Liverpool FC Forum

by **Feeney** » Thu May 04, 2006 9:09 pm

stmichael wrote:as one of the few on here who championed the signing of this guy in the first place, i just wandered how you reflect on peter crouch's first year at lfc? as far as i'm concerned he was never brought in to be our first choice striker but the way things have worked out, he's found himself playing on a more regular basis than most would have predicted.

so it's quite simple.

1. looking back, do you still think we over-paid for him in the first place?

2. did you have every faith that he would come through his initial goal drought at the start of the season?

3. what areas of his game do you still think he can improve?

4. how many goals can he realistically expect to score next season, assuming we are bringing in gonzalez and a right winger?

5. crouch for england now. starter or plan b?

having not been utilised correctly in the beginning (he's never a lone striker) i think we should be pleased. anybody can see that he's now an important part of our team and we struggle to hold onto possession in the final third when he's not playing. with a quick lethal striker alongside him next season i think we'll see the best of the lad.

Thoughts?

1. My thoughts at the time were that he was over-priced and my thoughts haven't changed since then. As much as I have come round to Crouch I still don't believe he is worth £7M. I would have been happy to sign him at £5M, however the situation with Southampton going down mean't the cost was always going to inflate considering he scored quite a few goals in the previous season.

2. Yes, that was always going to happen - but from his performances, I soon learned that scoring wasn't the priority for Peter. For me, the jury was very much out on Peter Crouch. For what we paid, we could have brought some very decent players to the club. However, as we played him, I could see his role was more to link up play, hold the ball to allow play to catch up and generally make a f*cking nuisance of himself to do the defenders heads in. He was working not as a striker, but a player in a team of eleven, something of which we have all learned to appreciate this season with Rafa at the helm.

3. I'd like the lad to get a big plate of scouse down him - seriously!! He get's knocked about far too easily and when you compare him to someone like Koller, he's a lightweight. He needs to bulk up and be a lot stronger - really make defender know he's there.

4. Depends on point 3 IMO. He really needs to get more purchase on his headers as he seems to take a lot of the flight of a ball when he headers it. Technically, IMO, Garcia is a better header of a ball (note the word 'technically')!! I think if we can get a lot more decent balls in, especially from corners, we could be looking at 15 - 20.

5. Starter - without a doubt, unfortunately (unfortunate because Rooney's injured, not because Peter's in the team). Defoe isn't exactly blessed with being able to win headers and Owen's a non-starter. I've had quite a laugh at a few comments saying 'there's no chance we can win it now, Crouch is no good etc. Do remember that the Czechs have used Koller to great advantage with a fast partner (Baros) in the last few tournaments - maybe England have the additional quality needed in other positions to go that one step further....

by **XSD** » Thu May 04, 2006 9:09 pm

[quote="stmichael"][/quote]
1. looking back, do you still think we over-paid for him in the first place?

Yes certainly.

2. did you have every faith that he would come through his initial goal drought at the start of the season?

Yeah he was never going to keep drawing blanks, he is more than capable of scoring goals but is not prolific.

3. what areas of his game do you still think he can improve?

Every area he can improve on, he is not complete in any aspects. However he should focus most on heading the ball, I'm sure if he was a very good header of the ball he would have an extra 10 goals this season and we would be easily above Man UTD.

4. how many goals can he realistically expect to score next season, assuming we are bringing in gonzalez and a right winger?

Probably 10-15 in all competitions.

5. crouch for england now. starter or plan b?

Plan B definetely. There are at least 4-5 better English strikers than Crouch but most are raw goal scorers and can't hold the cause the most experienced defenders problems. That's why he's there.

by **teamleader1** » Thu May 04, 2006 9:16 pm

I dont think its so much about how much hes worth or how many goals he will get next season,for me its about reflecting on the teams much improved performance this season, we are now genuine title contenders, and I believe that Crouchy has had a lot to do with that, Rafa has great faith in him and a clear plan on utilising his strengths for the benifit of the team.

Rafa and the coaching team will work on his physical stature and aggression over the next couple of years, for me hes a great signing who will go from strength to strength, I think hes handled the massive leap from a relagation outfit to champions of europe very well.

Toshack looked like bamby on ice, but a great manager knew he was the perfect foil for KK, maybe just maybe Rafa can find us another KK.

by **Sabre** » Thu May 04, 2006 9:31 pm

1. looking back, do you still think we over-paid for him in the first place?

He's an english international, and the english market is too expensive right now (as it was the Spaniard one some years ago). So in an english context, I wouldn't say we've paid too much for him.

2. did you have every faith that he would come through his initial goal drought at the start of the season?

Yes and I challenge the one who doubts about it to check it out, I wrote pretty much about the issue. I didn't even expect he'd do a decent season this year, because I think he's young and learning. He's going to improve his performance for us in the following years.

3. what areas of his game do you still think he can improve?

He's too polite with the defenders. Must work in the gym, and start to intimidate the defenders a bit more, be a worse guy than he is.
I also think jumping and heading the ball can be improved through training.

4. how many goals can he realistically expect to score next season, assuming we are bringing in gonzalez and a right winger?

No more than 12. In LFC the team doesn't work for the strikers, atm.

5. crouch for england now. starter or plan b?

Depending on the game, I'd start with him.

by **TheoRacle** » Fri May 05, 2006 4:31 am

1. Yep think we overpaid for him however all English players have inflated prices when it comes to comparable foreign players.

2. Yes, thought he would score eventually though at times after missing a couple of sitters he had me re-thinking that one.

3. Lots of room for improvement. Rooney's injury being bad news for England is also bad news for us! I would have liked to see Crouch not in Germany but instead locked in a gym somewhere in Liverpool with only a weightbench, some protein shakes and a dead cow for company! He also needs to work on his headers as most have said as he is very disappointing in this area. As Sabre has said, he is too 'nice' - maybe a good start to next season (or a good world cup perhaps) will see a surge in confidence and some agression coming thorugh - but I doubt it somehow.

4. I'd like to see any Liverpool center forward directly responsible for at least 20-25 goals a season. Whether that's 10 goals and 15 assists or 20 and 5 doesn't matter but the total return should be somewhere around that figure. Crouch I think does have the potential to achieve 18-20 a season but will have a relative high percentage of assists - he does have good vision and can play a decent final ball - something I'd like to see more of.

5. Either Crouch or Owen (opposition pending) starting upfront with BigMick's Carrick anchored midfield behind. Owen or Crouch up front with Gerrard and Lampard running the channels could be a very effective strike force.

by **66-1112520797** » Fri May 05, 2006 7:06 am

stmichael wrote:as one of the few on here who championed the signing of this guy in the first place, i just wandered how you reflect on peter crouch's first year at lfc? as far as i'm concerned he was never brought in to be our first choice striker but the way things have worked out, he's found himself playing on a more regular basis than most would have predicted.

so it's quite simple.

1. looking back, do you still think we over-paid for him in the first place?

2. did you have every faith that he would come through his initial goal drought at the start of the season?

3. what areas of his game do you still think he can improve?

4. how many goals can he realistically expect to score next season, assuming we are bringing in gonzalez and a right winger?

5. crouch for england now. starter or plan b?

having not been utilised correctly in the beginning (he's never a lone striker) i think we should be pleased. anybody can see that he's now an important part of our team and we struggle to hold onto possession in the final third when he's not playing. with a quick lethal striker alongside him next season i think we'll see the best of the lad.

Thoughts?

"as far as i'm concerned he was never brought in to be our first choice striker but the way things have worked out, he's found himself playing on a more regular basis than most would have predicted"

Your probably right he wasnt, but then again if you look at the form of our other strikers Rafa hasnt got much choice really.

1. Honestly, yes. Dont get me wrong I think he's a good buy but with today's transfer market your always likely to pay over the odds a little plus the fact he's English puts his price up for god knows what reason. Maybe five million would of been a fair price for Crouch.

2. I new he would find the net eventually, so no I didnt worry when he went through his drought. Alot more prolific strikers go through goal droughts it's just one of those things. But on that note of scoring goals Crouchy will never be one of those "prolific" strikers. He, to me is a forward more than a striker.

3. For me it's got to be his goal ratio, he needs to be more selfish and composed in front of goal. Another area of his game that could be improved is his heading, for a tall guy you'd almost expect to him to have similar heading ability, that of someone like Mark Hately of old. Apart from those two points he has a pretty well rounded game.

4. To be honest maybe five or six more than this season, like I said he isnt an out and out striker. Even with Gonzalez playing. For me Crouchy gives the Midfield a lot more chance's of scoring goals throughout a season than he would getting on the scoresheet himself, with the knock-downs, layoffs for the on-coming midfielders etc .

5. Well plan B, its gotta be the old little and large routine.
Owen playing off of Crouch almost in the same way as he did with Heskey. Maybe Crouch could drop a bit deeper and help out with the build-up more , as he does have better control/feet than Heskey did/does.
I dont think England could use Crouch the way Rafa likes to, as England generally rely on there strikers to score goals where as Rafa I think prefers goals to come from all over the pitch not just his strikers.

by **Mark 23** » Fri May 05, 2006 10:02 am

Did you see his miss at Villa the other day, it was shocking, and give the lad his due, he does some good stuff but you can't teach that instinct. I think if we get this elusive striker that we all want and a right winger then Crouch might be on the bench more, and just be used for games were we needa targetman, somebody for the defense to whack it up to to relieve the pressure.

by **stmichael** » Fri May 05, 2006 12:03 pm

Mark 23 wrote:I think if we get this elusive striker that we all want and a right winger then Crouch might be on the bench more, and just be used for games were we needa targetman, somebody for the defense to whack it up to to relieve the pressure.

Disagree with that. I reckon we'll use Crouch about as much next season as we have during this one. I don't believe we'll get two new strikers, only one. So Crouch's position will be very similar to what it is now.

He was never bought to be our main goalscorer. He was bought to give us a new dimension, which he has.

by **66-1112520797** » Fri May 05, 2006 12:21 pm

stmichael wrote:
Mark 23 wrote:I think if we get this elusive striker that we all want and a right winger then Crouch might be on the bench more, and just be used for games were we needa targetman, somebody for the defense to whack it up to to relieve the pressure.

Disagree with that. I reckon we'll use Crouch about as much next season as we have during this one. I don't believe we'll get two new strikers, only one. So Crouch's position will be very similar to what it is now.

He was never bought to be our main goalscorer. He was bought to give us a new dimension, which he has.

by **Ciggy** » Fri May 05, 2006 1:36 pm

Im still not totally bought on him TBH, dont know if its them flamingo like stork legs that put me off him, or what.
Personally I thought he would play more off the bench to change a game when we bought him, he is not mobile enough and we already lack pace upfront with Fowler not being to nifty and Morientes.

I liked our play earlier in the season when it was La liga style flowing attacking football, but the goals dried up so Rafa had to tweak the team, personally Id love two out and out strikers with pace, and flair up top.
Crouch is not to good on the eye, but I suppose he's a nightmare to mark for some defenders.

He''s a really nice fella and all that but I am not convinced that he will be here for years to come. But thats just me personally.

by **tel** » Mon May 08, 2006 9:36 am

He's been handy.

But not good enough to lead the line. I doubt his stats would look as good had Fowler not joined. Robbie made all the other strikers look good.

I think he's been good for us, I'm happy he joined the club, but I'd rather see another proven striker come in to do the job, and use Crouch more off the bench and for away games at Bolton.

by **-Rafa-** » Mon May 08, 2006 11:29 am

He's been a decent player for us, hoepfully he can keep on scoring next season

by **ALONSO** » Mon May 08, 2006 7:47 pm

Hes done ok but id rather we bought that 6ft 10 bloak from red star belgrade. Crouchs' headers are weak hes not that quick and his controls ok but nothing exceptional not a bad player but not achieved what i had hoped. I also think he would have scored more if the crosses were purposely played higher than usual like le saux etc.. used to do at southampton. Why do we rarely score from corners yet we are one of the tallest teams in the league.

by **columbia** » Mon May 08, 2006 8:25 pm

1. looking back, do you still think we over-paid for him in the first place?

Yes i do believe we over paid for him, probably by around 2m. However i dont think its that much of an issue as he has improved the side. We should be more worried about the money we wasted on cisse.

2. did you have every faith that he would come through his initial goal drought at the start of the season?

I new he would eventually score. I think the whole thing got written about too much which put an awful lot of pressure on him. Even before he had scored he was still bringing things to the side that we hadnt had previously, for instance betis away was a cracking performance.

3. what areas of his game do you still think he can improve?

I cant see him getting much better then he currently is, as already stated previously the things he lacks are almost impossible for him to gain. I guess he can improve his strength and speed if he works hard but in footballers terms he will never be fast or strong.

4. how many goals can he realistically expect to score next season, assuming we are bringing in gonzalez and a right winger?

I can see him having a better goal ratio next season because we will most likely have two wingers giving him better service coupled with the fact he will have settled in and we will most likely have another striker that hopefully will be banging in the goals which will take a little pressure off him. However i do expect him to start less games next season so therefore he may not acheive a higher goals tally.

5. crouch for england now. starter or plan b?

Depends on who is fit. With the squad named today i can definitely see him starting the first few games untill rooney returns.

by **columbia** » Mon May 08, 2006 10:17 pm

stmichael wrote:
Mark 23 wrote:I think if we get this elusive striker that we all want and a right winger then Crouch might be on the bench more, and just be used for games were we needa targetman, somebody for the defense to whack it up to to relieve the pressure.

Disagree with that. I reckon we'll use Crouch about as much next season as we have during this one. I don't believe we'll get two new strikers, only one. So Crouch's position will be very similar to what it is now.

He was never bought to be our main goalscorer. He was bought to give us a new dimension, which he has.

I agree that we will only sign one new striker, however i believe that striker will be are no1. Crouch has generally been the main starter of the strikers this year and the rest have been rotated more. So if we sign a new main starting striker crouch will be rotated more with the other two next year, i believe these two will be morientes and obviously fowler.

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