Liverpool FC Forum

peewee wrote:seems to me that enoch was right with his comments, i dont see any biggotry in them. seems a shame that you both shoot down architect for having a point of view but expect him to accept your point of view. its a disgrace that you accuse him of trawling 'right wing websites', do you assume that architect is not intelligent enough to form his own opinion on something. are you certain he is 'right wing' or are you just jumping down someones throat because his views dont match your views?
enoch made his speech in the 60's when times were very different, but if you look at the 'rivers of blood' speech i dont think he was far wrong.  so accuse me now of racism and bigottry.

seems a shame that anyone who expresses an opinion is labelled a racist or a biggot. its good that someone can have a view and stick to it in the face of namby pamby do gooders cricising them and calling them names. most people i know have the same views but have a fear of voicing them now because they dont want to be labled by people who can only see one point of view also.

zara stick to your 'phwoar' threads, at least there you seem to have a point to make rather than the  mindless drive you come out with when you try to act educated.

vete a la mierda, gilipollas .. 

woof woof ! wrote:

zarababe wrote:.. what f*uckin world do you live in .. Powell's speech.. for a biggot.. and which you call an 'alternative nationalist' viewpoint recognised the tensions that were simmering in communities such as his own in Wolverhampton, where communities were divided and not integrated.. the huge tension in Burnely and Oldham, which subsequently lead to the governments community cohesion and sustainable communities agenda.. reflected the break down in integration of communities and instead therein existed suspicious and divided communities.

Not sure if i understand your point here Zbabe . are you calling Powell a bigot because he "recognised the tensions that were simmering" between the indiginous population and the rapidly swelling immigrant population . ?

As for your reference to "the break down in intergration of communities " what's your take on this ? Should a soveriegn nation of people with a proud history vacate their way of life and adjust their values and traditions to accomodate a wave of what for most English people back in the 60's were foreigners , OR should the onus be on the newly arrived prospective citizens to adopt the "when in rome do as the romans do " path to intergration ? .

Speaking as a white christian male who grew up in this country duriing the 50's and early 60's I can tell you that the impact of foreign cultue upon british society was enormous and generally not welcomed .Different cultures seemed to hold different values  and immediately the seeds of distrust and suspicion were sown .
Many immigrants to this country seemed happy to retreat into a ghetto of their own ,setting up little New Delhi's , Karachi's or Kingston Jamaicas'.Is it any wonder that the native anglo population began to feel (rightly or wrongly) that area's of their cities and towns were now becoming foreign soil where in many instances they were no longer safe nor welcome ? .

Some commentators describe Enoch Powell as the greatest prime minister the british people never had , his political career was ruined by his " rivers of blood speech ". It may have been politically incorrect but  history has shown that regardless of his motives he wasn't far off the mark in predicting the consequences that mass immigration would have upon the people of this country .


ps I don't mean to dismiss the  positive effects that people of different cultures have had upon british society , but  the average man in the street would be hard pressed to list them .

yckatbjywtbiastkamb wrote:

woof woof ! wrote:

zarababe wrote:.. what f*uckin world do you live in .. Powell's speech.. for a biggot.. and which you call an 'alternative nationalist' viewpoint recognised the tensions that were simmering in communities such as his own in Wolverhampton, where communities were divided and not integrated.. the huge tension in Burnely and Oldham, which subsequently lead to the governments community cohesion and sustainable communities agenda.. reflected the break down in integration of communities and instead therein existed suspicious and divided communities.

Not sure if i understand your point here Zbabe . are you calling Powell a bigot because he "recognised the tensions that were simmering" between the indiginous population and the rapidly swelling immigrant population . ?

As for your reference to "the break down in intergration of communities " what's your take on this ? Should a soveriegn nation of people with a proud history vacate their way of life and adjust their values and traditions to accomodate a wave of what for most English people back in the 60's were foreigners , OR should the onus be on the newly arrived prospective citizens to adopt the "when in rome do as the romans do " path to intergration ? .

Speaking as a white christian male who grew up in this country duriing the 50's and early 60's I can tell you that the impact of foreign cultue upon british society was enormous and generally not welcomed .Different cultures seemed to hold different values  and immediately the seeds of distrust and suspicion were sown .
Many immigrants to this country seemed happy to retreat into a ghetto of their own ,setting up little New Delhi's , Karachi's or Kingston Jamaicas'.Is it any wonder that the native anglo population began to feel (rightly or wrongly) that area's of their cities and towns were now becoming foreign soil where in many instances they were no longer safe nor welcome ? .

Some commentators describe Enoch Powell as the greatest prime minister the british people never had , his political career was ruined by his " rivers of blood speech ". It may have been politically incorrect but  history has shown that regardless of his motives he wasn't far off the mark in predicting the consequences that mass immigration would have upon the people of this country .


ps I don't mean to dismiss the  positive effects that people of different cultures have had upon british society , but  the average man in the street would be hard pressed to list them .

i think its natural for foreigners who arrive in numbers to a foreign country to stick together, i dont think its got anything to do with any particular race or creed.
look at the large irish community around scotland road, the chinese community in chinatown and the old little italy around gerrard gardens near the city centre. and thats just a relatively small place like liverpool. massive connurbations like new york and los angeles are full of these types of foreign communities.
dont forget the british were not the best examples of a nation repecting the when in rome syndrome, every country we went to ( i`ll use that term rather than invading) we tried to change them into a mirror image of our society, just look at the gentlemens clubs in places like india. and dont forget we (big business that is, king cotton etc) invited most of the immigrants here with profit the main motive, they didnt invite us to their country`s, we just tended to turn up on their coast with a couple of divisions of gordon highlanders and the 51st foot in tow.

woof woof ! wrote:I've lived in in spain,south africa ,thailand and viet nam .Apart from the local expat pub i have never encountered anything that that remotely resembles an "English ghetto " .

Talk to me when your mum buys you some long pants .

andy_g wrote:a point that is missed by many, and yckatmby touched on, is that the historical, religious and cultural make up of many countries is and always has been in flux. us brits are a combination of french, german and dutch from a long long time back and a lot more now. 'pure blooded' englishmen (to a lesser degree the scots or welsh) are as rare as rocking horse sh.ite in this day and age. who are we too say that this constant flux must now stop and be accepted as the culture that must be protected.

it is also hypocritical in the extreme to cry about the way a tiny minority of these immigrants express anger about the way they are treated or represented in this country when we willy nilly go f.ucking with other cultures on a daily basis, economically, culturally, religiously etc etc.

i also object to people who treat liberalism as a guardian reading, sandal wearing, goody goody stereotype. its as inaccurate as the bigot stereotype of many people with more conservative or right wing views. politics is a far more complex and subtle thing like that. personally i think liberalism is a very challenging path to follow and actually has to confront dealing with difficult issues in a mutually beneficial way instead of being plain reactionary.

Believe me Andy, I didnt forget about those historic events of the past, or the lack of 'real' englishmen, and the heritage of people in this country, but thought people would go off on one etc;

It is nice to see people with such views, it makes me feel warmer inside!!!!