing and PR savvy is his audacity in going to any length to divert public attention from crucial issues, including his own downslide in popularity.

The immediate benefit of the Liverpool bid was that most people were genuinely intrigued. They simply didn’t want to consider whether the chances of achieving part ownership of Liverpool were far more remote than Thaksin and his associates were willing to admit.

Liverpool shareholders and fans worldwide must have been shocked by the grand plan of Thaksin, who wants the soccer team to promote OTOP (One Tambon, One Product), and other Thai products. This makes people wonder whether a minority shareholder can dictate the terms and conditions of Liverpool as a vehicle for commercial purposes.

Thaksin and his associates seem pleased by the worldwide media attention and free advertising. Of course, there was a bit of a dark side when the public spotlight focused on Thailand’s record of human-rights violations and criticism of our CEO’s motives. Oh yes, he will learn soon enough how menacing those English tabloids can get.

What will our CEO do if the deal falls through? His understanding of soccer mania in the country will likely lead to further flights of fancy. Already there have been utterances that if he fails to get Liverpool he will look at other Premier League clubs.

If he indulges in a bid to buy a soccer club each month, fails and tries again, he will cling to the premiership for a long time, at least until people eventually realise that there is no serious intention to buy a soccer club, just a desire for free publicity.

Fulham served as a free ride for a while. The Liverpool deal has been greeted with even more fanfare. Arsenal was mentioned last week and will probably be the next target for bidding. The list could go on and on. Thaksin and his pals are probably laughing their heads off at the political naivety of the people.

The world knows that Thaksin is a multimillionaire whose wealth continues to accumulate. Yet he does not want to spend his own money to buy Liverpool. Is he generous and willing to do something for the public good, or is it because he does not want to bear whatever risks come with the deal?

One suspects that if the deal were really that good he would have kept it for himself instead of spending other people’s money. Anyway, the things that are happening in this country right now make one wonder whether there doesn’t actually exist a man who can fool all of the people all of the time.

Sopon Onkgara

© Nation Multimedia Group

by **LFC #1** » Sun May 16, 2004 7:52 am

couldn't have said it better myself

no honestly the Thai deal worries me as it seems to be a publicity stunt to win an election, Thaksin probably has little care for the club. Not to mention those photos of him receiving a MANC shirt! :angry:

by **Owzat** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:18 am

I heard the Thai pm was seen wearing a manc top this time last year. Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest, Morgan is the man for Liverpool FC

by **mynameisred** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:23 am

Ive been trying to keep upto date with all this investment malarky however a couple of things are clear. The first is that we obviously need some financial investment the second is that in all honesty we know very little about either bid. In my opinion Morgan played the fans card too early, if hes got our interests really at heart he should have just said he wanted to invest and have a minor seat on the board. However the existing board claim he was undervaluing the 30% of the club he wanted to buy. Did anyone know he was buying 30% In most walks of life a rights issue is normally just pure investment as the money is only underwritten by him sure that would buy him extra say in the halls of power but I reiterate and I must admit I didnt see the whole interview but did he want 30%? I wished he would have played it a bit cooler with regards to Houllier he can do more to change things on the inside than out. Regarding the Thai money Ive read the post from the newspaper and no offence to the poster but if the thai press is anything like ours its to be raed with a pinch of salt. I am aware of the human rights record and the poverty in the country and if the money does come from taxpayers/state funds then we cannot accept for moral reasons alone. We leave the pimping of the club badge to the scum mancs.
I love Houllier but theres too much resting on his performance now, we could lose everything i.e Owen and stevie g. Its simple would these players leave if Martin O'Neill was coming in as manager i doubt it, would he get more out of the average players that Houllier himself bought yes I believe he would. Moores to the fans is a legend we all talk about him in high esteem but to dig in on the managers side at this time is a big mistake. In reality we have one of the best managers jobs in the world to offer right now. We have some world class players some great players and some average, we have developed plans for a new stadium, we have champions league footy, historically the managers have time and plenty of money to build their own team and in all honesty if we were to start all over again next season what are the chances of it being worse than our last two seaons. Nada.
If we need investment let it come from Morgan, I want to see him working with Moores and not against him to get a new manager in place who can shift a few players and bring some in with the war chest that his invetsment would give us.
Remember all this turmoil has only come about because Houlier wasted Granadas last injection of cash on some terrible players at a time when the team was almost there. He took us backwards that time and I dread to think what would happen to us if hes given that kind of money again.
Peace.

by **Owzat** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:39 am

Word is Morgan doesn't stand a chance because the board is behind Houllier and Morgan is not a fan of Houllier. I'm not sure Morgan alone can sack Houllier, just sounds to me like they are scared of hearing about reality.

by **The_Rock** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:52 am

Owzat wrote:Word is Morgan doesn't stand a chance because the board is behind Houllier and Morgan is not a fan of Houllier. I'm not sure Morgan alone can sack Houllier, just sounds to me like they are scared of hearing about reality.

Sometimes, i think the board take the liverpool fans for granted. 80% of the fans support morgan but they still choose to ignore them ............

Liverpool are already huge in south east asia. Thaksin buying a part of liverpool will not really increase our profile more...... It is already big.

by **mynameisred** » Sun May 16, 2004 9:55 am

I really cant get my head around it, surely moores knows hes putting everything he has done for the club as well as his own future on the line by backing Houllier. I think theres a helluva lot we do not yet know. Lets hope hes got something up his sleeve coz these opputunities dont come very often and its critical we do the right thing for the club.

by **SantaGiveHoullierTheSack** » Sun May 16, 2004 1:14 pm

Khun Sopon, if this article did appeared in The Nation, how long do you think political pressure will be put on the paper to sack it's editor in chief or throw him behind bars ?
I remembered Bangkok Post was forced to sack it's chief editor some months back because he wrote something which Thaksin don't like...this is the sorry fact with Thai politics and not just with Thaksin.

by **choopong** » Mon May 17, 2004 10:48 am

I don't think Bangkokpost editor was sacked by Thaksin. He was only asked to tone down the criticism so that the country image will not be hurt.

This kind of critical comments levelled at the PM (as shown above) is very common in the Nation and Bangkok Post. Khun Sopon will not be fired over something like this. Thai press is still very free compared to other SE Asia nations.

Anyway, I don't believe the Liverpool purchase will be a good business decision as it's very difficult to sell for example genuine Liverpool jersey here because imitations are a lot cheaper. And there are better and much cheaper ways to improve local football.

As I said, football is not a high priority, while the majority of people still live under poverty line. Liverpool will do Thai people a big favor by not accepting Thaksin's money.

by **dawson99** » Mon May 17, 2004 10:55 am

wasntt eh first morgan bid a bit iffy tho? im not massive on my stocks and shares but it did look like he was almost selling shares he didnt have to morgan who already owned them and buying his own shares for a fraction of the price.
there is alot more to it than imply going for the homegrown guy now m sorry tos ay but he'll come back with abetter offer no doubt

by **stmichael** » Mon May 17, 2004 5:30 pm

the way i see it, a promise to win the Premiership next season - come what may - is implicit in Gerard Houllier's grim determination to hang on at Anfield.

It has to be. Else why would he risk the sack by Christmas time if results don't go the way of his £200million team?

Yes I did say £200m. For by the time Houllier's summer spending is completed, the Liverpool side will have cost as much as Chelsea to tinker with.

Much of that money may now come from a politician unknown to the outside world until he and his rich friends decided they would like a football club as an executive toy - a kind of trophy wife with more room to play on.

The multi-millionaire in question is Thailand's prime minister, Thaksin Shinawatra - not a readily chantable name - a man who has no particular interest in Liverpool.

Indeed, last year he tried and failed to buy into Fulham, having apparently leafed through the Big Soccer Alphabet Book, sadly ignoring E for Everton as he did so.

Shinawatra is significant for another reason besides his jewelled background and a shaky grasp of human rights (rebellious Liverpool supporters beware!). His interest enables Liverpool to sidetrack the legitimate claims of the wealthy Steve Morgan, a true fan who would demand managerial change ahead of anything else as part of his latest investment offer.

Nothing personal, he insists, it's just that along with up to 45,000 oth-ers he doesn't like the way Liverpool play and sees Gerard Houllier as someone who could bore for England, if not for France.

Morgan's intention to shake the Anfield oak is seen - shudder, shudder - as a scenario not to be contemplated. Which is why the arrival of a mystery bidder from a dirt-poor Third World country offers Liverpool the perfect get-out.

Shinawatra will simply pour in the cash in exchange for Far East marketing rights and ask nothing more than a comfy seat in the directors' box, plus the chance to travel further for home games - unless the new stadium's to be built in Bangkok - than anyone else on the planet. No wonder Houllier looked youthful again after the match at St Andrews.

by **Thai Connection** » Wed May 19, 2004 9:26 pm

Read and weep!

http://www.akha.org/

by **Thai Connection** » Wed May 19, 2004 9:27 pm

Read and weep!

http://www.akha.org/

by **choopong** » Wed May 26, 2004 7:02 am

LIVERPOOL DEAL: Reds bid 'unconstitutional'

Published on May 26, 2004

Thammasat lecturers blast Thaksin's methods as 'abuse of state power'

A group of Thammasat University legal experts has deemed the government's bid to buy a 30-per-cent stake in Liverpool Football Club as "unconstitutional", giving new impetus to growing opposition against the controversial scheme which reportedly made major progress yesterday.

As Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra declared that the Thai bid had overcome sticking points and a deal could be signed in six weeks, the Thammasat law lecturers yesterday joined senators and members of the National Economic and Social Advisory Council in strongly decrying the plan.

Opposition to the deal centres on the government's plan to raise public funds to finance the bid by launching a special lottery, which offers enormous prizes - the biggest amounting to Bt1 billion.

The funds will be managed by a new state enterprise to be set up under the Sports Authority of Thailand to represent Thai interests in the English Premier League club.

In a strongly-worded open letter, the Thammasat lecturers called the Liverpool plan an "abuse of state power", echoing growing criticism that Thaksin's personal agenda and national interests are getting dangerously mixed up.

The five academics claimed the government is violating Article 87 of the Constitution, which prohibits the state from competing in business terms with the private sector unless there is a need to protect national security, national interests or arrange utility services.

"Buying the Liverpool stake apparently has the main aim of making profits through a state enterprise, therefore it does not fit provisions of Article 87," the letter said.

Using state mechanisms to launch the special lottery, it said, violated gambling regulations which prohibited the use of state income from lotteries on anything other than charitable purposes or public benefits.

"To cite sport development is just a pretext to justify what is in fact a distortion in the exercising of state power," the letter said.

"If the government has a genuine intention to develop local sports, money from the lottery must be used for more tangible programmes such as construction of facilities.

"To issue a special lottery and use the money to buy a soccer club stake is unconstitutional, the legal and political consequences of which the government must be accountable for."

The Thammasat academics said they would not mind if Thaksin and his business associates used their own money.

"But to raise public funds in this kind of purchase will set a very dangerous precedent," said Banjerd Singka-neti.

"How far will the government go after this? One day the government could raise funds to buy Harrods and claim it wants to promote local products?"

Vorajet Pakirat said Thaksin seems to think that existing laws are nothing more than barriers he has to go around or overcome.

"The laws are meant to make sure people with power don't abuse it," he said.

Outspoken Bangkok Senator Chirmsak Pinthong has called the Liverpool bid "impeachable". Last week, members of the National Economic and Social Advisory Council began a signature campaign against the government's lottery plan.

Thaksin said yesterday that a major stumbling block in talks with Liverpool had been overcome.

"The subject of Thai demands over representation on the Liverpool board is no longer a problem," he said.

"The next step is to get teams of professionals to analyse financial and legal issues," a process which would take up to six weeks, he added.

Thaksin said Thailand would not talk to other clubs during the six weeks.

"We are in a silence period now, so don't ask me about the Liverpool deal."

Deputy Commerce Minister Pongsak Raktapongpisal, the chief Thai negotiator, is due to return from Liverpool today with more details.

Sucheera Pinijparakarn

Samatcha Hunsara

THE NATION

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