Liverpool FC Forum

by **RED ANT** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 11:33 pm

Calling all the spanish league followers. Did Rafa use wingers at Valencia when he was there? I know Vicente is a wide man but how was he deployed?

I ask because we don't seem to be in the market for any (maybe Zendon? but i could only see him as a squad player) and it seemed widely reported that we would be after at least 2 wide men this summer.

Names like Joaquin have been banded about but i think they were always just hopeful signings rather then realistic ones although it would be nice :cool:

Last season we never really seemed to play with a great deal of width but at times you felt that Rafa was trying to get the midfielders to stay wider then they were. With the right fullbacks you can get plenty of width without having to employ wingers hence the names of Evra & Miguel have been mentioned when you'd think we don't really need fullbacks at the moment.

by **XSD** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 11:36 pm

Rafa was a big fan on playing in wide areas at Valencia and they were very effective using wingers.
I think he wants the same at Liverpool, and look how much he has helped john arne riise...we have no real right winger though so have put luis garcia there and he's been alright.
Benitez obviously would have liked Harry Kewell to have been on form and staying fit, and we would have seen a much better liverpool side last season, but I'm sure he will work something out.

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:09 pm

Rafa played with wingers at valencia because he happened to have a few good ones. He is a coach who prefers to pick the system to suit his players rather than the other way around.

I honestly think there will not be much improvement on our league form next year however, if we don't invest in a few wingers, or at least one. I have a feeling Rafa is banking on kewell coming good next season, he obviously rates kewell after starting him in 2 cup finals despite him not being totally fit. I can see Zenden signing also, but along with Riise and Kewell, he is also left sided.

As for the right, I don't know whats gonna happen. Garcia is better centrally so i don't see him as a long term solution there. I don't see SWP or joaquin signing realistically. Its a problem area. We should have taken pennant for 2 mil, he'd have been a good signing IMO

by **Red Indian** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:13 pm

True Pennant would have been good. Can't see much else out there apart from Joaquin & SWP, they may be unrealistic targets but we don't know until we make bids.

by **andy_g** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:25 pm

i guess he must also see potential in nunez. stranger things have happened in football...

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:37 pm

andy_g wrote:i guess he must also see potential in nunez. stranger things have happened in football...

Nunez was a strange signing the more i think about it

He just doesn't look like a winger at all to me - doesn't seem to have particulrly quick feet, hasn't got great pace. I just don't know.

Surprisingly he looks quite decent in the air and isn't afraid to stick the boot in when he needs to, maybe he could take over from biscan in providing cover in the centre. Might be worth trying in pre-season.

You never know i suppose, he has had a few niggling injuries since signing. I'd keep him for next season and if he's still sh.ite then punt him next summer. Its a bit too early to write him off completely.

by **andy_g** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:49 pm

agreed. funny you should mention igor though, i've often felt that nunez has a similar bewildered look about him on the pitch. he's shown glimpses of being able to nip down the wing and ping a ball in, not of the highest quality so far but there's obviously a little of the wingers instinct. he can obviously deal with the premiership physicality as you pointed out, but we'll have to wait and see if he has the skill.

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:02 pm

andy_g wrote:agreed. funny you should mention igor though, i've often felt that nunez has a similar bewildered look about him on the pitch. he's shown glimpses of being able to nip down the wing and ping a ball in, not of the highest quality so far but there's obviously a little of the wingers instinct. he can obviously deal with the premiership physicality as you pointed out, but we'll have to wait and see if he has the skill.

aye i suppose nunez does have a bit of a dopey look about him :laugh:

I guess it didn't help last season that we often only played with baros up top who doesn't seem to challenge for crosses. In the few games that nunez and morientes played together, it looked like it could be quite effective with nunez playing in the crosses for morientes.

Don't think nunez is ever gonna be a robben or duff when it comes to wing play though. I reckon the best we can hope for nunez is a reliable squad player, like Biscan became last season

by **andy_g** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:09 pm

he's got squad player written all over him. but any minute now someone's going to shout up 'yeah, but remember pires/henry/whoever...!' actaully i'd love that to come true - nunez suddenly blossoms into a blinding player, but i ain't holding me breath.

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 7:35 pm

I was just thinking there, what about going for Van der Meyde for the right side?

Inter are wanting rid of him as he hasn't really settled in serie A. He's got pace to burn and I've been pretty impressed with him when I've seen him play in the past. He'd probably be available for a couple of mil. Wonder if Rafa has looked at him.

I remember another dutch player who was disappointing at Inter and went on to be a superstar in the premiership for arsenal...

Henry is another one who didn't quite settle in Italy and the rest is history.

Before anyone jumps down my throat, this is not a rumour, i have not read anywhere that we are linked with van der meyde, it is only a suggestion

by **RED ANT** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 8:42 pm

Thats my point though , if any of what you read or hear is to be believed we seem to be being linked with more central attacking players this summer as opposed to wingers.

Aimar, Guti and a few others spring to mind . i know that people on here say that we couldn't accomodate these sort of players into our team but with the right sort of full backs (which we are also said to be interested in) we could.

I.E

Dudek

Finnan Carragher Hyypia Troure

Gerrard Alonso Riise

Morientes Garcia

Cisse

I've only used players we already have to show what i meant but don't you think this could be the way Rafa wants us to play.

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 9:02 pm

RED ANT wrote:Thats my point though , if any of what you read or hear is to be believed we seem to be being linked with more central attacking players this summer as opposed to wingers.

Aimar, Guti and a few others spring to mind . i know that people on here say that we couldn't accomodate these sort of players into our team but with the right sort of full backs (which we are also said to be interested in) we could.

I.E

Dudek

Finnan Carragher Hyypia Troure

Gerrard Alonso Riise

Morientes Garcia

Cisse

I've only used players we already have to show what i meant but don't you think this could be the way Rafa wants us to play.

I see what you're saying mate but i doubt it

History tells you that you need good attacking wide men to win the premiership. No team has won the prem without good wingers.

Man U - Giggs, Kanchelskis, Beckham, and they have got the makings of a good one in Ronaldo too

Blackburn - Ripley and Wilcox had a great season pinging them in for Shearer

Arsenal - Overmars was their best player when they won the league a few years back, now they have pires and ljungberg

Chelsea - Duff and Robben top class

We have a potential top drawer winger in Kewell if he ever gets his act together, only time will tell. But we badly need to get a good right winger

I don't agree that if you have good enough full backs then it compensates for not having good wingers. In europe and in serie A where the football is more tactical you don't necessarily need great width, but the faster-paced english prem is all about exploiting space, and you need good wingers to do this effectively.

We have struggled for years with teams all-out defending against us and we can't break them down because we try and play everything through the middle. This needs sorted out for next season

by **RED ANT** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 10:11 pm

Couldn't agree more , that's why i started this topic. Just thought that maybe this is the way we might be playing as opposed to how i think we should be playing.

Not that i'm anyone to question Rafas plans and maybe we are looking at buying wide players. I hope so.

If Kewell came good it would be a huge bonus to us as on his day he's as good as anything in our league. Just hasn't shown it for a while.

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 10:52 pm

RED ANT wrote:Couldn't agree more , that's why i started this topic. Just thought that maybe this is the way we might be playing as opposed to how i think we should be playing.

Not that i'm anyone to question Rafas plans and maybe we are looking at buying wide players. I hope so.

If Kewell came good it would be a huge bonus to us as on his day he's as good as anything in our league. Just hasn't shown it for a while.

Aye, I would have expected Rafa to be in the market for a winger by now myself, but as you say, who are we to question him? He did win us the champions league after all

by **JC_81** » Sun Jun 26, 2005 4:24 pm

KopTalk are running a story that Rafa is signing right winger Stelios Giannokopolis from Bolton. He's almost 31 but scored 8 in 38 games for Bolton last season. Not sure about this myself, not really the quality I was hoping Rafa would go for, but I suppose it could be bollox anyway.

I suppose this could go in the rumour thread, but f**k it, no one reads that anyway, and this does open up the debate again as to whether Rafa is gonna bring in some wide players which we badly need

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