Liverpool FC Forum

by **stmichael** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:15 pm

To me, two games over the past three days have just re-affirmed how far behind the elite we are at the moment. Ok we pick up the odd good result but our level of consistency is nothing short of shocking. Last night just proved how lacking the majority of our players are when it comes to the basics of the game, i.e. passing and controlling the ball and moving into space. I lost count of the number of times baros, traore, kewell and hamann miscontrolled the ball.

The arsenal-chelsea game was the prime example of how the game should be played. It was played at such an unbelievable pace and EVERY SINGLE PLAYER was comfortable on the ball. The passing and movement was also phenomenal. I was actually quite impressed with the speed of the passing last night until I realised very early how inneffectual it was and was wondering why.

The passing was slick but did not draw one Portsmouth player out of position. One of the reasons for this was the distance the ball was travelling and usually direct to within a foot of a Liverpool player. The passes also never drew the defence forward or the midfield players into the box which resulted usually in a final pass to Milan or Stevie in dangerous areas around the box with not one Liverpool player within 30 or so yards of them.

Also so few players made any movement after their making a pass it started to resemble a passionless practice game.
Having had doubts about Garcia earlier, I'm now starting to see what a loss he is to us now, with nobody trying to be inventive or adventurous. Maybe we're not short of forwards, but really still lacking in intelligent movement and genuine playmakers.

Oh well, I suppose we could have worse fixtures than newcastle, who's own situation seem like everything is rosy. It really is a must win game.

by **bigmick** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:11 pm

Its all confidence St Mike. Stick one of our team into Arsenal and Chelskis line-up, give em a couple of weeks to get used to winning 3-0 all the time and they would look like world-beaters. Look at Arsenal six weeks back, 49 games unbeaten and playing what most of us described as being the most fluent and beautiful football we had ever seen. They lose one and the doubts creep in, confidence ebbs away and they suddenly look mortal again. We are defo' going through a sticky patch but our blokes aren't as bad as they look, well not all of 'em anyway.

by **stmichael** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:17 pm

i agree with you mick. the fact of the matter is, players can't gain confidence when they're constantly in and out of the team. we have our most important result of the season against olympiakos and everyones confidence should have been sky high. so what does benitez do? makes 5 changes for the everton game. he then made SIX last night. i know it's a squad game but you gain no continuity or understanding when you keep chopping and changing personnel.

by **100-1102639321** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:38 pm

stmichael wrote:i agree with you mick. the fact of the matter is, players can't gain confidence when they're constantly in and out of the team. we have our most important result of the season against olympiakos and everyones confidence should have been sky high. so what does benitez do? makes 5 changes for the everton game. he then made SIX last night. i know it's a squad game but you gain no continuity or understanding when you keep chopping and changing personnel.

especiallychanging the goalkeeper, its unsettling to the defense. to be fair to liverpool, portsmouth played for the draw.

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:45 pm

although i agree St Mike, our basics are of a better level than they were.

the first thing i ever learned in football, from my schoolteaher, was that when you pass to someone, you pass a yard or two in front of them, becoz, as they're running, they'll receive it at their feet by the time it gets there. plain obvious, i know.

but...under Houllier, we seemed to have forgotten that first rule. the passes were always behind the players, causing them to slow down, or stop, by the time they reached the ball (mainly when knocking it around the back four and in midfield). this is one of the reasons we had no fluency, urgency, and panache. our moves seemed incredibly laboured and oppositions could get all their men behind the ball before we even got it into their half.

this has changed with benitez. although the general control of the ball and type of pass that you're talking about isnt really there (more apparent last night than most other home games), i think we can all agree that we look well more fluent, especially when we play good. and tend to scare teams a bit more.

i'm with you on the Garcia thing aswell. when he plays at home and we take the game to a team, he is the vital link. no-one else in the squad can do what he does.maybe we need another player like that or at least some players who can move a football round the pitch a bit better, and also control it better.

by **stmichael** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:50 pm

jim_morrison_supported_liverpool wrote:our basics are of a better level than they were.

yeah possibly jim. players can only improve by learning from the likes of garcia, alonso and gerrard who are exceptionally gifted technically. even in a completely abject display last night, i thought alonso was exceptional. he just never gives the ball away. it's just frustrating when you see players who are being paid a fortune unable to control a ball properly, kewell and baros to name two.

by **parchpea** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:59 pm

If the Chelsea lads where playing in Liverpool red you would see better technical football. Its all about the players. At the moment we just cannot play at that level because we dont have the same class of player on our books.

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:38 pm

parchpea wrote:Its all about the players. At the moment we just cannot play at that level because we dont have the same class of player on our books.

it is mainly down to that. you know, i cant disagree with you.
but even some players that were there under Houllier now look a little more fluent, as his methods seem to be "move the ball around quicker" etc etc.
but if the players were better, the football would be better, thats obvious.

by **parchpea** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:18 pm

I agree we are playing a better brand of football and lads that struggle to play this way are trying but its unfortunate they aint good enough. Houllier liked big athletic physical players but sadly they lacked technical ability. Under Houlliers style it did not matter so much, but it does now. They are found out trying to play fast football to feet. Its going to take a while but its certainly easier on the eye. Its all about patience again, but its so tough lol kinda sick of waiting as we all are. We just have to hang in there.

by **Woollyback** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:22 pm

Patience is the key. Rafa has shown he's got what it takes tactically and also in terms of man-management. He's had pretty much no time to adapt to the prem and has had to deal with the last-minute departure of Owen, Cisse out for the season and a million and one other injuries

If we play our cards right in the January sales then we can come on leaps & bounds in the 2nd half of the season, then build on that next season.

In Rafa we Trust

by **A.B.** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:20 pm

i agree with you mick. the fact of the matter is, players can't gain confidence when they're constantly in and out of the team. we have our most important result of the season against olympiakos and everyones confidence should have been sky high. so what does benitez do? makes 5 changes for the everton game. he then made SIX last night. i know it's a squad game but you gain no continuity or understanding when you keep chopping and changing personnel

How often do you read what Benitez says after a game?

Let me summarize it to you. At the very beginning of the season Benitez said he was going to use all players he has. He also said that he was going to give players chances to prove themselves to him. And you can not expect players to play all games or play 3 games in a week at their best form. Why do you think Riise was on the bench? He was on the bench because he was tired. Why was Alonso on the bench against Everton? Tired.

We have to use what we have.

by **100-1102639321** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:22 pm

the squad is a bit depleted at the moment, he is doing quite well with the players we are stuck with.

i hate houllier

by **azriahmad** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 1:28 am

the squad is a bit depleted at the moment, he is doing quite well with the players we are stuck with.

i hate houllier

LOL...this summarises why we are in such a predicament right now.

Houllier was so lucky that Moores had been so very loyal to him that he was allowed to buy lemons and wasted millions and given way too much time on the job with the final contract extension which in the end cost Liverpool some 10 million just to get rid of him yet will take so much more time and money to get rid of the rot.

Poor Mr Benithez is having his hands full with no funds and a big bunch of lemons to pick every week (except Gerrard, Carra, Hamann, most of the players Benithez inherited are average - Hyppia is in decline. Most of the lemons are either due to being unsuited to the EPL or due to a lack of commitment and desire has become lemons).

We seriously need new funds and Moores is also to blame for the malaise Liverpool is presently in. It will take some time and I hope it will not be too long a time, for Liverpool to become a major force in England again.

by **ssss** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 2:38 am

Agreed that moores shares as much blame as houllier.

Rafa needs time, money and trust from us supporters. I never liked houllier, even from the start, even when we won the treble...

Especially when we won the treble, though I was so happy, deep inside I knew something was not right and Ive talked to many LFC supporters who do feel the same and the very problem was the type of football that we played...

You will never built a great side playing that kind of football..yes, there are the famous Italian teams of the past (Inter) who won titles after titles playing that brand of football..but question is, is that the Liverpool way?Is that what we want?

I dont know about everyone else, but I certainly enjoy watching LFC matches now..though it is extremely frustrating watching how pathetic our finishing and final ball is..a dn of cos the way our keepers constantly let in 'soft' goals...grrr :alien:

ANyway..i'm trying to be patient..patient..patient....

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The basics of the game - Sadly lacking

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