Liverpool FC Forum

by **Leonmc0708** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:42 pm

There has been plenty spoken and written about our entry into and inclusion in the Champions League for next season, by Liverpool fans and other teams' supporters. I do, for what its worth, think its an excellent result for us.

If you would have told me 3 weeks ago (Saturday 21sy May) that in three weeks time we would be Champions of Europe and back in the competition (the league was over and Everton had been nominated as the FA's representative), I would have bitten your body off never mind your bloody hand.

Fan's of other clubs who are unhappy at our entry and so called special treatment, people who say the rules are rules, well your argument against our entry does not hold up. There weren't any defined and clear cut rules, just cop-out clauses which relied on others to take responsibility, the same rules that have seen the FA look like planks and made UEFA perform an almighty about turn.

Evertonians, (its only blues who have publiclly bemoaned our entry on the grounds of money) who feel they may lose out on a couple of million quid with the rules on shareing pots of money, I have three things to ask:

1) Is the depth of your ambition in the Champions League money making?

2) If the suits at the FA had followed the only precedent, which was set by Spain when Real Madrid won the cup yet finished fifth, would you be happy in the UEFA Cup now?

3) If you had won the Europen Cup (I know its hard but use every ounce of imagination you have) and finished outside the qualification places for the competition, should you be allowed to defend the title?

Liverpool fans, like some member on here, who feel cheated because the reiging Champions of Europe (never tire of saying that) are required to qualify from the very begining and enter the first-round stage, meaning they must play a few extra games in July. You too are wrong. If some of our players had bothered to turn up for a few of the games in March and April like St Marys and Palace away, Liverpool would not be in this predicament.

Everyone who has moaned should realise that for the first time ever, despite constant warning that it would not happen, one country has five teams in Europe's premier club competition. And that country is England.

Fitting in some way that some twenty years after we were booted out of all continental football and treated like lepers by the rest of Europe, it is through Liverpool Football Club that this should happen.

Anyway rant over and back onto the reason for this thread. I wanted to take a look at the possible opponents in the first round of qualifying for the Champions League. So here go's:

Kazakhstan League Champions Kairat Almaty

Official Kairat Almaty Website

Apparently Kazakhstan is a country of west-central Asia south of Russia and northeast of the Caspian Sea. The original Turkic inhabitants were overrun by the Mongols in the 13th century and ruled by various khanates until the Russian conquest of 1730 to 1853. The region became an autonomous republic of the USSR in 1920 and was a constituent republic from 1936 to 1991, when it gained its independence. Astana is the capital and Almaty the largest city.
Population: 17,027,000.
Champions of Kazakhstan in 1992, 2004 and 2005.
Kazakhstan Cup Winners in 1992, 1996, 1999, 2001 and 2003.

Faroe Island League Champions HB Tórshavn

Official HB Torshavn Website

Apparently they come from the capital of the Faeroe Islands, on southeast Straymoy Island. It is a major port and shipping center. Population: 14,671.
Sorry no other info as unsure on their language.

Azerbaijan Champions PFC Neftchi

Official PFC Neftchi Website

Apparently a country of Transcaucasia north of Iran. It constitutes the northern part of the historical region of Azerbaijan, which was ceded to Russia by Persia in 1813 and 1828. It was a constituent republic of the USSR, known as the Azerbaijan Soviet Socialist Republic, from 1936 to 1991. Baku is the capital. Population: 7,472,000.
Last time they came close to entering the Champions League group phase they faced better known CSKA Moscow in August 2004, and where subsequently beaten 2-0 in the second qualifying round. CSKA went on to beat Glasgow Rangers and qualify for the group phase.

Luxembourg League Champions F91 Dudelange

Official F91 Dudelange Website

Apparently on Sunday 29th May 2005, F91 Dudelange secured their fourth Luxembourg First Division title in six years with a 1-0 victory against FC Victoria Rosport in the penultimate game of the season.

Estonian League Champions FC Levadia Tallinn

Official FC Levadia Tallinn Website

Apparently on the 18th May FC Levadia Tallinn regained the Estonian Cup after a last-gasp header from Vitali Leitan finally broke ten-man FC TVMK Tallinn's stubborn resistance to earn a slender one-goal win at the Kadriorg stadium.

Northern Irish League Winners Glentoran FC

Official Glentoran Website

Apparently Jody Tolan put pen to paper recently to seal a deal that will see him play at the Oval for the next three seasons. At the same time Mark Glendinning and Darren Lockhart signed extended contracts. Good news for Glentoran fans I am reliably informed.

Albanian League Champions KF Tirana

Official KF Tirana Website (English Version)

Apparently the 20 times Albanian champions have won the league title three times in a row on three seperate occasion, 1930-32, 1934-37 and most recently 1995-97. Easily beaten by Ajax (1970) and Bayern Munich (1989) they are yet to feature in the group stages since the revised format.

League of Wales Champions Total Network Solutions FC

Official T N S Website

Apparently they offered Liverpool the chance of a play off over two legs should they be refused entry to the competition by UEFA. They also play Northern Irish Champions Glentoran in a pre season friendly at Treflan on Saturday 2nd July. Rafa take note.

Armenian Champions FC Pyunik

Official FC Pyunik Website

Apparently FC Pyunik's quest for a fifth straight Armenian Premier League title got off to the best possible start - but their Armenian Cup dream ended at the quarter-final stage in April.

Irish League Champions Shelbourne FC

Official Shalbourne Website

Apparently Shelbourne where recently granted an official UEFA Club Licence meaning they can now play under floodlights in European games. They completed a hatrick of Irish League titles this year.

Maltese League Champions Sliema Wanderers FC

Official Sliema Wanderers Website

Apparently Sliema Wanderers were officially founded in 1909 although the first game by the Wanderers was played on the 3rd October 1908 against St George's in the Boys Junior football league for Under 21 teams. Sliema had a number of English players and supporters since Sliema was one of the main harbours for the English fleet in the Mediterranean. It seems that most of these Englishmen supported Bolton Wanderers or Wolverhampton Wanderers and from there, Sliema got the name Sliema Wanderers.

Icelandic League Champions FH Hafnarfjördur

Official Hafnarfjordur Website

Apparently Champions FH Hafnarfjördur top the Icelandic league after four games, but newcomers Valur Reykjavík are matching them point for point.

Belarusian League Champions FC Dinamo Minsk

Official Dinamo Minsk Website

There are just few clubs in Former Soviet Union with such complicated history, as "Dinamo" Minsk. There are many pages in the history of this outstanding team, though there were also bitter times of long failures. Playing in premier league of the USSR championship since 1945, football players from Minsk six times were kicked out to the lower league and six times they came back again. Previous European Cup quarter final appearence in the 1984-85 season and quarter finals in the Cup Winners Cup and UEFA cup in the 1980's.

Lithuanian ChampionsFBK Kaunas

Official FBK Kaunas Website

Apparently on 12th April this year Five months after FBK Kaunas won their sixth successive Lithuanian First Division title, the 2005 season began and runs until 12 November with Kaunas chasing an unprecedented 7th on the bounce.

Macedonian League Champions FK Rabotnicki

Official FK Rabotnicki Website

Apparently on Monday 9th May 2005, the day after our embarrasing defeat at Highbury, FK Rabotnicki where crowned champions of F.Y.R. Macedonia for the first time with four rounds of matches in the Macedonian First League still to play.

Georgian League Winners FC Dinamo Tbilisi

Official Dinamo Tbilisi Website

Apparently The history of FC Dinamo Tbilisi begun from the autumn of 1925. Management of the sports society of Dinamo set out to form football club. In those days football was gradually becoming one of the most popular sports in the world.
Numerous European level players have starred in Dinamo. In the 30s this was Boris Paichadze who was one of the best forwards of the continent. During the tour through Romania he was titled "Football Caruso". His name later was been given to the National Stadium.
Previous European experience includes a Cup Winners Cup Triumph in 1981, and are 12 times league winners at home.

Bosnia and Herzgovenia's League Winners NK Zrinjski

UN Official NK Zrinjski Website

Apparently first time league winners NK Zrinjski are well prepared for their first foray into Europes top club competition. Zrinjski's nearest rivals NK Željeznicar fell too far off the pace after drawing with FK Sarajevo and losing at NK Travnik. Zrinjski meanwhile defeated NK Široki Brijeg and NK Orašje to open up an unassailable eleven-point advantage and seal the championship with three games remaining.
The title celebrations were even more meaningful as it is the 100th year since football first arrived in the country in Mostar - the hometown of the newly crowned title winners.

Finnish League Winners FC Haka

Official FC Haka Website

Finnish minnows Haka are 9 times league winners and 11 times domestic cup competition winners.

Latvian League Winners FC Skonto

Official Skonto Website

Apparently FC Skonto, hailing from Latvian town of Riga have claimed the last 14 Latvian titles but the 2005 season is expected to be the most exciting yet.

Moldovan League Champions FC Sheriff

Official FC Sheriff Website

Apparently last league season, FC Sheriff secured their fifth league title in Moldova, returning to winning ways having secured three on the spin before the barren 2004 season.

Champions Of Cyprus Anorthosis Famagusta FC

Official Anorthosis Famagusta FC Website

Anorthosis Famagusta FC secured their 12th Cypriot league title with a 2-0 victory at Nea Salamis FC. Anorthosis were virtually written off at the start of the season because of financial problems, but in player-manager and 16-goal leading scorer and former Newcastle United international Ketsbaia they have found their inspiration.

Slovenian League Champions NK Gorica

Official NK Gorica Website

Apparently last season's run to the UEFA Champions League third qualifying round, meant they were in great shape going into the season and managed to maintain their form and togetherness throughout the campaign. Despite one short run of uncertain results, they left the rest with little hope of ending their First League reign. Their pole position was assured by a 1-0 win at Publikum on 14 May.

Slovakian SuperLeague Winners either FC Artmedia Bratislava OR MŠK Žilina

Official FC Artmedia Bratislava Website
Official MSK Zilina Website

Apparently the only possible opponent in the first qualifying round yet to be confirmed is in the Slovakian league with either FC Artmedia Bratislava or MŠK Žilina set to take the final place. The Slovakian league culminates on the 15th June, and currently FC Artmedia Bratislava have a 6 point cushion having played the same number of games as MŠK Žilina who have a +5 goal difference ontheir fierce rivals. One win for FC Artmedia Bratislava in the final two games secures them the spot.

by **Scottbot** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 9:16 pm

Leonmc0708 wrote:If you would have told me 3 weeks ago (Saturday 21sy May) that in three weeks time we would be Champions of Europe and back in the competition (the league was over and Everton had been nominated as the FA's representative), I would have bitten your body off never mind your bloody hand.

Same here - I'm just delighted to be back in. Sure it's thrown pre-season into a bit of a mess and puts a bit of pressure on Rafa in that he now has to move swiftly in the transfer market but who cares. We're back in the world's premier club competition.

The thought of playing in what is now a Mickey Mouse UEFA Cup doesn't excite anyone.

As for the bitters whinging on about sharing Champs League money. Maybe it's better they keep quiet untill they have secured qualification + I can remember their manager saying we should have the right to defend the trophy should we win it.

by **Eazy-E** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:03 pm

Is there a possibility we could meet United or Everton in the qualifiers. And since we have no English protection does that count for the Champ Lge proper.

by **neilE** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:07 pm

thanks for the info - and nicely balanced argument. Personally if 1st round qualifying is all we're offered then fair enough - they've bent the rules to do it, even though there should never have been a rule like it. The UEFA site says it won't happen again because they will prevent the 4th place team from going into the CL - they are determined that no more than 4 teams from each country will play. My problem from an LFC perspective only is that it will make it harder for us to win anything next season, not just because of the extra games, but because the squad will have to be signed and fit much earlier than normal. Perhaps all the arguments about "rumour threads" will stop, because we'll have to actually buy players soon.................

by **Scottbot** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:18 pm

Eazy-E wrote:Is there a possibility we could meet United or Everton in the qualifiers. And since we have no English protection does that count for the Champ Lge proper.

We could meet the bitters in the 3rd round qualifier (i'm thinking of checking the odds at the bookies for that one). We can't meet the mancs as they are also seeded for the qualifiers.

If we make it to the group stage we could draw chelsea or arsenal. UEFA are basically viewing LFC as a team with no nationality!!!

Not sure what happens if we get to the last 16 (do we get our English status bavck at this point?)

Also not sure what happens if either the mancs/bitters lose in the qualifiers. Maybe then we would again regain English status as there would be 4 (or less) teams in the competition once again.

It's all pretty complicated.

by **anchor man** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:32 pm

Leon tks for the info some bit of research there fair play.

I think certain things are being blown out of proportion, to play 6 extra qualifying games is not the end of the world, all it means is re-desigining the way our pre season is put together.

The players are due back in plenty of time to get sharp and pending on the draw we will field a strong team in game 1 wether it b home or away go for a big result and then rest players in game 2, the same should apply in 2nd qualifying round.

Then its the 3rd round proper where we could face everton (same would apply strong team, big score then weakened team, only joking toffees!!)

With some quality added giving some strength in depth rafa can choose to leave carra, gerrard etc out for a game or two consecutively giving them the break they need, i remember fergie doing that to a couple of players over a xmas period a few years back, they even went on jollydays for a week.

I think over the next 2 weeks or so 2-3 players will be confirmed but because we start early doesnt mean there wont be any further additions later in the month.

by **policy** » Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:42 pm

As to the "Who", I think that Rafa needs to get at least a good handful of players.

Like others I share the worry that the squad will suffer if overextended into playing many games. But as long as we have a lot of players who can rotate, I think that this next season will be freakin' awesome.

I am glad that Scott posted that info about us not having an official "nationality". It will be interesting if we have to face Everton early and knock them on their ar$e.

by **Pablo_Escobar** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:30 am

Great analysis Leon, but 1st qualifiers should be a test play. No worries there.

by **Starbridge42** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:27 am

Yeah its still two legs so I say give the new boys and the kids their chance in the first qualifying round. After all if the first leg goes pear-shaped (still very unlikely) we can always bring back the stars to make sure of qualification in the second leg.

by **XSD** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:36 am

Scottbot wrote:
Eazy-E wrote:Is there a possibility we could meet United or Everton in the qualifiers. And since we have no English protection does that count for the Champ Lge proper.

We could meet the bitters in the 3rd round qualifier (i'm thinking of checking the odds at the bookies for that one). We can't meet the mancs as they are also seeded for the qualifiers.

If we make it to the group stage we could draw chelsea or arsenal. UEFA are basically viewing LFC as a team with no nationality!!!

Not sure what happens if we get to the last 16 (do we get our English status bavck at this point?)

Also not sure what happens if either the mancs/bitters lose in the qualifiers. Maybe then we would again regain English status as there would be 4 (or less) teams in the competition once again.

It's all pretty complicated.

We could only face Everton or Chelsea in group stages, not arsenal because they are top seeds.

by **neilE** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 12:34 pm

I've read today that we have to name our squad for the 1st rnd by 6 Jul. It's true that any LFC squad should be good enough for the 1st round - but does anyone know if we're allowed to add to the squad for the 2nd & 3rd rounds?

by **Eazy-E** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:34 pm

Good question. When we played Graz AK we did'nt have Alonso or Garcia at that time. We bought them later. So we probably will be able to buy after the 1st round still.

by **Eazy-E** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:36 pm

This could also decide who's leaving and who is not. Baros might stay as well as Kewell.

by **laza** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:39 pm

Do these early rounds also cup tie players as it may prove a problem if we want to offload someone later on who we had no choice but to use in these qualfiers

by **jonnymac1979** » Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:48 pm

Yes, the players would be cup-tied.

That's one of the reasons why we need to tie up Gerrard sooner rather than later on a new long term deal, because if the negotiations with him break down over the next few weeks, and we play him in the qualifying rounds, he will be cup tied, and you can say goodbye to the £35 million valuation.

Who out of all the teams interested in him would pay £35 million for a player who can't play in the Champions League? We can't let him leave for nothing in two years so we would have to dramatically reduce his valuation in order to sell him.

This is only if he doesn't sign the contract of course, which I'm convinced he will, but the same goes for the rest of the players. If we had to play Baros in a qualifier, would Lyon still pay £7 million for him?

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