Rafalution has gone tits up

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby KOPMATT » Wed Oct 26, 2005 12:56 am

I have to admit i'm tending to feel the same, last season we were nearer the bottom than the top as eveyone knows, Rafa keeps saying that he team is better and stronger than last year but apart from Sissoko i really don't see where we're better or stronger? I know Rafa needs more time but on this seasons signings is it going the same way as the last 2 seasons under Houllier?
I'm like IMO the rest of us sooooo down at the minute!! :(
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Postby babu » Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:39 am

Doeboy wrote:Another :censored: performance . Oh well suppose we have, to in the words of rafa 'carry on working hard'. What a load of :censored:. This :censored: needs to be sorted out fast. Crouch can :censored: off for starters. Garcia is a passenger. Zenden no longer has the pace to be a winger. Morientes is too much of a pansy for the english league. Reina was not really needed. IMO Xabi and Sissoko (an able replacement for Hamaan when he retires) are the only decent signings rafa has made. What on earth is rafa thinking? We had a perfect oppurtunity to add a big player or two this summer using the CL win as an attraction. What do we do?? Pay £7million for Timmy on stilts.

Hey dick boy all you are doing is whingeing. 'Rafa needs to fix this fast !!' , then you go on to write-off most of the squad, what the hell do you propose???

How is Rafa supposed to fix this fast? If he does what you want we will be playing with 5 men on the pitch. No point talking about past purchases we could have made because as you state 'rafa needs to fix this fast', therefore we have to look forward.

What pointless whingeing.
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Postby Lando_Griffin » Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:41 am

Alfonso Alonso 69 wrote:
OneHotRed wrote:If it carries on like this its going to be relegation battles not 4/5th

I dont think we will finish 4th /5th, thats the funny thing.
you cant just presume we will, just because of our name!If it carries on like it has, we'll be lucky to finish 10th.

can i ask you all what would happen if we finished 9/10th and exited the european cup, what would you opinions of rafa be then??

at the moment, it looks like we are trying to catch Everton and not Chelsea!

What if Earth is invaded by killer Turnips?
What if Lester Piggott became the Duchess of Kent?
What if Henry Kissenger was a potato?
What if...
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Rafa Benitez - An unfinished Legend.
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Postby LFC #1 » Wed Oct 26, 2005 7:35 am

One defence of Rafa that I will give is that he was a little hard done by in the summer with transfers. He clearly wants to play a 4-5-1, but in order to do this you need to top quality wide players, which we don't possess currently. Rafa knew this, so decided to get Gonzaelz on loan, which fell through at the last minute. Then their was Figo choosing Inter over us, and Benfica backing out of the Simao deal at the last minute.

Had we got Gonzalez, and let's say Simao we would probabably be in a bteer position than we find ourselves currently. I hope Rafa can rectify this situation in the January transfer window (along with some backup for Carra and Hyppia, cos without those two playing together we don't look too good t the back. Hell if it was up to me I'd sell Josemi as well, and bring in right back to give Finnan some competition), but until January, things are looking a little grim.
Last edited by LFC #1 on Wed Oct 26, 2005 7:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Fernando Morientes > 19 < » Wed Oct 26, 2005 7:50 am

Lets be supportive to the players and the manager. We lost 2 games in a row(one league and one cup). It's not the end of the world. The league is not played over 8 games but the over 38 and i'm sure that Rafael Benitez will get us in the top 3 this term. Yesterday nite, we went out of the league cup, but as a liverpool fan i would have been nice to see lfc go and win the cup, but at the end of the day, we should forget about it since the we don't want a UEFA Cup place but a Champions league one for next season.

We still have a long way to go before the end of the season. Trust Rafa, he will get us back on track. If we won the champions league last season with Djimi Troare in the squad and Igor Biscan as well, i'm sure will finish high up in the league.

Let's go at Anfield on Saturday and show the players and the manager that we are right behind them !
"He is the player that Liverpool have been looking for." - Ian Rush
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Postby Homebooby » Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:19 am

I don't agree that nothing has changed since last season....the squad is a lot deeper than it was last season and Stevie is playing less games. Across the whole season that has to be good for us. Ok, some of the signings don't seem to be living too well with the premiership at the moment, but being an optimist, that can change.

If we had a stronger defence, a lot of the problems that we are seeing at the moment would arise anywhere near as harshly as they are as we would be nicking a lot more 1-0 wins. Unfortunately that is not the case.

To the person who claimed that Reinas' signing wasn't necessary, you haven't got your head screwed on the right way. Dudek was patchy last season and is nearing the end of his top flight career, it's logical to ensure there is someone to fill his place. Kirkland wasn't looking like that person, not matter how much we wanted him to be.

To all those calling for Rafas head, one thing you don't consider, if Rafa goes, someone new comes in and rips the squad apart again and sets us back another couple of years. Is that what we really want? At this time, I don't sit in that camp.

I was negative about the team at the beginning of the season because I didn't see any chance of us improving in the league and catching the top boys. I still stand by that, but I do think that in comparison with other performances, last night was not the disaster everyone is claiming it was. At least we got forward. If we keep doing that, the goals will come.
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Postby Leonmc0708 » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:36 am

This thread, and in particular the first five or six posts by two members highlights the problem supporters of this great club face.

If you live in the past, then you will never be happy with whats going on.

Yes the boot room was an institution in English football, and yes we did play slick stylish (some would say total) football in the seventies and eighties, but I dont know if any of you have noticed but since the last time we won the league Manchester United have won it 7 times, Leeds and Blackburn once each and Arsenal have won it a couple of times.

Benitez needs to undo 15 years of varios levels of mismangement.
JUSTICE FOR THE 96

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Postby NiftyNeil » Wed Oct 26, 2005 9:59 am

LFC #1 wrote:Had we got Gonzalez, and let's say Simao we would probabably be in a bteer position than we find ourselves currently.

Who's to say that Simao and Gonzalez are going to be any good for us. We were all excited about Morrientes - and look how that turned out.

I'm not being negative, just realistic.

We already have players that could walk into any team in the world. Other than the kids, how many of our squad have no international caps?  Pongolle and maybe Josemi (I not sure if he's played for Spain or not). What I'm saying is we should performing better with the players we have. The fact that we didn't get Gonzalez and Simao should not make any difference at all.
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Postby Hotrod » Wed Oct 26, 2005 10:42 am

its simple the reason we are not winning is that we are simpley not taking any of our chances and we have to start taking them i mean how can a team with kewell gerrard zenden alonso morintes pongolle crouch most of those are internationally capped player who scored loads of goals for their conutrys and their previous clubs i mean this lack of scoring is getting silly that is the most frustrating thing
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Postby HacksawJimDuggin » Wed Oct 26, 2005 10:52 am

This time last week we had just come off the back of a Champs League victory (and quite a convincing one at that) away from home. Yes the lack of goals was highlighted in this game but we were convincing nonetheless. We also had 2 games in hand in the league that "could" have taken up to 4th/5th in the league!!

OK things haven't worked out fantastically...

2 games on (and 2 defeats on) we find supporters/fans calling for Rafa to leave the club. We are in a transition period that is in the very early stages. Rafa was unlucky in the transfer window and I for one have every confidence in the man and the players he has brought in/will bring in!!
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Postby JBG » Wed Oct 26, 2005 10:59 am

Excellent post from Leon.

The club's history is a huge burden. Souness messed everything up, the burden of history weighed heavily on Roy Evans (being, in effect, the last bootroom member) and it absolutely strangled Gerard Houllier. The weight of history and the pressure of being a huge, historical club nearly drove Houllier to ruin.

We might as well forget about the past. So what if the current team is not fit to lick the boots of previous sides. We can't throw our toys out of the pram and say "Shankly would turn in his grave". There is no magic wand to make everything better. What good does all of this do?

The past is the past, the present is the present. Benitez has a lot of problems to address, some of his own making, most of his predecessors and that of the club hierachy. He is just as likely to fail as he is to succeed, but his credentials to succeed in the job are as good as anybody's. He has already delivered the biggest prize of all, and this, for me, buys him a lot of time. This is a long term project, and it will take a while.
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Postby JohnBull » Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:02 am

If you shoot at a target and miss, who do you blame?
Do you blame the bullet ? blame the rifle ? blame the trigger ? or do you blame the guy on the trigger ?

Otherwise you can always blame the target !
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Postby Judge » Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:04 am

good post from leon, and follow up by jbg, but see below:



i think weve only scored 6 goals since the season started

In 31 games so far, weve won 11, lost 13, drawn 7. Scored 28 goals and conceeded 35 goals. Yes folks these stats are from judge, not AB  :eyebrow

That doesnt make for good reading   :(
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Postby LFC #1 » Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:07 am

NiftyNeil wrote:
LFC #1 wrote:Had we got Gonzalez, and let's say Simao we would probabably be in a bteer position than we find ourselves currently.

Who's to say that Simao and Gonzalez are going to be any good for us. We were all excited about Morrientes - and look how that turned out.

I'm not being negative, just realistic.

We already have players that could walk into any team in the world. Other than the kids, how many of our squad have no international caps?  Pongolle and maybe Josemi (I not sure if he's played for Spain or not). What I'm saying is we should performing better with the players we have. The fact that we didn't get Gonzalez and Simao should not make any difference at all.

Fair point, but I'm just pointing out that a major weakness in our side was not addressed in the summer due to deals collapsing which were all but done.
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Postby wrighty (not mark!) » Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:15 am

Quite simply, as Rafa said, we're not putting our chances away, jesus christ, we've created enough of them. Let's try Cisse and Mellor. They can't possibly do any worse than Crouch and Morientes at the moment.

If we put Crouch and Morientes in the reserves for a bit, perhaps it will give them easy goals and could eventually boost their confidence. After a good run in the reserves were they are scoring, then we could put them back in the first team and hopefully they can then continue in that vein.

I wouldn't mind seeing a cisse-mellor partnership. They are both capable of goals and could compliment each other well. There is only one way to find out.
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