Liverpool FC Forum

by **66-1120597113** » Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:28 pm

Rangers and Celtic will never play in England For 2 reasons
1)The bitter secterianism between the 2 clubs is massive and there is no place for this in football,it will lower the tone and reputation of the EPL
2)The SPL would crumble without them!The smaller teams especially the newly promoted clubs would crash financially as the only time they fill theyre grounds is when 'the big 2 visit'!Also these smaller clubs would loose the money Setanta pay to televise the matches at they're grounds as its only Rangers and Celtic fans who subscribe to this channel

by **yckatbjywtbiastkamb** » Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:48 pm

BarryBelfast wrote:Rangers and Celtic will never play in England For 2 reasons
1)The bitter secterianism between the 2 clubs is massive and there is no place for this in football,it will lower the tone and reputation of the EPL
2)The SPL would crumble without them!The smaller teams especially the newly promoted clubs would crash financially as the only time they fill theyre grounds is when 'the big 2 visit'!Also these smaller clubs would loose the money Setanta pay to televise the matches at they're grounds as its only Rangers and Celtic fans who subscribe to this channel

well said baz mate

by **JBG** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:52 pm

Hol on lads.

For a start there was no trouble whatsoever between Glentoran and Shels at the actual matches, although the DUP complained that some Glentoran fan buses had some bother in Dundalk in Ireland.

I think the sectarian issue is over stated and one of the main problems is that Celtic and Rangers have no opposition in Scotland and both sets of fans are obsessed with each other. I think that if they joined up with the Premiership it would be extremely good for their fans as it will open their minds up and instead of concentrating all their energies on local rivalries, they suddenly would be coming up against 6 or 7 big clubs and that can be only good for both club and fans.

Other teams in England had problems before with racism and sectarianism, but since the 1990s most of this has died down. I think the Scottish league is sometimes stuck in the 1980s, and by joining up with the Premiership we could see a big relaxation in attitudes.

The Premiership would become a far stronger league as both Glaswegian clubs have enormous potential and within a few years they could have enormous budgets.

I would have some reservations about some of the fans, a minority though. I'm Irish and Celtic have a huge following in Ireland. The vast majority of these follow Celtic because it is seen as an Irish club as it was set up by Irish priests and has a rich Irish heritage. Many Irish immigrants in years gone by who settled in Glasgow supported the club, and many current Glaswegian Celtic supporters are 2 or 3rd generation Irish.

However, there are a few nutters, but I guess every club has them. I remember 5 years ago I used to work in a job during college. One of the guys at work was a mad Celtic supporter. He went away to the Costa del Sol for a sun holiday and came back boasting how he and a few mates bumped into some Rangers fans in a bar and absolutely creamed the lads in a bar brawl.

The guy boasted of getting "Rangers blood" all over his Hoops jersey.

The guy was a complete nutter but not indicative of your typical Celtic supporter, in my opinion. Irish Celtic supporters who make sectarian snipes at Rangers fans are being hypocritical as I wager most haven't set foot in a Church for donkey's years.

by **yckatbjywtbiastkamb** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 7:16 pm

JBG wrote:Hol on lads.

For a start there was no trouble whatsoever between Glentoran and Shels at the actual matches, although the DUP complained that some Glentoran fan buses had some bother in Dundalk in Ireland.

I think the sectarian issue is over stated and one of the main problems is that Celtic and Rangers have no opposition in Scotland and both sets of fans are obsessed with each other. I think that if they joined up with the Premiership it would be extremely good for their fans as it will open their minds up and instead of concentrating all their energies on local rivalries, they suddenly would be coming up against 6 or 7 big clubs and that can be only good for both club and fans.

Other teams in England had problems before with racism and sectarianism, but since the 1990s most of this has died down. I think the Scottish league is sometimes stuck in the 1980s, and by joining up with the Premiership we could see a big relaxation in attitudes.

The Premiership would become a far stronger league as both Glaswegian clubs have enormous potential and within a few years they could have enormous budgets.

I would have some reservations about some of the fans, a minority though. I'm Irish and Celtic have a huge following in Ireland. The vast majority of these follow Celtic because it is seen as an Irish club as it was set up by Irish priests and has a rich Irish heritage. Many Irish immigrants in years gone by who settled in Glasgow supported the club, and many current Glaswegian Celtic supporters are 2 or 3rd generation Irish.

However, there are a few nutters, but I guess every club has them. I remember 5 years ago I used to work in a job during college. One of the guys at work was a mad Celtic supporter. He went away to the Costa del Sol for a sun holiday and came back boasting how he and a few mates bumped into some Rangers fans in a bar and absolutely creamed the lads in a bar brawl.

The guy boasted of getting "Rangers blood" all over his Hoops jersey.

The guy was a complete nutter but not indicative of your typical Celtic supporter, in my opinion. Irish Celtic supporters who make sectarian snipes at Rangers fans are being hypocritical as I wager most haven't set foot in a Church for donkey's years.

when catholics start supporting rangers and protestants start supporting celtic then let them in.
it happened in liverpool after the war.

by **66-1120597113** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 7:41 pm

JBG I agree with most of what u say!It is only a minority on both sides who are bitter,yes!But it only takes a small fraction of a crowd to spark a riot!
It's unfortunate that this mentallity is present in our sport today,but certain flags and banners at old firm matches are sectarian!Not to mention the songs!
Sectarianism is racism!What about all the hard work over the last few years to kick racism out of football? Unfortunately it would be a step backwards to let Rangers and Celtic into the EPL at this moment in time!
Sincerely hope to see it some day when this minority accept all political veiws are valid! And politics and sport simply dont mix!

by **JC_81** » Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:32 pm

yckatbjywtbiastkamb wrote:
john craig wrote:
looprevil wrote:If they came to England then wouldn't that kill the SPL? there goes its two biggest teams and money makers. They should stay in Scotland and help build that league up.

Thats where you're wrong. The old firm suck the money AND talent out of the Scottish game, that league would be far better off without them. Other teams would get more of a crack at Europe also. It'll never happen though

do you honestly think any half decent player would stay in scotland if the old firm weren`t there john?
at least players like larsen and barry ferguson hung around up there for a while. the old firm is the flagship of scottish football and without them the scottish prem would just be a provincial league like wales.
do you think scottish kids growing up would rush to support motherwell or east fife if the big two were in england?
personally i dont think they would and in fact if you knew what religion the kids were you`d almost certainly know what team they`d support - thats why i dont want the old firm in england.

The point is that there AREN'T any decent players in the SPL anyway outside of the Old Firm (Controversial statement maybe, but name me one quality International class player in Scotland outside the Old Firm).

You say that the SPL would become a provincial league without the old firm, well I'm afraid it already is. Scottish football is at its lowest point EVER right now in terms of being a competitive league, and the international team is even more of a shambles right now.

I believe that if the old firm left the SPL then there would be more interest in the league, because it would be competitive again, no 1 or 2 clubs would dominate. Gates at games would not suffer either, because as is already the case, many scottish fans will support their local side as their main team, but will also follow one of the old firm teams as well. I think gates would actually go up due to increased competitiveness of the league.

Even if the setanta deal collapsed without the old firm, it would not be to a huge financial loss to the other teams as they receive a pretty small annual payout from TV anyway. I think the old firm get about 1-2 milllion a year (same as other SPL clubs) which is less money than the team finishing BOTTOM of the english premier gets from SKY.

I want to state again that I don't think the old firm will ever end up in england, but it is an absolute myth that the Old Firm are good for the SPL, other scottish teams and the scottish national game in general. Quite the opposite

by **PrestonLaaa** » Wed Jul 27, 2005 10:19 pm

Just another point, two more clubs who'd want some of your and everyone else's share from the TV money pot :pirate

, expanded to 22 clubs or kept to 20 and thus depriving more deserving English's teams of their chance of the cash and the big time! :love:

Food for thought, if they'd been in the Prem last season Liverpool would of probaly finished sixth!

(or worse)

Two more clubs who'd be after the Champions League places! Now I'm against them joining the EPL but they might make it a bit more competetive if they did by depriving EPL sides of CL places or places in the UEFA cup! :sleep

Premier League Chairmen voting them in/Turkey's voting for Christmas? :talktothehand

by **66-1120597113** » Wed Jul 27, 2005 10:32 pm

PrestonLaaa wrote:Just another point, two more clubs who'd want some of your and everyone else's share from the TV money pot , expanded to 22 clubs or kept to 20 and thus depriving more deserving English's teams of their chance of the cash and the big time!

Food for thought, if they'd been in the Prem last season Liverpool would of probaly finished sixth! (or worse)

Two more clubs who'd be after the Champions League places! Now I'm against them joining the EPL but they might make it a bit more competetive if they did by depriving EPL sides of CL places or places in the UEFA cup!

Premier League Chairmen voting them in/Turkey's voting for Christmas?

Bullsh-t mate!
Rangers and Celtic would be lucky to finish mid table!Do you ever watch Scottish football??

by **Garymac** » Wed Jul 27, 2005 10:49 pm

Just one point in this thread as Celtic played there 1st game under strachan in a Champ League qualifier.......

Artmedia 5-0 Celtic

Im expecting a big push for both to join after this season!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is f*cking embarrasing

by **PrestonLaaa** » Thu Jul 28, 2005 12:12 am

BarryBelfast wrote:Bullsh-t mate!
Rangers and Celtic would be lucky to finish mid table!Do you ever watch Scottish football??

It's not a point of where they both finished in the SPL because that League is sh*te, but if they were both in the EPL they then would both of been able to attract a better class of player by simply being in the EPL and therefore while The Reds struggled to finish 4th while going on to win the Champions League what would of stopped two clubs who attract over 50,000 each at home, being on equal footing on TV payments and not having the distraction of playing in Europe, being able to finish above Liverpool! :bump

Everton did it after all on a smaller budget!!!

:sniffle

Anyway the other point I made was that if they did finish mid table they'd deprive two more deserving English teams of those places but with a name like BarryBelfast I guess you choose to skim over them, be ya Green or Blue! :sleep

by **Afroman** » Thu Jul 28, 2005 12:43 am

How come Cardiff,Swansea, and Wrexham all play in the nationwide leagues even tho they're welsh

by **neil** » Thu Jul 28, 2005 1:41 pm

after seeing Celtic humbled 5-0 by some backwater minnow,I imagine the jocks will stop trying join our league now.Shocking football.

by **El Nino_#9** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 4:08 pm

give them a break, they did pull it back to 5-4 on agg!
but still i wouldn't have neither team in the epl.
thats why there scottish! dur!

by **PrestonLaaa** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 5:49 pm

Afroman wrote:nationwide leagues

Nice to see some people keep up to speed with life outside the Prem :suspect:

by **neil** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:00 pm

passmeistro_#14 wrote:thats why there scottish! dur!

the irony is not lost on me

It should be 'they're' :Oo:

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